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Thread: The Catching Problem

  1. #1
    Member Tom Servo's Avatar
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    The Catching Problem

    The general consensus among Reds fans is that while David Ross plays some fine defense his bat only hurts the Reds, while Javy Valentin can hit alright but can't field to save his life. So if you're Wayne Krivsky what do you do about our catchers in the offseason? Do you stick with what we have, trade for someone, or sign one of the many catchers available?

    Here is the list of catchers available in free agency:

    Brad Ausmus
    Michael Barrett
    Ramon Castro
    Jason Kendall
    Paul Lo Duca
    Jorge Posada
    Jose Molina
    Ivan Rodriguez - $13MM club option for '08
    Yorvit Torrealba
    "Since I've been with the Reds in 1989, we've never had a farm system this loaded," Bowden said. "If we were the New York Yankees and had unlimited dollars, we could have traded for Colon, (Jeff) Weaver, Rolen, (Cliff) Floyd, (Kenny) Rogers and Finley and gotten them all -- and still held onto our top five prospects. That's an amazing statement."

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  3. #2
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: The Catching Problem

    I'd prefer a deal with the Mariners to get Clement. He is stuck behind Johjima.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

  4. #3
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: The Catching Problem

    Ross's offensive problems were more attributable to bad luck and regression to the mean (of his true ability) than any real decline in ability.

    In 2007, he had a ridiculous .230 BABIP despite a very reasonable 18.5 LD% (an improvement over 2006's 16.8%). No more player with more than 200 PA (Ross had 348) was worse. The lowest BABIP among qualified hitters was Ray Durham at .244.

    If we bump up that .230 BABIP to a more reasonable .280, he's suddenly hitting .235/.305/.450 or so. Still not great, but a .750 OPS from a plus defending catcher is an asset. His 2006 HR/FB rate of 23.9% is wholly unsustainable and the drop of HR can account for the drop in BA in to the .230s from 2006's .255. Ross is basically Jason LaRue v2.0 with a touch more power right down to the late start of his career, good arm, low batting averages, etc.

    So long as he's cheap he's worth keeping around and is a decent primary catcher. Spending money on anybody on the list besides Posada and possibly Barrett (neither of whom is stellar defensively) would represent a waste of money.
    Last edited by RedsManRick; 10-01-2007 at 06:17 PM.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  5. #4
    Danger is my business! oneupper's Avatar
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    Re: The Catching Problem

    Ross did have a .761 OPS vs. Lefties (.248/.291/.470).
    As a platoon player, he may not hurt too much.
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    Designated Threadkiller LincolnparkRed's Avatar
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    Re: The Catching Problem

    What do you think Posada would fetch? And would the Yankees let him walk?
    Climbing down from the bridge, but keeping the torch lit until Dusty's fate is settled

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    Re: The Catching Problem

    Face it! Catching is not a big offensive position and you will get some HRs from him while you get great defense. Javy can be a plug against rightys and both can stay fresh platooning. For the money hang with them and just get some pitching. None of those names impress me and the ones that do are too expensive.
    And This One Belongs to the REDS!!!

  8. #7
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: The Catching Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by flyer85 View Post
    I'd prefer a deal with the Mariners to get Clement. He is stuck behind Johjima.
    Clement isn't necesarily blocked at all. They Ms are considering him at DH or first base as well. It's not a sure thing that he'll be a major league catcher.

    That said, what would the Reds give up to get him?
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  9. #8
    Passion for the game Team Clark's Avatar
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    Re: The Catching Problem

    The Mike Lavalliere, Don Slaught platoon worked pretty good.
    It's absolutely pathetic that people can't have an opinion from actually watching games and supplementing that with stats. If you voice an opinion that doesn't fit into a black/white box you will get completely misrepresented and basically called a tobacco chewing traditionalist...
    Cedric 3/24/08

  10. #9
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: The Catching Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by LincolnparkRed View Post
    What do you think Posada would fetch? And would the Yankees let him walk?
    He's in the wrong age bracket for a catcher.
    Go Gators!

  11. #10
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: The Catching Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    Clement isn't necesarily blocked at all. They Ms are considering him at DH or first base as well. It's not a sure thing that he'll be a major league catcher.
    not sure his bat plays very well as a DH or a 1B ... but then again its Bavasi and the Mariners, they can't help themselves. They traded away Soriano for Ramirez last year so I would certainly talk to them.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

  12. #11
    Member NJReds's Avatar
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    Re: The Catching Problem

    Posada's going to back up the brinks truck and I'm sure the Yankees will meet his price. But he's in a good spot in the AL. He can DH once in a while, and NY finally got a decent backup.

    LoDuca's getting some age, but he's solid. I actually like Castro, his backup. I think he'll get a starting shot somewhere.
    "The players make the manager, it's never the other way." - Sparky Anderson

  13. #12
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
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    Re: The Catching Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    If we bump up that .230 BABIP to a more reasonable .280, he's suddenly hitting .235/.305/.450 or so. Still not great, but a .750 OPS from a plus defending catcher is an asset. His 2006 HR/FB rate of 23.9% is wholly unsustainable and the drop of HR can account for the drop in BA in to the .230s from 2006's .255. Ross is basically Jason LaRue v2.0 with a touch more power right down to the late start of his career, good arm, low batting averages, etc..
    Good post.

    Couple this with the main focus of time and money expenditures starts and ends with the mound.....I'd say give Ross another year.
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

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    Re: The Catching Problem

    Someone explain Ross being a "plus defender."

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    Re: The Catching Problem

    Question for those who have seen Jay Bruce play the outfield: how capable is he of playing CF?

  16. #15
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: The Catching Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Question for those who have seen Jay Bruce play the outfield: how capable is he of playing CF?
    I am sure he can "play it". In playing CF there is no real substitute for speed and I have never heard anyone categorize him as a burner. All the stuff I read about him suggested he would be a RF at the major league level due to average speed.

    Having said that GABP is certainly not a CF but I don't think he would be any better in CF than Hamilton. It seems to me that for Bruce to be in the Reds OF starting next season someone has to be leaving.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand


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