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Thread: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

  1. #31
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    I know Logan, WV and Pulaski, VA and Asheboro, NC aren't the biggest towns in the world but I'll bet they have cable and if they don't I'll bet they can get a dish.

    Change is tough. But you eventually have to sack up and accept it. If it means more money for the Reds to improve their team, I wouldn't care if they broadcast the games using smoke signals.
    There are plenty of reds fans outside the city limits of even Logan, Pulaski and Asheboro where high speed internet is likely cost prohibitive. Dish, (I believe) is still an option. But the folks I'm thinking of are the millions of people who live off of "state route nowhere". There's a lot of fans out there. You are right, they are likely to not switch teams, but they are likely to quit spending their money on the Reds if they suddenly have no access to the team.

    Thanks for the "sack up lesson". Change and advancement is hunky dory. In your rush to be the tech-wizzard you are cutting off the rural foks, people over 60 (who aren't likely to run out and buy a computer to be part of your high-tech gang) and those who can't afford either technological choice. But hey, it's their fault for not being hippersters eh? Maybe they should just sack-up. Better yet, maybe they should all move to the big city so they can be part of the wiz-kid movement?

    I'm all for the Reds pursuing new and exciting ways to go to market. There's plethoria of ways to do it now, and I think with a little creativity they could both expand their markets and review streams by using the newer technologies. But looking down our nose at radio in the process strikes me as short-sighted. It's no longer the crown jewell anymore, I agree. But it's still an important way to reach a segment of fans.
    Last edited by Ltlabner; 10-09-2007 at 09:41 AM.
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate

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  3. #32
    I hate the Cubs LoganBuck's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by Unassisted View Post
    I doubt they would quadruple the number of affiliates, but clearly moving games off of WLW would open a window of opportunity to sign new ones.

    There's a larger trend in AM radio, which you may not be aware of. The FCC recently began allowing AM stations to broadcast HD radio between sunset and sunrise. (Previously, it was restricted to daylight hours only.) HD radio adds digital noise (aka, static) to either side of a station's analog frequency. If you're distant from WLW and close to a station broadcasting HD radio within a frequency or two either side of WLW's 700 frequency, the FCC just made it difficult for you to listen to WLW at night. In making the rule change which allowed HD radio at night, the FCC stated that it was favoring local stations over distant ones. In other words, the FCC doesn't care if you can pick up distant stations on AM at night and isn't going to make it any easier for you to do so.

    I feel certain that the Reds management is paying attention to this and other larger trends in the broadcasting industry. The advantages of having games on a 50,000 watt blowtorch look smaller every year.
    There is not an army of small stations in rural areas to sign up. They are spread out. I live nearly equidistant to Sidney, Bellfontaine, and Wapakoneta. I can not get an AM radio station at night from any of those towns. I have to drive 3 miles to get to a small town, and 10 miles to get to a McDonalds. I don't care about broadcasting to Great Falls, Montana just get me a good clear signal across the state of Ohio.
    The Sox traded Bullfrog the only player they've got for Shottenhoffen. Four-eyes Shottenhoffen a utility infielder. They've got a whole team of utility infielders.

  4. #33
    Titanic Struggles Caveat Emperor's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by Ltlabner View Post
    There is a world beyond the I275 beltway. There's plently of folks who either don't have access to the other technologies or would rather not pay for them. Every one of them is a potential customer to either come to the ballpark, buy Reds merchandise or support the Reds in some other financial way.
    In the case bolded above, the person you're reaching likely isn't a very good customer to target. Not a lot of advertisers target the ultra-frugal demographic and if someone doesn't want to pay to hear the games, they certainly aren't going to be too likely to drive/fly to Cincinnati FOR a game.
    Championships Matter.
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  5. #34
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by Caveat Emperor View Post
    In the case bolded above, the person you're reaching likely isn't a very good customer to target. Not a lot of advertisers target the ultra-frugal demographic and if someone doesn't want to pay to hear the games, they certainly aren't going to be too likely to drive/fly to Cincinnati FOR a game.
    Let's see...high speed internet service for say $60/month (I think someone mentioned that figure earlier) for a rural area. That is $720 per year. Then you have MLB.radio, or MLB.TV which tacks something extra onto that. Not wanting to spend $700+ per year just to listen to the team stink doesn't strike me as being "ultra frugal".

    Seems to me, most people with a car and sense of direction can make it to a couple of games per year for less than the $700-$800 investment needed for for the internet route. I'm not sure of the direct TV costs and don't have time to look them up.

    Sticking with the 5,000watt flagship station concept....a person in Peebles, Ohio, a mere 68 miles from downtown Cincinnati would likely not be able to hear the games on the "flagship" radio station, nor would they likely have an local radio station carrying the games. So now you are asking them to invest $700+ per year for the pleasure of hearing the Reds suck. Seems to me those casual fans will say forget it, and spend that money on other entertainment options.

    Now, you've eliminated a casual fan, likely caused them to not make a trip or two a year to the games, and possibly cut down on merchandise sales also.

    How is that progress ?
    Last edited by Ltlabner; 10-09-2007 at 02:10 PM.
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate

  6. #35
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by Ltlabner View Post
    I agree that amoungst younger folks, with internet access, radio is down the list of options. But for rural folks unable to access high-speed internet, or older folks it appears that radio is still a viable way to listen to a ballgame. And much of Reds territory includes areas with lower high-speed internet usage (as WVRedsfan pointed out), WVA, Eastern and Western Kentucky, even parts of Tenn. And not everybody wants to shell out the jack for the cable/direct TV packages to catch bits and pieces of every game (and then you are tied to the TV to view it).

    One thing the radio offers is the ability to do other things while listening. Internet means you are tied to wherever the computer is. No working in the garage. No headphones while mowing the yard. No listening while folding laundry in the laundry room. You have to be within hearing distance of the computer room.

    I agree that the radio broadcasts are only on part of the puzzel with the advent of internet, direct TV, etc. But it's still a piece of the pie that should be considered.
    MyFi
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  7. #36
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by Unassisted View Post
    Maybe John wanted to do this before, but the previous regime wouldn't let him? Regardless, he's the point man on it, so if it works, he should get some credit.
    Nope, John Allen had total control of all media contracts. I remember Richard Hand suggesting that Allen could use a little help in that area to him at Redsfest, and Allen not being very pleased.

    I will say that maybe Allen has learned from his past mistakes.. maybe, but I doubt it. Allen is ultraconservative. He'll gladly take the guaranteed $1 over the $10000 that might have a little risk involved. There are countless examples of his priorities. For example, he once made a comment that he didn't care that attendence was down for the year because higher ticket prices made up for it.. He didn't care that the Reds' brand was eroding under his watch, as long as he made his numbers for that year.

    I find it hard to believe that Allen came up with anything innovative after watching the Reds stagnate for the approximately 10 years he was in charge.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  8. #37
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by Ltlabner View Post
    I agree that amoungst younger folks, with internet access, radio is down the list of options. But for rural folks unable to access high-speed internet, or older folks it appears that radio is still a viable way to listen to a ballgame. .
    Radio is my primary way to follow the Reds.
    It allows you to do other things while following the game.
    Most people aren't going to sit in front of a computer for 3-4 hours every night and listen to MLB radio over the internet. Sure, the diehard fans will, but not the causal guy.

    I'm surprised by how many times I hear the Reds on radio from other people's cars in traffic.

    For me, the ideal solution would be to let WLW continue to broadcast the games, but allow the Reds to add other affiliates as well.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  9. #38
    Pitching is the thing WVRedsFan's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by Jpup View Post
    MyFi
    Well...my MyFi (once again I am in a rural area) was a failure. So much so, that I gave up and put it out of service in favor of Roady 2 with the now discontinued mobile kit. I never could get a consistent signal in rural WV with the MyFi and the Roady 2 with kit does much better. XM has a new series that are much better.

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    Pitching is the thing WVRedsFan's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    Nope, John Allen had total control of all media contracts. I remember Richard Hand suggesting that Allen could use a little help in that area to him at Redsfest, and Allen not being very pleased.

    I will say that maybe Allen has learned from his past mistakes.. maybe, but I doubt it. Allen is ultraconservative. He'll gladly take the guaranteed $1 over the $10000 that might have a little risk involved. There are countless examples of his priorities. For example, he once made a comment that he didn't care that attendence was down for the year because higher ticket prices made up for it.. He didn't care that the Reds' brand was eroding under his watch, as long as he made his numbers for that year.

    I find it hard to believe that Allen came up with anything innovative after watching the Reds stagnate for the approximately 10 years he was in charge.
    Bob Castellini is the fire behind this. Bob said "do it" and John jumped right on it. That's John.

    IMHO, we have GABP because of John's bean counting. I really like GABP, but I look at other new stadiums and wonder what it would have been without John watching every penny.

  11. #40
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRedsFan View Post
    IMHO, we have GABP because of John's bean counting. I really like GABP, but I look at other new stadiums and wonder what it would have been without John watching every penny.
    I personally blame the Bengals, their place cost twice as much and gets used 73 less times a year.
    Go Gators!

  12. #41
    You're soaking in it! MartyFan's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Will Rural and Urban fans of the Reds benefit from the team moving off a signal like WLW, there will be more local affiliates meaning the team presence will be more local...that would be a good thing.

    Having lived in rural areas over the years, hearing a ball game on FM isn't unlikely at all.

    With the evil empire now at least negotiating the sale (ie freedom) of some of their small market radio stations to regional and local owners, I'd say the number of affiliates would grow.

    Still, the reality is that some fans would undoubtedly be without the ability to listen to the game on AM/FM radio and would be forced to follow it via another method on the Internet or another method.

    Bottom line is, this sort of move would be a financial windfall for the Reds because it would allow a stronger LOCAL presence for the team in each market that had an affiliate and also increase the amount of revenue because of the increased number of affiliates.
    "Sometimes, it's not the sexiest moves that put you over the top," Krivsky said. "It's a series of transactions that help you get there."

  13. #42
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    Radio is my primary way to follow the Reds.
    It allows you to do other things while following the game.
    Most people aren't going to sit in front of a computer for 3-4 hours every night and listen to MLB radio over the internet. Sure, the diehard fans will, but not the causal guy.

    I'm surprised by how many times I hear the Reds on radio from other people's cars in traffic.

    For me, the ideal solution would be to let WLW continue to broadcast the games, but allow the Reds to add other affiliates as well.
    Agree 1000%
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate

  14. #43
    Score Early, Score Often gonelong's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by KronoRed View Post
    I personally blame the Bengals, their place cost twice as much and gets used 73 less times a year.
    I blame Marge much more than the Bengals ... though lots of people share the blame IMO.

    GL

  15. #44
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by gonelong View Post
    I blame Marge much more than the Bengals ... though lots of people share the blame IMO.

    GL

    Lots of people share the blame but the Reds weren't in as advantegeous of a situation as the Bengals were. The Bengals threatened to leave if they didn't get what they wanted and it wouldn't have been difficult. OTOH, the Reds would have had to have got approval from MLB to move and most cities had teams already. I think Marge threatened to move to NKY at one point but no one took that seriously.

    Here's a dated but interesting read on the whole situation.

    http://brookings.nap.edu/books/08157...2.html#pagetop
    The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.

    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Rally-...24872650873160

  16. #45
    RZ Chamber of Commerce Unassisted's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Negotiating to Take Back Advertising for Games on The Radio

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRedsFan View Post
    XM has a new series that are much better.
    I've heard that the FM modulators on the new models with SureConnect are much weaker than the current models, because the FCC wanted them to cause less interference. I have a Roady XT hooked up to a home kit. I can receive whatever the Roady is tuned to with a portable FM radio anywhere in my 2-story house. I don't think I'd be able to do that if I had a SureConnect unit.

    Getting back to the baseball topic, before I got XM I was skeptical that I would get much use out of it for listening to baseball. I thought of it as a car radio enhancement and I am usually home rather than in the car when games are broadcast. Using the home kit with my XM radio has been great for baseball and for listening to WLW (which I can almost never receive on AM, day or night) at times when games are not broadcast. Installation was simple. It doesn't take up a lot of space, so Mrs. U is happy with it. I highly recommend taking the plunge if you want a dependable way to listen to games on the radio. It's a much more flexible solution than MLB.TV or MLB Gameday Audio, in that you're not tied to a computer.
    /r/reds


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