Last edited by traderumor; 11-28-2007 at 08:57 AM.
That's MaineRed for ya.
This topic is really starting to get old. Chad Johnson and Carson Palmer have a fine relationship... most QB/WRs have arguments, thats just the way things go.
Chad is also no where near the reason why we suck. We suck because we have no defense, and if you can't realize that then you don't need to even be on this thread. We also suck because our coaches are a bunch of tards.
I challenge you to read the last page of this thread and tell me I wasn't discussing the content of the post.
I think it was you who brought up TO. I responded about TO and Chad. I continued to talk football, about the Eagles, about TO, about Chad.
Then someone comes in and suggest that non Bengal fans should pretty much keep their mouths shut when it comes to Chad. There are a number of people here who want to be able to dish it out but have SERIOUS issues taking it back. You guys love free speech when you agree with the take but want to censor anyone who disagrees.
But it is me who wants to take cheap shots at posters? And I suppose TeamSelig's dig at me was a compliment?
Burn down the disco. Hang the blessed DJ. Because the music that he constantly plays, it says nothing to me about my life.
We just get tired of a certain poster coming into every thread and throwing around insults and making a huge argument out of every single topic. I think you just get a kick out of bothering people and starting a ruckass in every thread.
The only problem is I didn't throw around any insults. I responded to some comments about Terrell Owens and was discussing football.
I did respond to a poster who seemed to imply that only Bengal fans are allowed to comment on Chad Johnson but I really don't think I dropped any insults. I was sarcastic and I think it was warranted. Bengal fans have no problem commenting on the things I mentioned in that post but when it comes to the Bengals unless you can see Paul Brown stadium from your bedroom you have no business having a take. Unless it is positive of course.
BTW, you should go look up "every" in the dictionary. Outside of the football threads I rarely post in a topic and I would bet my house that I am not doing the things you claim in EVERY thread. You want to put your beer helmet on the line in that bet?
Your exaggerations get just as tiring.
Now was he also arrogant and bull-headed? Or was it simply confidence? I guess it all depends on how people look at it. Either way, that same driven character that brought him huge success on the field, left to his downfall off the field.
But I don't think Pete played the way he did to showboat.
He ran to 1B on walks because Pete was always looking to gain an advantage. Pete didn't have that "natural ability" like say a Eric Davis. He was always studying, looking at ways to gain the upper hand. Again - that was just his competitive nature.
Last edited by GAC; 11-28-2007 at 07:35 PM.
"panic" only comes from having real expectations
You're saying there is no "me, me" aspect that motivates Chad's behavior? When the guy runs over to the sideline and puts on a jacket that says "Future H.O.F" on it? Or when he puts so much pre-planning into these celebrations knowing full well it is going to draw his team an unsportsmanlike penalty that coming Sunday, and yet doesn't seem to care?
When Marvin Lewis ripped the team for being selfish after its 34-13 Monday night home loss to New England, in a following interview Johnson states "My take on the word selfish? If you don't have any selfishness about you, you're not going to win at what you do."
I've never laid the blame for Cincy's dismal season on Chad's shoulders. If I believe that football is a team sport (and I do), that it takes all 11 guys on that field to succeed/win, then the losing has to also be laid on those same 11 guys.
I have never denied that Chad isn't a passionate guy. I understand the guy wants to win and win bad. I've simply stated he allows those emotions to run amok/control him, to the point where it's not only been a distraction, but it has also affected his play/performance on that field.
Even Dave Lapham has came down on him for that.
Here's one thing that gets me about Johnson.....
He's definitely good. So good that opposing defenses plan accordingly and double team the guy which is what defenses do when you have a play maker like that. He then gets frustrated because he's not getting the ball. And that has led to confrontations with his QB, head coach, and other players on that field, sidelines, and in the locker room.
And I don't see how people can simply dismiss that as being Chad showing his competitive "side", and that it's not a problem?
And if the guy wants the spotlight, then he has to take the criticism that also comes with it. And he doesn't seem to take that too well either.
If I had the choice, I'd take T.J. over Chad simply because I think T.J. is more of a team player. Chad seems to only be a team player when things are going his way. That is just my take.
The fact that the head coach, as well as certain players via various interviews, have alluded to this selfishness, gives evidence that it's also coming from inside the club. And they never mentioned any particular player's names either. Yet Chad felt obligated to give an interview directly afterwards because he felt it was singling him out Guilty conscience?Whether it's a distraction or not seems to be conjecture coming from those outside the club, not within the club itself. It's easy to point the finger at Chad when the coach mentions selfish players.
Last edited by GAC; 11-28-2007 at 08:37 PM.
"panic" only comes from having real expectations
GAC, I would love for Chad Johnson to be a humble lunch-pail type guy who does his job without the shenanigans and lets his performance do the talking. But he's not that guy, just as Adam Dunn is never going to be a gold-glove left fielder who strikes out less that 50 times in a season. He's a passionate guy. He wants to win and he wants to put up big numbers doing it. I have no problem with those two facts. I don't like seeing him get upset and have words with Carson Palmer, but I don't know about their personal relationship, so I'm not going to go out on a limb and say that a heated argument between the two on the sideline for one game is tearing the team apart. I'm not going to say that Chad turning away from Marvin during a game is a sign that Chad doesn't respect Marvin. We don't see Chad and Carson and Marvin on a daily basis, so unless someone with a close relationship to them says there's a problem, I'm not inclined to think there is.
After living through the era when team cancers like Carl Pickens and Corey Dillon were spewing venom in the locker room and on the practice field, Chad Johnson's antics are hardly worth mentioning. The reason I get annoyed with it is because it causes people to lose focus of the real problem with the team. There is a serious lack of leadership and team play on the defensive side of the ball. I can only hope that Marvin's "selfish" comment was directed at certain members of the defense, because it's clear that a number of them haven't been playing their assignments this season and instead have been freelancing in an attempt to make the big play. They try to make their living off causing turnovers, when they should be focusing on their assignments. For example, how many times this season have we seen the pass rushers try to beat the tackles on the outside, leaving a huge gap in the middle of the pocket for the QB to step up into or run for the first down? How many times have DBs left their coverage assignment thinking they had help elsewhere because they thought they could jump an underneath route? How many times have LBs bit on the play fake, leaving the Tight End wide open over the middle?
To use a baseball analogy, it's like when a light hitting center fielder or second baseman with speed has a good year with HRs, then the next season all he does is try to hit more HRs. He forgets about doing what he needs to do, get on base, and swings for the fences every time up. I think what the Bengals really need is a player on defense who can knock some heads together in the defensive huddle and make sure guys are focusing on their assignments and not on trying to make the big play. Do your job and the big plays come. The defense has real problems with guys not doing their jobs and it's not something that I think Chad Johnson has anything to do with.
As a player, Chad Johnson brings way more to the table than he takes off of it. I can't say the same about a lot of Bengals players.
The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.
But to the media it's all about Chad.
If the defense was just average the Bengals would be a playoff team every year, and I actually think they will more than likely be a lot better next year. The health issues they have suffered through this season have been abnormal.
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
When Chad jumps into the "Dawg Pound" after a Td early in a game and incites the other team and their fans, he's being selfish and stupid. They lost that game.
When Chad pulls out a "HOF" jacket, he's being selfish and ignorant, that was just embarrassing, no one does that.
When Chad drops an easy pass on 3rd down late in the Buffalo game that would've been a huge play downfield, he can't back up his talk and silliness with action. They went on to lose that game and as a result, at that point, their playoff hopes. Thanks Chad.
When Chad fumbles because he refuses to carry the ball properly in or near the red zone in a close game and takes away points from his team, he can't back it up - he contributes directly to losing winnable games that cost them the post season.
Where was Chad the last six weeks? His #'s stunk, and he didn't make plays or take advantage of opportunities again and again.
He is a big reason why they won't be in the post season again this year.
This is why he deserves to be criticized.
Marvin let's Chad get away with whatever he wants, that's just the way it is. And Marvin can thank Chad for contributing to his rapid decline as an NFL head coach.
One great game and all is forgotten in Cincy it seems. Women and kids will put on their Chad jersies next home game, just waiting for Chad's next "act."
Whatever. He's a great WR, but he's a head case who has become nothing more than a big choker in meaningful games against tough competition.
The Bengals' don't "need" him, any talented #1 type WR would put up great #'s, and probably more consistently, in this offense with a top 5 QB.
Allllll that said, he involved his teammates last week on his 2 following TD's and sought out his QB and lineman - THAT is what we need to see more of. God forbid the guy actually "gets it" some day.
The Bengals problems, IMHO, have not changed in the past few years - and they don't reside on the offensive side of the ball. They simply don't stop the run and the efforts they have made to address that have been either poor or misguided.
I don't think the "character" issues have helped any, but not hurt as much as some believe either.
Nothing to see here. Please disperse.
I've never put anyone on ignore before, but you are probably the most annoying poster I have ever came across. You can strive on controversy and heated arguments, but I am done with you completely.
As for the other Chad haters, name ONE thing that he has done that directly damages the teams morale.
We cannot go by what we think might be happening in the lockerroom. I need some real evidence that proves he has caused all of these "problems" with his teammates. Since people are basing what they see as facts, I'll go ahead and say that from watching the games, he seems to be well liked by his teammates and in fact one of the leaders of the team. I think he inspires others, and keeps the games fun - thus raising team morale and chemistry.
And just becase he drops a pass he hurts the team? Everyone drops passes. It happens. No one is perfect, and just because he talks trash (mostly in a joking manner) or celebrates creatively, does not mean that he has to be perfect. Thats ridiculous. What about when he dives across the mid-field allowing himself to be vulnerable to that cheap shot? He could have been paralyzed. He is constantly hustling, diving, fighting for extra yards - he plays hard, he tries hard, and that is what the other players see. They laugh at his jokes, but his play speaks for himself. Also, his #'s aren't going to be good when our offense has NO running game. No one has really had that great of numbers. We have sucked this year, and it is no secret. You can't put a whole organization failing on one of our best players.
Don't blame us for wondering why other teams fans are criticizing our team and using psychoanalysis to determine why Chad is such a horrible player.