Someone who paid more attention back then than I did, tell me: Was Baker considered a hates-young-players pitcher-killer with the Giants, or did the bulk of the ridicule start with the Cubs?
Someone who paid more attention back then than I did, tell me: Was Baker considered a hates-young-players pitcher-killer with the Giants, or did the bulk of the ridicule start with the Cubs?
Reading comprehension is not just an ability, it's a choice
I don't want the team to go all in. I'm pro rebuilding.
But the club needed to decide between the two and I'd say it's made its choice. Can't fault them for sitting on the fence.
In a nutshell, yes. Figure out what it is you do and then do the hell out of it. If they fail at least they can say they gave it their best shot.Originally Posted by RFS62
I'm not a system player. I am a system.
Dusty Baker. Heh.
I wish I had no words. But I do. The Reds' new manager is a complete and total Milo in the worst way. He burns pitchers. The guy has no clue how offense actually works. To call him a narcissist would be kind. Frankly, I think this move speaks volumes about how completely clueless the current ownership and front office actually is.
Dusty Baker. Yeah. This is a guy who couldn't survive with a soulmate in Jim Hendry at the helm with a higher payroll franchise. The move here is idiotic at best. At best. At worst, it's a franchise killer.
The Reds ownership and management have now screwed things up because, as usual, they have no idea where they really are.
At this point, they are teh suck.
"The problem with strikeouts isn't that they hurt your team, it's that they hurt your feelings..." --Rob Neyer
"The single most important thing for a hitter is to get a good pitch to hit. A good hitter can hit a pitch that’s over the plate three times better than a great hitter with a ball in a tough spot.”
--Ted Williams
Four thoughts/questions:
1.) I don't see Bailey, Cueto, and Maloney living up to their hype at this point. Talented young pitchers like Jerome Williams and Kurt Ainsworth crapped out under Baker's watch. My hope is that the Reds cash in on the young pitchers now, trading them for key components of a championship team.
I am far less concerned with Arroyo and Harang because of their age and proven ability to handle 200+ innings. Jason Schmidt had several healthy ace-like years in SF; no reason to believe Arroyo and Harang can't carry a staff again.
2.) If you look at the history of final four basketball teams, whether the head coach had been in the final four was one of the big predictors of a team's chances of making it to the Final Four. I believe the same is true for baseball. . . Maybe not a direct analogy, but teams with more experienced managers generally perform better against pythogorean projected W-Ls. Baker has managed a team to the World Series, and he has had several successful years. I hope there is some residue of his experiences still left in this elixor.
3.) M2, I don't see how this move guarantees the Reds will spend cash. Has there been reports of increasing payroll? I'd like to hear your thoughts on this issue. If anything, I see them going with the young guys and churning them through the meat grinder rather than increasing payroll.
4.) Is the Dusty/bullpen mix toxic too? I recall he built some interesting bullpens in SF.
Stormy, I don't disagree with any of that. What I'm saying is, that's not how Castellini and Krivsky think and they aren't going to start thinking that way even if it's 100% correct.
Honestly, what were the chances this franchise was going down a path I'd have chosen? Somewhere around nil would be my guess. But if they're going this way, Baker beats the pants off of Narron, Miley and Boone.
I'm not a system player. I am a system.
There are times when I hear people rag on the Reds and I want to fight back, defend their honor. As of today, I'm joining them. I've just lost all hope that this management team was intelligent and had a good plan. Just... uggh.
I'm embarrassed by this decision. It's like voting for a candidate only to find out later he's a KKK member and neo-nazi who kills kittens in his spare time. Now excuse me while I go cry myself to sleep.
Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.
We'll go down in history as the first society that wouldn't save itself because it wasn't cost effective ~ Kurt Vonnegut
Here's the problem with them "going for it", M2.
The Reds are throwing a Hail Mary and don't realize they're down 14, it's the middle of the 2nd quarter, and it's 3rd and 1 from their own 17.
I guess I see the positive in them choosing a direction and pursuing it. But I take no positive out of them pursuing a crappy direction.
Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.
1) It may not bode well for the long term success of those young pitchers, but Baker might be their ticket to one hit wonder status. Though don't count out one or more of them getting traded for veteran talent. Just a guess, but I'd imagine he'll prefer Cueto (who's a heady and composed pitcher by all accounts) to Bailey.
3) Nothing guarantees more money spent, but do you think Dusty Baker came to the Reds to manage a $60M roster? I don't. As for young players, that's not Baker's M.O. Probably the last thing you want is to bring in Dusty Baker and ask him not to be himself. I'm sure he's told this organization what he thinks he needs to win and I'm equally sure they've agreed to supply it.
4) I can't see Baker making the Reds bullpen worse. Over the past four seasons it's been the worst most of us have ever seen from this franchise.
I'm not a system player. I am a system.
Absolutely nowhere have you seen me say that I think this is going to work. I don't. Chances are it will be a spectacular and painful failure.
But even if the show sucks, at least they've got amps turned up to 11. It beats the unplugged sets we've endured in the 21st century.
I hear Cincinnati wants to party.
I'm not a system player. I am a system.
This is a guy who a few years ago was discussed as being the best manager in the game:
http://espn.go.com/mlb/columns/neyer_rob/1449940.html
As Rob Neyer points out in the link above, that was hyperbole. He wasn't THAT good.
But the hyperbole on this thread is worse. The Reds have hired their best manager since Davey Johnson. Baker has a .527 career winning percentage.
I would have chosen someone else, but I do think the Reds will be a better than .500 team by 2009.
Stick to your guns.
Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.
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