Cedric, Wheelhouse, I'm surprised you guys don't like the move. It would seem to be up your alley. You've both been fairly complimentary of the Dusty Baker wannabes the Reds have cycled through the manager's office, I'd figure getting the real thing would be seen as a positive move.
What is it you guys think is lacking in Baker's approach to the game?
I'm not a system player. I am a system.
I hope I'm not lumped into a certain category here. I can't think of one good thing I said about Jerry Narron, Dave Miley, or Bob Boone's baseball philosophy. Their philosophy was against everything I believe in baseball. I wanted everyone one of them gone probably before 90% of the fan base.Originally Posted by M2
I don't think I should be lumped into the old tobacco spitting, play the game the right way group. But whatever.
I guess some of us that that don't lean 100% new age get a label whether it's factual or not.
Sorry if that sounds defensive. But I frankly don't know what the hell you are talking about.
This is the time. The real Reds organization is back.
maybe Baker took the job ONLY because BOB promised to spend some money to win!!
I'd never revoke my fanship, but this doesn't make me laugh one bit.
There is nothing funny about this move. Not even a little bit.
I'm also not much into praying, but if there is some kinda devine spirit, I would hope someone could invoke the name so the next annoncement will be that they've hired Jocketty.
I'm as despondant as I've ever been. It seems hopeless at this point.
This is worse than the Milton signing by leaps and bounds, and I'm struggling for something to say.
The Power of Tradition, they say.
I say......Bffftttttt!
"Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?" ~ Jim Bouton
My apologies, I always thought your bent was fundamentals based, situational hitting, slap some leather around, run the bases aggressively, play the game don't overthink it.
And I'm not using those ideas as pejoratives, quite the opposite in fact.
I'm looking through your past posts and I notice you recently praised the direction Krivsky was taking the franchise. Aren't those things I just typed that direction in a nutshell?
I'm not a system player. I am a system.
How about the fact that Baker was a loser with a very powerful Cubs roster his last two years there. The Cubs board is rolling in the aisles over this one. Baker is not a smart manager and he appeases players. Not "old school" in my book. I'm not praising this move. Especially with the possibility Torre or LaRussa could be available and the fact that Girardi is.
"Don't trust any statistics you did not fake yourself."--Winston Churchill
I'm not reading him that way.
Mainly, he calls things as he sees them, and he doesn't really have a specific bent.
He's brutally honest and he has no sacred cows.
But really. This is a move that transcends methodoligy and dogma. We shouldn't be surprised by any amount of rancor portrayed here.
"Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?" ~ Jim Bouton
You know, I'm not as upset about this as I thought I'd be. Considering the options on the table anyway. I'm frightful of the way he handles pitchers, but I've always generally liked the way he was able to get the most out of his fringe players a la Earl Weaver.
School's out. What did you expect?
Whatever, I don't need to hijack the thread with my sensitivity. But you said I was fairly complimentary of the crapiness of Bob Boone, Dave Miley, and Jerry Narron. That is offensive to anyone with half a brain.
I do believe in taking the extra base and playing fundamental baseball. I'm also in favor of Norris Hopper never leading off and Adam Dunn never hitting 6th. I'd also never pinch hit Scott Hatteberg for Edwin Encarnacion with the bases loaded like Narron did in 06. I almost charged the dugout.
I have no idea what that has to do with Wayne Krivsky and the way I feel he is actually developing talent in the minor league system.
This is the time. The real Reds organization is back.
Oh, that was a dog of roster. Bad pitching, an OB-free lineup. Those clubs were born to lose. Mind you, they were what Baker asked for.
I'm not a system player. I am a system.
Nutty Perfesser flashback.They were who we THOUGHT they were, and we let 'em off the hook!
As a lifelong Reds/Vikings fan, the Baker hire takes me back a few years to the Denny Green era. You could always count on Green's team making it to the playoffs. Heck, they even had a helluva regular season in '98. But when push came to shove, Denny would get that "deer in the headlights look" and take a knee when the situation called for Cunningham to Moss.
It's not the inevitable old school arguments that trouble me. It's knowing I've been down this road before and how it feels to get your hopes up, only to have your heart ripped out and handed back to you.
Brace yourselves, Red's fans. This roller coaster ride has started before the maintenance crew had time to finish their inspection.
Never overlook the obvious
I did a little digging and rather quickly found some something from Dusty's SF days that goes as more evidence of his pitcher-killer reputation.
Russ Ortiz and Livan Hernandez are holding up bravely but perilously against Dusty Baker's macho arm-slagging. Both are quiet warriors and good soldiers, and as such Dusty will reward them with a suicide mission of 130-pitch outings.
“I don’t care,” Votto said of passing his friend and former teammate. “He’s in the past. Bye-bye, Jay.”
Just as an aside, if you're small market team perhaps it makes sense to ride whip hand on your pitchers. You're probably going to lose a lot of guys via free agency (if they're good). If so, then why not use 'em like crazy while you've got them and let someone else pay for the aftermath?
Obviously rookies and guys with lengthy contracts don't fit into that mix so well, but say Matt Belisle took a leap forward or that the Reds traded for a guy who has two years until free agency. In those cases it would seem that getting a peak season would be the ideal.
I'm not a system player. I am a system.
THAT, is a pretty interesting perspective.
School's out. What did you expect?
for some fun, read here...
http://myespn.go.com/s/conversations/show/story/3062658
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