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Thread: Reds after Cordero

  1. #61
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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    Here's rotoworld's take on it:
    I think Cordero's using Cincy as leverage against Milwaukee. Milwaukee will get this deal done, IMO. In the history of FA, have the Reds EVER outbid another team?

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  3. #62
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    We've said it before.. you have to walk before you can run.

    This signing potentially takes care of the closer's slot for the next 4 years.
    Just like the Arroyo trade moved us closer to contending, this move does to.

    We have to remember that other than Burton, we really have no viable potential closer
    in house. And it's a bit risky pinning closing hopes on a rookie off a good season. We've seen many rookie pitchers fade in their second years from "potential closer" to "middle reliever".

    Sure, I hope there's moves following this signing (if it happens), but I'm encouraged that maybe Wayne learned from his last offseason and is actually focusing on getting real talent this winter. Even if he's not able to add 2 more starting pitchers, I wouldn't be upset with this move.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  4. #63
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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    We've said it before.. you have to walk before you can run.

    This signing potentially takes care of the closer's slot for the next 4 years.
    Just like the Arroyo trade moved us closer to contending, this move does to.

    We have to remember that other than Burton, we really have no viable potential closer
    in house. And it's a bit risky pinning closing hopes on a rookie off a good season. We've seen many rookie pitchers fade in their second years from "potential closer" to "middle reliever".

    Sure, I hope there's moves following this signing (if it happens), but I'm encouraged that maybe Wayne learned from his last offseason and is actually focusing on getting real talent this winter. Even if he's not able to add 2 more starting pitchers, I wouldn't be upset with this move.
    With his pinpoint control, Cueto's looking more and more like Rod Beck every day.

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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    I'd also have to say it'd surprise me if the Reds went for that.

    Personally, I'd like to see the Reds get 2 (maybe even 3?) really good relievers instead of 1 closer. With that said though, it'd be hard to bash this move. The guy is easily the best reliever on the market and I've said all along that I think it's more important that the Reds upgrade their bullpen before they upgrade their rotation. The Reds are going to have to pay more money because of the park they play in. Obviously, I think this would limit their ability to make more additions this year, but hey, you never know. Maybe Cast is serious this time?

  6. #65
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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    I think Cordero's using Cincy as leverage against Milwaukee. Milwaukee will get this deal done, IMO. In the history of FA, have the Reds EVER outbid another team?

    Does outbidding the Jays for Gonzales count?

    I would've mentioned Stanton, but I'm not sure there were any other bidders.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    As you're fond of pointing out, the offseason's just begun. And the Cards have many chips.
    There's few teams with less chips than the Cards.

    Rasmus is one, but the Cards would be crazy to cash in on that chip. They have 4-5 other promising prospects, but all would fall below the Reds 4th best prospect.

    Major leaguers to trade? Reyes is probably available, as pitchers who go 2-14, plus 6 ERA invaribaly are. And it's not that they have a surplus at starter (they have the same motley crew from last year back, minus some).

    They are basically stuck with a little money chasing a poor FA market that's very expensive.

    The Cards plan should be to ride out 2008, hoping guys like Rolen, Edmonds, Mulder, Carpenter can get better.

    In 2009, guys like Edmonds, Izzy, Encarncion and Mulder are off the payroll freeing up lots of cash in a better FA market. But there's little the Cards can do for 2008 other than pray for health.

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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    In the history of FA, have the Reds EVER outbid another team?
    "Since I've been with the Reds in 1989, we've never had a farm system this loaded," Bowden said. "If we were the New York Yankees and had unlimited dollars, we could have traded for Colon, (Jeff) Weaver, Rolen, (Cliff) Floyd, (Kenny) Rogers and Finley and gotten them all -- and still held onto our top five prospects. That's an amazing statement."

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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    I think Cordero's using Cincy as leverage against Milwaukee. Milwaukee will get this deal done, IMO. In the history of FA, have the Reds EVER outbid another team?

  10. #69
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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    With his pinpoint control, Cueto's looking more and more like Rod Beck every day.
    But our pen is thin enough to use him as well, if he does emerge.

    The only risk to this deal is if Cordero becomes injured or ineffective.. which is a legit risk. Otherwise, he has a very movable contract.

    I'd rather spend 10 million on a good player, than 10+ million on 4 over the hill, below average guys (as Wayne did last year)

    Maybe I'm just giddy that we finally might land a player in the offseason with a bigger name than Vanderwall/Conine... We might finally get a FA that can actually make an impact.

    Although, you are right, the deal isn't done yet.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  11. #70
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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    With his pinpoint control, Cueto's looking more and more like Rod Beck every day.
    He looks like a #1 or 2 starter to me.

  12. #71
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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    The Reds didn't call the Yankees' bluff. Or something.

  13. #72
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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by fearofpopvol1 View Post
    I'd also have to say it'd surprise me if the Reds went for that.

    Personally, I'd like to see the Reds get 2 (maybe even 3?) really good relievers instead of 1 closer. With that said though, it'd be hard to bash this move. The guy is easily the best reliever on the market and I've said all along that I think it's more important that the Reds upgrade their bullpen before they upgrade their rotation. The Reds are going to have to pay more money because of the park they play in. Obviously, I think this would limit their ability to make more additions this year, but hey, you never know. Maybe Cast is serious this time?

    I don't know. There are only seven spots in the pen. If Cordero, Weathers, Burton and Bray occupy 4 of those and 1 goes to a long reliever/spot starter, that leaves two for the young guys to prove themselves. I'd be happy picking from Salmon, McBeth, Coutlangus, Roenicke, Pelland, Ramirez and maybe another rule 5 guy or some undervalued minor league free agents. Remember that some of those innings will be in a mop up role so leaving a spot or two to break the young guys in is fine by me.

    If a deal for Cordero or a similar impact reliever is completed, I think its more important to try and move Stanton and Majewski out of the way and make the right decision on Coffey than it is to bring in more guys. The attention needs to turn to the rotation after this move IMO.
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  14. #73
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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I don't know. There are only seven spots in the pen. If Cordero, Weathers, Burton and Bray occupy 4 of those and 1 goes to a long reliever/spot starter, that leaves two for the young guys to prove themselves. I'd be happy picking from Salmon, McBeth, Coutlangus, Roenicke, Pelland, Ramirez and maybe another rule 5 guy or some undervalued minor league free agents. Remember that some of those innings will be in a mop up role so leaving a spot or two to break the young guys in is fine by me.

    If a deal for Cordero or a similar impact reliever is completed, I think its more important to try and move Stanton and Majewski out of the way and make the right decision on Coffey than it is to bring in more guys. The attention needs to turn to the rotation after this move IMO.
    Personally, I'm not at all sold on Bray. I'd rather have Salmon, even though I know Bray is in the mix (as is Majewski). I still think you could rely on having Weathers close games and then add a Percival and Wood and be in better shape. It'd probably be similar money (maybe even a slight savings). I guess it's all a matter of how you see it.

    As I said previously, if the Reds land Cordero, I won't be complaining. I'd do it differently, but it'd be hard to knock getting the best closer on the market.

  15. #74
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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    It would be a great move if the reds were to get Cordero. Over the past two seasons the reds pen has been awful. Up until about the tail end of the season when a starter left it was a complete crapshoot whether the pen could hold a lead or even keep the team in the game. If Cordero can take over the closing job that would push both Burton and Weathers down a slot. Even if they think that Burton can be a closer in a year or two you aren't going to find a legit closer who is going to take a 2 year deal. Just with the addition of him I think this would put the reds into the mix in the NL Central.

  16. #75
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    Re: Reds after Cordero

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I don't know. There are only seven spots in the pen. If Cordero, Weathers, Burton and Bray occupy 4 of those and 1 goes to a long reliever/spot starter, that leaves two for the young guys to prove themselves. I'd be happy picking from Salmon, McBeth, Coutlangus, Roenicke, Pelland, Ramirez and maybe another rule 5 guy or some undervalued minor league free agents. Remember that some of those innings will be in a mop up role so leaving a spot or two to break the young guys in is fine by me.

    If a deal for Cordero or a similar impact reliever is completed, I think its more important to try and move Stanton and Majewski out of the way and make the right decision on Coffey than it is to bring in more guys. The attention needs to turn to the rotation after this move IMO.
    I agree with this 100%. If we sign Cordero then I am not worried about the pen having enough good pitching, I am worried about the Reds keeping the wrong guys. The defense remains a mess and we have zilch-zero-nada depth at starting. If Bailey pitches well, and Harang and Arroyo pitch to their former records, and Belisle emerges, the Reds still have a fifth spot to fill. No slack for injuries, mised starts for any reason or the occasional spot start. I believe Cordero WOULD fix the pen but there are still staggering holes in the rotation and a lousy defense to address.


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