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Thread: If Hamilton is traded, who hits leadoff?

  1. #76
    Member Stormy's Avatar
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    Re: If Hamilton is traded, who hits leadoff?

    Bruce
    EdE
    Dunn
    Griffey
    Phillips
    Votto
    Gonzo
    Ross

    I'd give Keppinger plenty of time in the #1-2 spots when he started, as well.

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  3. #77
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: If Hamilton is traded, who hits leadoff?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stormy View Post
    Bruce
    EdE
    Dunn
    Griffey
    Phillips
    Votto
    Gonzo
    Ross

    I'd give Keppinger plenty of time in the #1-2 spots when he started, as well.
    Just curious, it seems like Votto's OB skills will be lost hitting in front of Gonzo and Ross. Now, I do think that is where Dusty will hit him, but what do you think about him at leadoff?

  4. #78
    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: If Hamilton is traded, who hits leadoff?

    Bruce:
    47 BB/135 Ks
    .56 AVG/OB split
    .567 SLG

    Votto:
    70 BB/110 Ks
    .83 AVG/OB split
    .478 SLG

    If one of them is going to lead off, it should be Votto, IMO, with Bruce hitting 5th or 6th

  5. #79
    Making sense of it all Matt700wlw's Avatar
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    Re: If Hamilton is traded, who hits leadoff?

    When Hopper plays, I guess Hopper....however, if he's the everyday centerfielder, then we have a problem. However, he's probably your best lead off hitter....but I don't know if that bunt thing he does will be successful forever, as teams tend to pick up on things with exposure.

    I have no problem if he's #4 and gets fill in duty and spot starts.
    Last edited by Matt700wlw; 12-22-2007 at 08:48 PM.

  6. #80
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    Re: If Hamilton is traded, who hits leadoff?

    Votto (OBP)
    Edwin (OBP)
    Griffey
    Dunn (or switch Dunn and Griffey depending on who has the higher OBP at the time)
    Bruce
    Phillips (could see plenty of PA's with guys on base here, which is a good thing. All of the outs wouldn't hurt so much from the 6th spot)
    Gonzo
    Ross

    But, like Cyclone said, we will never see this lineup, mostly because Phillips will NEVER bat sixth and Hopper/Freel will likely be leading off more than Votto. It makes sense, though, with OBP at the top, power+OBP in the middle, and power at the bottom. Votto has been known to swipe a few bases, too.

  7. #81
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: If Hamilton is traded, who hits leadoff?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaiGuy View Post
    Votto (OBP)
    Edwin (OBP)
    Griffey
    Dunn (or switch Dunn and Griffey depending on who has the higher OBP at the time)
    Bruce
    Phillips (could see plenty of PA's with guys on base here, which is a good thing. All of the outs wouldn't hurt so much from the 6th spot)
    Gonzo
    Ross

    But, like Cyclone said, we will never see this lineup, mostly because Phillips will NEVER bat sixth and Hopper/Freel will likely be leading off more than Votto. It makes sense, though, with OBP at the top, power+OBP in the middle, and power at the bottom. Votto has been known to swipe a few bases, too.
    I find it interesting that you have a guy who hits 30 hrs, seals 30 bases, scores over 100 runs and drives in closer to 100 runs batting 6th. You can OBP me all day long but fact of the matter is he drove in runs last season and scored runs. I hit PHillips 3-5 this season and I sure as heck don't protect him with Gonzo and Ross.

  8. #82
    Member Stormy's Avatar
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    Re: If Hamilton is traded, who hits leadoff?

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor View Post
    Just curious, it seems like Votto's OB skills will be lost hitting in front of Gonzo and Ross. Now, I do think that is where Dusty will hit him, but what do you think about him at leadoff?
    What you're saying makes a great deal of sense, traderumor. A few factors that went into my rationale for hitting Votto 6th in the above scenario: His torrid 2007 start aside, I expect Bruce's OBP to match or exceed Votto's, and given Bruce's other skills, that might make Bruce more suitable as a top of the order hitter.

    In addition to the 'balance' of the above lineup, I like the idea of Phillips still having a potent bat behind him. Phillips already sees, and swings at, enough 'junk' as it is... and I don't want pitchers pitching completely around him to get to potential sub .300 OBP chum like Ross or Gonzo. Likewise, once we have enough ABs to determine Votto's true profile, I think we're going to find a very balanced hitter who provides both some power, and contact driven OBP (supplemented by good BB rates), which makes him a nice candidate to also plate some of the numerous RISP situations he should find himself in batting behind the likes of Dunn, Griffey, Phillips.

    Votto is a good candidate for leadoff on a team that lacks a true leadoff hitter, but I think that if Bruce can eventually replicate Votto's OBP (which should eventually hover in the 370+ range), then he's a little more suitable to navigate those waters. Ultimately, neither is a leadoff candidate, and should eventually be looked at more as #3 (Bruce)-5 (Votto) types, IMO.
    Last edited by Stormy; 12-24-2007 at 10:26 AM.

  9. #83
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: If Hamilton is traded, who hits leadoff?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stormy View Post
    What you're saying makes a great deal of sense, traderumor. A few factors that went into my rationale for hitting Votto 6th in the above scenario: His torrid 2007 start aside, I expect Bruce's OBP to match or exceed Votto's, and given Bruce's other skills, that might make Bruce more suitable as a top of the order hitter.

    In addition to the 'balance' of the above lineup, I like the idea of Phillips still having a potent bat behind him. Phillips already sees, and swings at, enough 'junk' as it is... and I don't want pitchers pitching completely around him to get to potential sub .300 OBP chum like Ross or Gonzo. Likewise, once we have enough ABs to determine Votto's true profile, I think we're going to find a very balanced hitter who provides both some power, and contact driven OBP (supplemented by good BB rates), which makes him a nice candidate to also plate some of the numerous RISP situations he should find himself in batting behind the likes of Dunn, Griffey, Phillips.

    Votto is a good candidate for leadoff on a team that lacks a true leadoff hitter, but I think that if Bruce can eventually replicate Votto's OBP (which should eventually hover in the 370+ range), then he's a little more suitable to navigate those waters. Ultimately, neither is a leadoff candidate, and should eventually be looked at more as #3 (Bruce)-5 (Votto) types, IMO.
    I agree with that, and my logic was based more on a lineup without a clear leadoff hitter, so I plugged in OBP for 2008. I backed off of Bruce because he has zero ML ABs and I just see that as throwing him immediately into the pressure cooker. And while Votto just has September to lean on, he does have that and was successful, so I consider him to be more confident and able to handle that responsibility early on. I would put that high on the 2009 priority list--now hitting leadoff and playing CF, whoever that might be--not named Juan Pierre, I might add

  10. #84
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    Re: If Hamilton is traded, who hits leadoff?

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    I find it interesting that you have a guy who hits 30 hrs, seals 30 bases, scores over 100 runs and drives in closer to 100 runs batting 6th. You can OBP me all day long but fact of the matter is he drove in runs last season and scored runs. I hit PHillips 3-5 this season and I sure as heck don't protect him with Gonzo and Ross.
    Exactly. Hitting him behind several high OBP guys could give him a lot of oppurtunity to use that power and drive guys in. Hitting him in front of the OBP guys simply wastes his power and wastes outs.

  11. #85
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: If Hamilton is traded, who hits leadoff?

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    I find it interesting that you have a guy who hits 30 hrs, seals 30 bases, scores over 100 runs and drives in closer to 100 runs batting 6th. You can OBP me all day long but fact of the matter is he drove in runs last season and scored runs. I hit PHillips 3-5 this season and I sure as heck don't protect him with Gonzo and Ross.
    OBP > SLG

    BP is miscast as a cleanup hitter, badly.
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."


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