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Thread: Swisher to White Sox

  1. #31
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by princeton View Post
    Giants?
    That's what I was thinking. Sabean's run that team under, Beane's the local darling, he's about to lose his shine with the A's and San Francisco will offer him a payroll to play with.

    My guess is when the Giants can Sabean (possibly after this season), they'll ask the A's about Beane and the response will be "Take him, he's all yours."
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

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  3. #32
    You're soaking in it! MartyFan's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    That's what I was thinking. Sabean's run that team under, Beane's the local darling, he's about to lose his shine with the A's and San Francisco will offer him a payroll to play with.

    My guess is when the Giants can Sabean (possibly after this season), they'll ask the A's about Beane and the response will be "Take him, he's all yours."
    Didn't Beane just not so long ago get a deal where he owns a percentage of the team?
    I can't believe the the A's would let him go to SF...talk about "In your face" move when he brings The Bay a series championship...whew.
    "Sometimes, it's not the sexiest moves that put you over the top," Krivsky said. "It's a series of transactions that help you get there."

  4. #33
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    My guess is when the Giants can Sabean (possibly after this season), they'll ask the A's about Beane and the response will be "Take him, he's all yours."

    see, I'm hoping that Beane trades himself for ugly pitchers and guys with high OBPs.

  5. #34
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    So let me get this straight. Beane trades two of his best players, both players who he had control over for into 2010 for cheap? This is also a team who added a player or two would have been a threat in the AL West. If Im an A's fan I am pissed. IMO Beane is operating in a 3 year window for his best players. I think this is selling stupid rather than selling high.

  6. #35
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    IMO Beane is operating in a 3 year window for his best players. I think this is selling stupid rather than selling high.
    it's a great point. Add in the fact that rookies/2nd year players generally struggle, and it's a very small window. It's like that window that the rockets have to hit on reentry or else they burn up or bounce off into space

    Beane seems more like Connie Mack-- he just no longer wanted to win with THESE guys

  7. #36
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    So let me get this straight. Beane trades two of his best players, both players who he had control over for into 2010 for cheap? This is also a team who added a player or two would have been a threat in the AL West. If Im an A's fan I am pissed. IMO Beane is operating in a 3 year window for his best players. I think this is selling stupid rather than selling high.
    I tend to agree. He's basically casting off the major leaguers he should be building around in order to get the kids to build around them.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

  8. #37
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by princeton View Post
    see, I'm hoping that Beane trades himself for ugly pitchers and guys with high OBPs.
    Beane's seemingly become bored with OB.

    More than that, he seems to be on a mission to collect position players without any outstanding talents. He's putting together a custard of a team.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

  9. #38
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    So let me get this straight. Beane trades two of his best players, both players who he had control over for into 2010 for cheap? This is also a team who added a player or two would have been a threat in the AL West. If Im an A's fan I am pissed. IMO Beane is operating in a 3 year window for his best players. I think this is selling stupid rather than selling high.
    Yep, I agree.

    I think it's sad. Every team in baseball just
    got a huge infusion of cash from the central fund,
    and Beane is tearing down the team.

    Sure, maybe intellectually, now is the time to do it.
    Everyone is flush with cash and willing to take on salaries.
    However, trading vets for prospects is always dicey. It's kind
    of like playing against the house in Vegas, most of the time, you
    lose.

    I'd be pretty peeved if the Reds decided to dump Harang and Phillips
    right now for prospects and had others on their "dump list". That's
    analogous to what the A's are doing now.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  10. #39
    Making sense of it all Matt700wlw's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    I bet the Oakland fans don't like this...

  11. #40
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I tend to agree. He's basically casting off the major leaguers he should be building around in order to get the kids to build around them.
    But it's a catch 22 then -- it's similar to the position the Reds are in. How do you get enough of supporting cast without sacrificing the core around which you are supposed to build. I think the decision Beane made was that he had no way to get enough talent to supplement the existing core without breaking up the core itself.

    If he looked at his roster and his system and said, I have no way of adding 15+ wins to this team in the next 3 years without increasing payroll and without trading away my core, then what would you have him do? Should he have packaged up the few decent prospects left and tried in vain to win 88 games in 2008 or 2009? Should he have crossed his fingers and prayed that he'd get 200 IP out of Harden and 60 from Street?

    It's a catch 22. If your team isn't currently good enough (they weren't), there isn't much help on the way internally (there wasn't), and you don't have the money to obtain it in FA or salary dump trades (they don't), then you have to strip it of it's parts, maximizing value and building a better system for the next run.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  12. #41
    Charlie Brown All-Star IslandRed's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    More than that, he seems to be on a mission to collect position players without any outstanding talents. He's putting together a custard of a team.
    Maybe a post-Moneyball lesson is, bargain-shopping for medium-to-good players can work, but stars aren't as easy to come by as Michael Lewis made it sound.
    Not all who wander are lost

  13. #42
    Member Highlifeman21's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    Thank God we were on the right side of the Harang deal.
    Valentine was the big return coming to us in that deal.

    Harang redeemed the return on that trade.

  14. #43
    Please come again pedro's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    My friends in Oakland were pissed off when the A's traded Marco Scutaro.

    I bet they're losing their minds about right now.
    Get your nunchucks and the keys to your dad's car. I know where we can get a gun

  15. #44
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    I find it hard that Beane could be lauded by some as a genius for years and now is just clueless.

    Earlier this offseason he made a quote that I thought was brilliant. It was something along the lines of "There's no use being in the middle." If you are just treading water and your ceiling is just being competitive, then what's the use of paying for a middle of the road team? Oakland had an $80 million payroll this past season according to USA Today. As an owner, I would be unhappy if I was paying that in Oakland and not making noise in the playoffs. Tear it down and build it back up.

    If he thinks that they had no shot with the current roster and can allocate those funds to making the team a monster in 3-5 years, then he is a very smart and courageous man. I've wanted Cincy to do this the past few years.

  16. #45
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Swisher to White Sox

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    If your team isn't currently good enough (they weren't), there isn't much help on the way internally (there wasn't), and you don't have the money to obtain it in FA or salary dump trades (they don't), then you have to strip it of it's parts, maximizing value and building a better system for the next run.
    I don't disagree, but it's still no fun to put up a Rip Van Winkle sign on the franchise. The A's are going down for a long snooze.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.


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