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Thread: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

  1. #46
    Pre-tty, pre-tty good!! MWM's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfan30 View Post
    I know I'll get torn apart for this, but with the game on the line in the 9th inning, who do you have more confidence in that they're going to get the job done? Brandon Phillips or Adam Dunn?
    Depends on how you define "the job."
    Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David


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  3. #47
    Member Jpup's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfan30 View Post
    I know I'll get torn apart for this, but with the game on the line in the 9th inning, who do you have more confidence in that they're going to get the job done? Brandon Phillips or Adam Dunn?

    Answer's pretty easy.
    yes, you are right. It's Adam Dunn.
    "My mission is to be the ray of hope, the guy who stands out there on that beautiful field and owns up to his mistakes and lets people know it's never completely hopeless, no matter how bad it seems at the time. I have a platform and a message, and now I go to bed at night, sober and happy, praying I can be a good messenger." -Josh Hamilton

  4. #48
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Phillips plays solid D in the middle of the diamond and is a very good baserunner. Dunn is weak in leftfield both in terms of range and arm. He is an average baserunner at best. Then, if you want to evaluate them as future assets, Dunn is older, has had a knee operation and has a body type that's unlikely to age well. Phillips is younger and has had no injuries.

    If it's me throwing the $$$ around, and it can only go to one or the other, it goes to Phillips.

  5. #49
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfan30 View Post
    I know I'll get torn apart for this, but with the game on the line in the 9th inning, who do you have more confidence in that they're going to get the job done? Brandon Phillips or Adam Dunn?

    Answer's pretty easy.

    (PS. I like Adam Dunn and I stay so far away from 99.9% of the Dunn related threads on this board because I don't think he's nearly as bad as some make him out to be but I also don't think he's nearly as good as the other half makes him out to be. Ok, back to my hiding spot.)
    If "the job" is doing something which increases the Reds chance of winning, I'll put my money on Adam Dunn every time.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  6. #50
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    If "the job" is doing something which increases the Reds chance of winning, I'll put my money on Adam Dunn every time.
    Dunn beat Phillips in Win Shares last year 21-18. Phillips leads 4-3 this year. It's fairly close. For the record, I like Dunn plenty and would like him to stay with the Reds, but I place a higher value on a multi-faceted middle IF. I actually think they complement each other nicely. I only wish the Reds had more appealing options like those two to put into "who's better" debates. The real answer is they're different and valuable.
    I'm not a system player. I am a system.

  7. #51
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    The real answer is they're different and valuable.
    Yep, and both bring facets to the game that don't have to be viewed as separate alien entities in a world that consists of only predestined incidents and solutions.

    Both cause the other team to have to react to their game and that is the beauty of having both types of players on your team, because it hopefully will thin the options down as the game progresses.

  8. #52
    Member RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Dunn beat Phillips in Win Shares last year 21-18. Phillips leads 4-3 this year. It's fairly close. For the record, I like Dunn plenty and would like him to stay with the Reds, but I place a higher value on a multi-faceted middle IF. I actually think they complement each other nicely. I only wish the Reds had more appealing options like those two to put into "who's better" debates. The real answer is they're different and valuable.
    I agree completely. I also wish our manager knew how better to utilize their skills. Corey Patterson getting an at bat in the 9th, and Dunn not getting one, is a perfect example.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  9. #53
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Some people loose the forest through the secondary-average trees.

  10. #54
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    I agree completely. I also wish our manager knew how better to utilize their skills. Corey Patterson getting an at bat in the 9th, and Dunn not getting one, is a perfect example.
    Agreed there. Yet one problem Baker has at the moment is he's really only got two top-four hitters at his disposal (at least against RHPs) - Dunn and Votto. That neither hit in the top four is an indictment of his lineups, but it means that two non-ideal hitters would need to be in that mix even if he better deployed Dunn and Votto. My take is, with this roster, Brandon Phillips needs to be one of those two other guys.
    I'm not a system player. I am a system.

  11. #55
    Ripsnort wheels's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Agreed there. Yet one problem Baker has at the moment is he's really only got two top-four hitters at his disposal (at least against RHPs) - Dunn and Votto. That neither hit in the top four is an indictment of his lineups, but it means that two non-ideal hitters would need to be in that mix even if he better deployed Dunn and Votto. My take is, with this roster, Brandon Phillips needs to be one of those two other guys.
    You don't think EE's a top four guy yet?
    "Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?" ~ Jim Bouton

  12. #56
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    I was going to suggest that EE isn't too far off at all from being neck and neck with Phillips in terms of overall importance/value to this team.

  13. #57
    Ripsnort wheels's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Yep, and both bring facets to the game that don't have to be viewed as separate alien entities in a world that consists of only predestined incidents and solutions.

    Both cause the other team to have to react to their game and that is the beauty of having both types of players on your team, because it hopefully will thin the options down as the game progresses.
    Yow!

    Couldn't agree more.

    Where have you been lately?
    "Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?" ~ Jim Bouton

  14. #58
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Quote Originally Posted by wheels View Post
    You don't think EE's a top four guy yet?
    The top 4 by career numbers, as posted earlier.

    Code:
    		BA	OBP	SLG	OPS
    1  Griffey	.297	.386	.570	.956
    2  Dunn		.251	.389	.535	.925
    3  Votto	.298	.344	.574	.919
    4  Encarnacion	.272	.336	.456	.792
    I think he's clearly top 4 vR on the Reds as of today, and you were inclined to remove Junior, you likely could replace him with Bruce. Freel was 5th.

    That said, until Dusty gets it out of his head that speed is characteristic #1 for a leadoff guy, we'll never get the right guys up there.

    Here's a top 5 that even Dusty should be able to stomach, but I still doubt we'll see on any regular basis thanks to his lefty-right obsession.

    Freel
    Votto
    Grifffey
    Dunn
    EE
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  15. #59
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Quote Originally Posted by wheels View Post
    You don't think EE's a top four guy yet?
    Nyet, more of a 5-6 guy, which is a perfectly fine hitter. Phillips is really that sort of guy too, but I put him ahead of EE due mainly to consistency. Phillips will probably spend most of the year hitting north of .280 and he's more sluggy.
    I'm not a system player. I am a system.

  16. #60
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    Re: Brandon Phillips and Redszone

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    Here's a top 5 that even Dusty should be able to stomach, but I still doubt we'll see on any regular basis thanks to his lefty-right obsession.

    Freel
    Votto
    Grifffey
    Dunn
    EE
    Phillips is going to out-OPS three guys on that list, maybe four.
    I'm not a system player. I am a system.


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