On hustle

[Hoosier Red]

A couple of things frustrated me last night in the Reds win. They were highlighted by the FSN crew so I apologize if this was discussed last night.

Phillips jogging down the line on his ground ball and Bruce easing up on his way to 2nd(and getting thrown out doing it.)

I understand a bunch of try hard guys are going to lose to a bunch of talented guys. And I don't advocate running 9 Ryan Freel's out there.

But is there any reason players don't hustle?
I was especially troubled by Bruce because 1. He's a rookie 2. He was running hard and stopped, how does that make any sense?

[hebroncougar]

Simple, Bruce is just modeling what the vets on the team send out as vibes. There doesn't seem to be a sense of urgency for darn near anyone on this team. It's mind boggling to me, but I guess they see guys like Patterson, Arroyo, Valentin, etc. hang around and not produce, so why bother? That's my take.

[jojo]

It's white line fever.....

Once that sets in, the only remedy is amputation.

[Cooper]

The lack of running out plays is a direct reflection of the manager. I like BP, but it's got to the point where he looks like he's showing up his manager. He's running at 25% on some ground balls- barely a fast walk. He watches when he hits a fly ball and then starts running ifit falls.

EE does the same kind of thing, but it isn't quite as obvious.

Why is Baker putting up with it? At least go through the motions of running at a light jog.

Anyone think it's a symptom of a larger problem?

[BCubb2003]

A noticeable drop in hustle in the post-amphetamine era?

[icehole3]

Be honest, isnt Jr the kingpin of this? He basically skips around the bases and out of the batters box. Our worse fear is being realized, the younger players have it in their minds that its OK to skip here and there, wont change until Jr is outta here.

[dougdirt]

Jr is the only one on the team with a legit excuse not to at least give 75% on a grounder on the infield. You get a pass when your hamstring is screwed to your leg. I am not much of a 'hustle' guy, because I don't think it matters all that much 99% of the time.

[Cooper]

Junior may do it, but Baker is in charge and could say something along the lines of

"Jr has earned the chance to not bust everytime because he has bad legs--you young guys haven't earned that".

Every manager in the world has different rules for different guys - they have to sell what they are preaching orthey can go about blaming the veterans on the team for setting a bad example...but that's a huge cop out.

Dusty is paid to lead and be in charge. He's the one who has to lay down the law and get things done. He needs to lead.

[Cooper]

Hustle is hard to calculate and figure its worth. It may not be worth more than a base a game (i don't have any way of knowing). This is a 6th place team going down quickly -hustle is one of the last things this club has to sell to keep fans from leaving for the rest of the season.

Hustle matters because it's a product this team can sell: "come see our young guys play" should be the PR mantra for the rest of the season, but if you're gonna tell fans it doesn't matter than that's 1 less thing you got to offer to keep them from leaving. Seems silly to throw it into the river of intangibles that aren't important.

[RollyInRaleigh]

Sounds like a recipe for the type of the every day veteran leadership that this team may need to acquire. It would also help if that veteran leadership could swing the bat effectively from the right side of the plate.

[Wheelhouse]

Be honest, isnt Jr the kingpin of this? He basically skips around the bases and out of the batters box. Our worse fear is being realized, the younger players have it in their minds that its OK to skip here and there, wont change until Jr is outta here.

You got it.

[icehole3]

Whether Jr has earned it or not, that to me doesnt matter, what matters is if the leader of the team does it... it will creep into the minds of the youth on this team and go ahead and excuse it if you wanna, I aint, dont like it and never will, I wont move off my stance and neither will you guys, so it is what it is and in my opinion which I already know aint worth nothing, if Jr's gone the healing begins. Thats all I got to say.

[Wheelhouse]

Jr is the only one on the team with a legit excuse not to at least give 75% on a grounder on the infield. You get a pass when your hamstring is screwed to your leg. I am not much of a 'hustle' guy, because I don't think it matters all that much 99% of the time.

Yeah, that's what Hal McCoy is CONSTANTLY saying about Jr.--but you know what, if Jr. was so concerned about protecting himself from injury, he'd lose 20 lbs.. He is plain overweight, and the risk of injury to his legs due to that is huge. If he dropped some pounds it might help his bat speed a little too. So I don't buy that argument. BTW, his father was never in that kind of shape at any point in his career.

[Wheelhouse]

Hustle is hard to calculate and figure its worth. It may not be worth more than a base a game (i don't have any way of knowing). This is a 6th place team going down quickly -hustle is one of the last things this club has to sell to keep fans from leaving for the rest of the season.

Hustle matters because it's a product this team can sell: "come see our young guys play" should be the PR mantra for the rest of the season, but if you're gonna tell fans it doesn't matter than that's 1 less thing you got to offer to keep them from leaving. Seems silly to throw it into the river of intangibles that aren't important.

This is the logical flaw of those who favor statistical analysis--if an attribute cannot be measured or calculated, it is assumed that it cannot have great meaning to the outcome of a game. Faulty logic.

[redsmetz]

Yeah, that's what Hal McCoy is CONSTANTLY saying about Jr.--but you know what, if Jr. was so concerned about protecting himself from injury, he'd lose 20 lbs.. He is plain overweight, and the risk of injury to his legs due to that is huge. If he dropped some pounds it might help his bat speed a little too. So I don't buy that argument. BTW, his father was never in that kind of shape at any point in his career.

I can't find pictures that I can put side by side, but I often now comment about how Junior's body structure is resembling his dad's more and more. I doubt that he's carrying 20 extra pounds.