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Thread: CC being targeted by Milwaukee

  1. #31
    Member Spring~Fields's Avatar
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    Re: CC being targeted by Milwaukee

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRedsFan View Post
    As close as any of us could compile, I think.
    I tried. I was discouraged after trying to be conservative, ie realistic.

    I thought that I saw that the team was kind of backed against the wall. Which was forcing me to come back to much of what yourself and others have suggested, the team just doesn't have enough talent, and has too many holes to seriously contend with the high dollar clubs, I'm adding that point because I think, it too is a factor. I wonder if the club can move any decent players without causing problems else where.

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  3. #32
    Pitching is the thing WVRedsFan's Avatar
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    Re: CC being targeted by Milwaukee

    Quote Originally Posted by Spring~Fields View Post
    I tried. I was discouraged after trying to be conservative, ie realistic.

    I thought that I saw that the team was kind of backed against the wall. Which was forcing me to come back to much of what yourself and others have suggested, the team just doesn't have enough talent, and has too many holes to seriously contend with the high dollar clubs, I'm adding that point because I think, it too is a factor. I wonder if the club can move any decent players without causing problems else where.
    Bad decisions, IMHO. caused the "holes." I won't get into it because it causes some blood pressure problems for many members, but when you choose the wrong players to fill spots, and give them lucrative contracts, you get stuck. Shorstop is only one position where that is true. My prediction is that it will take 3-5 years to overcome that. Sad, but true. I hope Jocketty can pull a rabbit out of a hat, but it will take that and more.
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  4. #33
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: CC being targeted by Milwaukee

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRedsFan View Post
    Bad decisions, IMHO. caused the "holes." I won't get into it because it causes some blood pressure problems for many members, but when you choose the wrong players to fill spots, and give them lucrative contracts, you get stuck. Shorstop is only one position where that is true. My prediction is that it will take 3-5 years to overcome that. Sad, but true.
    Why should it take 3-5 years to "overcome" the SS position? Even with Kepp at SS it's not a total disaster. He's proven capable though I'd like Walt to find a better option.

    The only guaranteed contracts, after the '08 season, that Walt will still possess are three pitchers (Harang/Arroyo/Cordero), and three position players (Phillips/Freel/Gonzo). After that he's free and clear at season's end.

    I'm not going to argue whether or not the Freel and Gonzo contracts are bad or not. It wasn't the wisest monies spent I agree. 9 mil total committed to both in '09. They are gone after next season.

    Only that that 9 mil is not hamstringing or proving to be a disaster to this organization in relation to the amount of money he can have available at season's end, and into the off-season, to spend to acquire those players and fill needs.

    Walt has a heck of a lot of options open to him. And the clock starts ticking as the trading deadline approaches. But even if he can't find viable trades for some of our players that Walt might be dangling.... whether it's a Dunn, Harang, Arroyo, Weathers, Affeldt, or whoever.... a lot of the so-called fodder on this team can be allowed to take care of itself by being allowed to walk.

    It's just to Walt's advantage if he can trade some of them and get some sort of player return.

    But again.... he has a lot of options open to him. He should still be expected to make those moves/decisions, regardless of contracts like a Freel/Gonzo, to improve (move this team forward) going into '09.
    Last edited by GAC; 07-06-2008 at 10:23 AM.
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  5. #34
    Member Spring~Fields's Avatar
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    Re: CC being targeted by Milwaukee

    Quote Originally Posted by GAC View Post
    Why should it take 3-5 years to "overcome" the SS position? Even with Kepp at SS it's not a total disaster. He's proven capable though I'd like Walt to find a better option.
    I can solve the SS problem in just the stroke of the pen, today!
    Phillips SS
    Hairston, Keppinger 2B

    If those two can play SS, surely Phillips who is superior to them can play SS.

    The only guaranteed contracts, after the '08 season, that Walt will still possess are three pitchers (Harang/Arroyo/Cordero), and three position players (Phillips/Freel/Gonzo). After that he's free and clear at season's end.
    Long term guaranteed contracts have burnt the Reds and their fans often. Often I say I want x or y player gone, when I really mean I want the long term guaranteed contract gone, because of the financial constraints that they place on offense or the pitching when ownership insists on under funding the team against the competitors that they have in the central, expecting every general manager or manager to work miracles or be fired.

    Long term contracts for the Reds have meant DL list
    Milton
    Griffey
    Gonzo
    Freel
    Paul Wilson
    The ones that I can think of right off the top of my head.

    Those normally lead to giving one or two players the majority percentage of the payroll for offense/pitching or the club entirely. Making it necessary for the team to fill in with fodder and fillers vs performers of higher quality, league average would be nice vs. filler/fodder.

    I'm not going to argue whether or not the Freel and Gonzo contracts are bad or not. It wasn't the wisest monies spent I agree. 9 mil total committed to both in '09. They are gone after next season.
    I don't see how you can if you are going to leave out Pattersons unemployment check of $3 million.
    Last edited by Spring~Fields; 07-06-2008 at 12:35 PM.

  6. #35
    Member Spring~Fields's Avatar
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    Re: CC being targeted by Milwaukee

    Quote Originally Posted by GAC View Post
    Walt has a heck of a lot of options open to him. And the clock starts ticking as the trading deadline approaches. But even if he can't find viable trades for some of our players that Walt might be dangling.... whether it's a Dunn, Harang, Arroyo, Weathers, Affeldt, or whoever.... a lot of the so-called fodder on this team can be allowed to take care of itself by being allowed to walk.
    A team that is under funded against their nearest competitors, who always outbid them for player resources, will continue to shuffle fodder in and fodder out. The names will change, but fodder is fodder. That is one of the points that Edabbs and FCB make, that we cannot deny.
    Last edited by Spring~Fields; 07-06-2008 at 12:44 PM.


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