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Thread: Red Sox plan to convert Masterson into reliever after Triple-A stint

  1. #31
    Titanic Struggles Caveat Emperor's Avatar
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    Re: Red Sox plan to convert Masterson into reliever after Triple-A stint

    Quote Originally Posted by flyer85 View Post
    starter in the pen ... blasphemy.
    If his ceiling is a bullpen pitcher, the smarter move is to pawn him off on some team that will overvalue him as a starter. Barring that, good move recognizing it this early in his career.

    If his ceiling is a starting pitcher, then they're just wasting a valuable pre-arb year.
    Championships Matter.
    23 Years and Counting...

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  3. #32
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Red Sox plan to convert Masterson into reliever after Triple-A stint

    Quote Originally Posted by Spring~Fields View Post
    REDREAD, I give up too, read the fine print and disclaimer. You're too quick to cherry pick selectively for me. That is why I responded that way to you, and have recently, you do that frequently, cherry pick, some line or two, and blow off the rest. We all do. but sometimes that doesn't cover it.
    That wasn't intended.. I thought you were asking feedback on your proposed deal..

    If you were talking in general terms, I will say that I don't know how we could trade for Masterson without giving up a young talent like Burton in return. If the Red Sox needed a DH/1b, I'm sure they'd prefer Votto to Dunn..

    My take on Arroyo is that the Reds are better off holding on to him and hoping he bounces back. No point in selling him for pennies on the dollar. No point in giving him away just to get payflex. Part of the "plan" to turn this team around depends on Arroyo getting straightened out. Then he can either contribute or be traded for something that is actually useful in the future.

    Sure, go ahead and shop Arroyo just in case someone is willing to offer something attractive, but don't go out looking to dump him.

    As far as Dunn goes, the time to trade him and get a decent return has long passed. I said this many years ago.. every year that we keep Dunn, his value goes down because he's getting older, closer to FA, and more expensive. Not many people agreed at the time, but it's true. There are many parallel examples.. For example, the Red Sox put Manny Ramerez on waivers a few years ago and no one claimed him, despite the fact that Manny is very productive on the field. Anyhow, the point is that the last real opportunity to trade Dunn was last July, before his trade restrictions kicked in. Obviously, trading him before then would've netted an even bigger return.
    The Reds decided that Dunn was part of their neartime plans.. Right or wrong, they have to live with that decision now, because part of the cost for having Dunn for the last few years is that now he's not worth much on the trade market.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  4. #33
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Red Sox plan to convert Masterson into reliever after Triple-A stint

    Quote Originally Posted by Spring~Fields View Post
    Well then Jojo, then don't do that. Listen to your own advice. projection and transference does not become you jojo.

    projection and transference

    psychology unconscious transfer of feeling: the unconscious ascription of a personal thought, feeling, or impulse, especially one considered undesirable, to somebody else

    psychology redirection of feeling: in psychoanalysis or other psychotherapy, the process in which somebody unconsciously redirects feelings about something onto a new object, often the analyst or therapist.
    I have absolutely no clue what you're saying, as is sometimes the case when we discuss stuff, so I'll just respond by saying that I admire your spunk.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  5. #34
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    Re: Red Sox plan to convert Masterson into reliever after Triple-A stint

    Quote Originally Posted by Spring~Fields View Post
    For who ? One unproven young pitcher named Masteron with a small sample of a good season ? NO

    Question for you, what do you think the Reds are going to get for either Dunn, Griffey or Affeldt?
    They're not together going to get Masterson - that's for sure. The BoSox regarding Masterson very highly - given that Sabathia is a rental and Masterson is under control for a long time in baseball terms then you see where the trade market is.

    There is a load of difference between saying the REDS could do with Masterson and then jump on the GM for not getting him. The BoSox have a ton of good pitching at the starting level and while they have had some problem with middle relief its not dire.

  6. #35
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Red Sox plan to convert Masterson into reliever after Triple-A stint

    Quote Originally Posted by Caveat Emperor View Post
    If his ceiling is a starting pitcher, then they're just wasting a valuable pre-arb year.
    Red Sox could care less about that ... they are all about repeating as World Champs and Masterson has shown the ability to dominate RHBs.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

  7. #36
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    Re: Red Sox plan to convert Masterson into reliever after Triple-A stint

    The Red Sox don't need to worry about that as they are looking at their best pitchers in the organization rather than the best starting pitchers. If they need an additional starting pitcher they will just try to convert Masterson back - much like they were contemplating doing with Papelbon over the winter.

  8. #37
    Member Spring~Fields's Avatar
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    Re: Red Sox plan to convert Masterson into reliever after Triple-A stint

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    I have absolutely no clue what you're saying, as is sometimes the case when we discuss stuff, so I'll just respond by saying that I admire your spunk.
    That's what I had discerned about you, spunk. and more of it.
    Last edited by Spring~Fields; 07-08-2008 at 08:36 PM.

  9. #38
    Member Spring~Fields's Avatar
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    Re: Red Sox plan to convert Masterson into reliever after Triple-A stint

    Quote Originally Posted by Nugget View Post
    They're not together going to get Masterson - that's for sure. The BoSox regarding Masterson very highly - given that Sabathia is a rental and Masterson is under control for a long time in baseball terms then you see where the trade market is.

    There is a load of difference between saying the REDS could do with Masterson and then jump on the GM for not getting him. The BoSox have a ton of good pitching at the starting level and while they have had some problem with middle relief its not dire.
    I can buy that, the Reds are going to get fodder and filler.

    They don't have the money to compete in the real business world. Or they would.
    I have been tracking this investor group or a part of it for years, as the fans chase their tails wondering and wondering when, when are the Reds going to be competitive.

    They are, in their return on investment for the investors, they are winning where it counts, at the bank.
    Last edited by Spring~Fields; 07-08-2008 at 07:52 PM.

  10. #39
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Red Sox plan to convert Masterson into reliever after Triple-A stint

    Quote Originally Posted by Nugget View Post
    The Red Sox don't need to worry about that as they are looking at their best pitchers in the organization rather than the best starting pitchers. If they need an additional starting pitcher they will just try to convert Masterson back - much like they were contemplating doing with Papelbon over the winter.
    They've pretty much planned on Masterson being a bullpen arm albeit a good one. They fact he gave them some innings from the rotation in a pinch is really more gravy than anything else. They hope he'll be a high leverage pen ace.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  11. #40
    Member blumj's Avatar
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    Re: Red Sox plan to convert Masterson into reliever after Triple-A stint

    http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...=.jsp&c_id=mlb


    "Yesterdays' move should in no way reflect our evaluation of [Masterson] as a starter," said Epstein. "He has no limitations on what he can do in the future, in the big leagues. Really, this was the plan all along, that we expected him to be someone who protects our starting rotation in the first half of the year as he continues his development in the Minor Leagues, but in the second half of the year, he really helps our bullpen like he's done effectively in the past, albeit at the Minor League level, and the Cape Cod League."
    "Reality tells us there are no guarantees. Except that some day Jon Lester will be on that list of 100-game winners." - Peter Gammons


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