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Thread: The Three Guys for Dunn...

  1. #1
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    The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Nasty_Boy
    It's Buck, Owings, and Castillo

    So:

    A Defensive-minded young catcher
    A Tommy John recovering A baller with tons of potential
    A Rick-Ankiel-light possibility.

    The catcher is the most major-league ready - albeit stick-less.

    Buck is as useful as a comp pick IMO, since he won't be in the majors anytime soon, if at all, so no better than a high draft pick - sans the signing bonus.

    To me, it all hinges on Owings.
    If he can return to his 4.3 ERA/1.3 WHIP than he's useful in the short-term for us, which makes it a better deal than 2 comp picks.


    of note: Buck did go 5 innings of 1hit, 4K ball in his first stint. That's promising. Still, pretty far to go.

    PEACE

    -BLEEDS
    I think that in a year or two, one of these guys - Frazier, Dorn, Valaika, Cumberland, Stubbs - will be ready to replace Dunn. They won't hit as many home runs as Dunn, but they should have similar OPS. - 757690, July 22, 2008

    Alonso will be playing 1B for the REDS and batting 4th one year from today. - Kingspoint, July 9, 2009

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  3. #2
    Member tommycash's Avatar
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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    I agree that it all hinges on Owings, and I think that IMO this trade (although he is worth more) was better than getting comp picks. That is just my opinion though.
    Jack Eliot: I'm a World Series MVP!
    Skip: That was four years ago, Jack. Last season, you hit .235.
    Jack Eliot: LAST SEASON, I led this team in ninth-inning doubles in the month of August!

    ---Mr. Baseball 1992

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    Member mroby85's Avatar
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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Newsflash, Dunn wasn't that great either.

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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    while dunn might not have been great.. we also cant give up on owings as a pitcher.. he might be better than ankiel as an all around player.. but he hasnt sunk to nothing as a pitcher quite yet..

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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Quote Originally Posted by mroby85 View Post
    Newsflash, Dunn wasn't that great either.
    Newsflash... You're wrong.

    Anyways... I think Buck will be the best of the bunch. Owings doesn't impress me as a pitcher and I think he'll give up a large number of HRs in GABP. He might be better suited for relief. Buck is still working his way back, but if he gets his velocity back in the 92-93 range he will be very a welcome sight because he is an extreme ground ball pitcher. I'm happy about the acquisition of Castillo because if nothting else, he's not Bako Valentine Ross Moeller or LaRue. Back to Owings... I think that the Reds should really think outside the box with him. He throws hard and he could probably throw harder in relief. Myabe he could be a 1B backup and a RH bat off the bench while still being available in relief. He's obviously a very talented baseball player... Maybe the Reds should try to maximize that talent.

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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Quote Originally Posted by BLEEDS View Post
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Nasty_Boy
    It's Buck, Owings, and Castillo

    So:

    A Defensive-minded young catcher
    A Tommy John recovering A baller with tons of potential
    A Rick-Ankiel-light possibility.

    The catcher is the most major-league ready - albeit stick-less.

    Buck is as useful as a comp pick IMO, since he won't be in the majors anytime soon, if at all, so no better than a high draft pick - sans the signing bonus.

    To me, it all hinges on Owings.
    If he can return to his 4.3 ERA/1.3 WHIP than he's useful in the short-term for us, which makes it a better deal than 2 comp picks.


    of note: Buck did go 5 innings of 1hit, 4K ball in his first stint. That's promising. Still, pretty far to go.

    PEACE

    -BLEEDS

    How about Babe Ruth light instead, Ankiel's batting numbers as a pitcher compared to Owings as a pitcher is like comparing Edwin to Pujols.

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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    I think people are over looking Castillo. He is good defensively and I am assuming he has a good arm since he has played some SS. However, he isn't going to be a slouch at the plate. Doesn't K which is a welcome sight from our previous catchers. And he also has some speed which is also a far cry from our catchers. He won't be great but I could see him being a .250 hitter who can handle the bat well, and be our catcher until we figure out Mesoraco.

  9. #8
    Member tommycash's Avatar
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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Quote Originally Posted by mroby85 View Post
    Newsflash, Dunn wasn't that great either.
    I am not Dunn's biggest fan nor am I his biggest critic. I always thought that if the Reds had a right handed power hitter to compliment him, Dunn would have been doing things that would please mostly everyone. That never happened. But surely Adam Dunn is worth more in a trade than one guy who is major league ready (but far from being a star) and two guys who may never pan out at all. I am not saying the Reds got shafted, with Dunn's contract coming up, I think we did much better than we could have in the supplemental draft. Don't you think Dunn would have yielded more in a trade if he had more years on his contract?
    Jack Eliot: I'm a World Series MVP!
    Skip: That was four years ago, Jack. Last season, you hit .235.
    Jack Eliot: LAST SEASON, I led this team in ninth-inning doubles in the month of August!

    ---Mr. Baseball 1992

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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Correct me if I'm wrong but dont you have to offer arbitration to a player before letting him go to recieve the compansation picks? This deal makes it clear to me the Reds didnt want him back because there is a good chance Dunn would have taken them up on the arbitration.

    Quote Originally Posted by BLEEDS View Post
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Nasty_Boy
    It's Buck, Owings, and Castillo

    So:

    A Defensive-minded young catcher
    A Tommy John recovering A baller with tons of potential
    A Rick-Ankiel-light possibility.

    The catcher is the most major-league ready - albeit stick-less.

    Buck is as useful as a comp pick IMO, since he won't be in the majors anytime soon, if at all, so no better than a high draft pick - sans the signing bonus.

    To me, it all hinges on Owings.
    If he can return to his 4.3 ERA/1.3 WHIP than he's useful in the short-term for us, which makes it a better deal than 2 comp picks.


    of note: Buck did go 5 innings of 1hit, 4K ball in his first stint. That's promising. Still, pretty far to go.

    PEACE

    -BLEEDS

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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nasty_Boy View Post
    Newsflash... You're wrong.
    Newsflash. You're double dog wrong!
    Who's on first?

  12. #11
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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Quote Originally Posted by ChatterRed View Post
    Newsflash. You're double dog wrong!
    Newsflash... Nuh Uhh!

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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Quote Originally Posted by Orodle View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong but dont you have to offer arbitration to a player before letting him go to recieve the compansation picks? This deal makes it clear to me the Reds didnt want him back because there is a good chance Dunn would have taken them up on the arbitration.
    Yes. No way would have have accepted it - for some reason only those who bash Dunn believe that would be the case.

    He was looking for the BIG Guaranteed Deal.

    You'll see he'll get the same thing from Arizona, part of the reason they were willing to give up 3 guys AND pay 1/2 his remaining salary - they're going to get 2 comp picks back now.

    PEACE

    -BLEEDS
    I think that in a year or two, one of these guys - Frazier, Dorn, Valaika, Cumberland, Stubbs - will be ready to replace Dunn. They won't hit as many home runs as Dunn, but they should have similar OPS. - 757690, July 22, 2008

    Alonso will be playing 1B for the REDS and batting 4th one year from today. - Kingspoint, July 9, 2009

  14. #13
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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Quote Originally Posted by Orodle View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong but dont you have to offer arbitration to a player before letting him go to recieve the compansation picks? This deal makes it clear to me the Reds didnt want him back because there is a good chance Dunn would have taken them up on the arbitration.
    Dunn's incentive for taking an arbitration deal is practically nil.

    In arb he'd be getting at least 13 million but I can't see him getting much more than that.

    Even on the open market, if he takes less than that per year he's still better off taking a multi-year dear because almost all baseball money is gauranteed. If he got 11 mil per year for 3 years, that's 33 mil in gauranteed money, as opposed to only 13. The security of multi-year deals makes it better to take them.

  15. #14
    Next Year redsbuckeye's Avatar
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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Quote Originally Posted by ChatterRed View Post
    Newsflash. You're double dog wrong!
    NEWSFLASH: I liek grapes!

  16. #15
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    Re: The Three Guys for Dunn...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nasty_Boy View Post
    Newsflash... You're wrong.

    Anyways... I think Buck will be the best of the bunch. Owings doesn't impress me as a pitcher and I think he'll give up a large number of HRs in GABP. He might be better suited for relief. Buck is still working his way back, but if he gets his velocity back in the 92-93 range he will be very a welcome sight because he is an extreme ground ball pitcher. I'm happy about the acquisition of Castillo because if nothting else, he's not Bako Valentine Ross Moeller or LaRue. Back to Owings... I think that the Reds should really think outside the box with him. He throws hard and he could probably throw harder in relief. Myabe he could be a 1B backup and a RH bat off the bench while still being available in relief. He's obviously a very talented baseball player... Maybe the Reds should try to maximize that talent.
    I agree with you 100%. I think Buck is the only guy out of the bunch that has the potential to make a significant contribution to this team. Based on his stuff and extreme groundball tendencies he could be a decent starter. That fact that he is going to be 24 to start next season is disconcerting, but what are you gonna do.

    Owings you are right on. He is an extreme flyball pitcher and I fear will provide Miltonesque HR totals if he is in the rotation. On the other hand you could do some pretty creative things with him out of the pen and pinch hitting. I remember a Mets game back in 1986 or 1987 when Davey Johnson put Roger McDowell in LF and had Jesse Orosco pitching. When a right hander came up he swapped them where Orosco woudl go out to LF and McDowell would pitch. Of course we have DuHsty, so pinch hitting for a pitcher is about as creative as he gets.


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