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Thread: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

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    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
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    camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    For the 2009 roster, here is what I, camisadelgolf, have in store:

    If Ryan Hanigan and Wilkin Castillo don't pan out, the every-day catcher could once again be a Paul Bako-type black hole. Both Hanigan and Castillo could be optioned next year, so I might sign Johnny Estrada or Michael Barrett if the price is right. However, catcher is such a big need across the Majors, so I'd probably stand pat.

    The Reds need outfielders. For me, this should be priority number one in the off season, and here are some players I would consider:

    Starting left fielder:
    Juan Rivera - I'd love to see what he could do in GABP; he's very toolsy, and I think he'd be a perfect match for the Reds
    Milton Bradley - everyone hates to admit, but he's really, really good (when he's on the field); I'd sign him if the numbers are right (i.e. no more than a two-year contract)
    Garrett Anderson - obviously on the decline but continues to produce; he's an injury risk, but maybe he could be signed to an affordable, one-year contract
    Fernando Tatis - is 2008 a fluke? if not, the 1999 Fernando Tatis would be a monster in the Reds' lineup
    Raul Ibanez - his age worries me, but his numbers have been good; he's certainly someone to consider, though
    Manny Ramirez - there's no way I look to the Reds to obtain this guy, but if the Reds do obtain him, they will immediately become competitors
    Mark Teixeira - if the Reds can sign him, this would push Joey Votto to left field; once again, the Reds have the salary room (if they decline Arroyo's option when it comes around), and it would immediately turn the Reds into competitors

    Bench outfielder, if none of the above can be obtained (but say 'goodbye' to competing in 2009 and 'hello' to looking forward to 2010:
    Kevin Mench - he's who I would want as the first outfield option off the bench; I'm fine with Norris Hopper only as the second outfielder off the bench
    Craig Monroe - might like to put his career back on track in a hitter's park; a right-handed power bat is needed for the bench, and Adam Rosales might not be ready yet
    Brad Wilkerson - he really knows how to work the count, has local ties, and before this year, he was consistently slugging around .450; if his swing hasn't slowed down too much, I'd like to see him in a Reds uniform
    Greg Norton - is a switch-hitter, can also play third base (albeit poorly), and has a little pop in his bat
    Emil Brown - see: Kevin Mench; unfortunately, he probably thinks he's worthy of being a starting left fielder somewhere
    Jay Payton - personally, I'm not a fan, but maybe the Reds will be desperate enough; he shouldn't be too bad as a bench player
    Gabe Kapler - the Reds already have Norris Hopper, so I see him as irrelevant, but maybe he can be brought in at a discount

    The Reds' need for a fifth starter is exaggerated, especially with Micah Owings coming over after the season. Hopefully, between Homer Bailey, Daryl Thompson, and Matt Maloney, one of those guys is ready to produce at the Major League level if needed. And who knows? Maybe Nick Masset or Ramon Ramirez could be an effective starter. I'm ready to cut bait with Matt Belisle and Bobby Livingston, though. If the Reds look to free agency, the starting pitching options would probably be way too old and way too over-priced anyway. Then again, a heck of a lot of money was freed up by not re-signing Dunn and Griffey, and the Reds could really use a left-handed starter. The Reds have a reputation for stealing big-name free agents from the Brewers . . . Hey, a man can dream, can't he?

    As good as the bullpen has been this year, a lot of that production has come from Jeremy Affeldt and Mike Lincoln, both of whom I'm not expecting back next year. The Reds could replace them both internally, which I hope they do, because the free agent market for relievers is absolutely pathetic.

    A lineup I could be happy with:
    CF Dickerson/Freel (a platoon I could live with, especially with Dusty Baker as manager)
    1B Votto
    LF ???????
    RF Bruce
    3B Encarnacion
    2B Phillips
    SS Gonzalez
    C Hanigan


    Bench:
    C Wilkin Castillo (could theoretically be one of the best backup shortstops in baseball)
    IF Jeff Keppinger (utility infielder, not an every-day shortstop)
    IF Adam Rosales, Paul Janish, or Danny Richar (because he's left-handed)
    OF Chris Dickerson/Ryan Freel (platoon)
    OF Norris Hopper or Shaun Cumberland (probably not ready but underrated as a prospect)

    SP Edinson Volquez
    SP Aaron Harang
    SP Johnny Cueto
    SP Bronson Arroyo
    SP Micah Owings, Homer Bailey, Daryl Thompson, or Matt Maloney

    Wow, when was the last time the Reds had a rotation featuring 1-5 starters in the appropriate slots?

    CL Francisco Cordero
    RP Jared Burton
    RP Bill Bray
    Three of the following relief pitchers: Matt Belisle, Ramon Ramirez, Danny Herrera, Carlos Fisher, Josh Roenicke, Ty Pelland, Robert Manuel
    MU Nick Masset

    Compared to the rest of the league, that wouldn't be all that bad of a bullpen.

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    No half measures, Walter RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    Thanks for the analysis. I think this just reinforces the fact that the FA crop this year is pretty old, declining, and expensive. Other than Teixeira, there really isn't anyone on this list I'd like the Reds to sign. I suppose Bradley would be alright, as long as the contract isn't too expensive or long-term (good luck with that). Anyway, I'm wishing more and more that they had signed Dunn to a LTC after considering these other options.

    Almost makes the most sense to sign Sabathia if they are set on dropping a lot of cash on a FA. Even if they overspend on him, it will still be a better deal to get a young, durable pitcher than an aging, overrated OF.

    Are you Ricky Henderson because you posted this fast?
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

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    My clutch is broken RichRed's Avatar
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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    Are you Ricky Henderson because you posted this fast?
    RichRed thinks it's because camisadelgolf referred to himself in the third person.
    "I can make all the stadiums rock."
    -Air Supply

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    No half measures, Walter RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    Quote Originally Posted by RichRed View Post
    RichRed thinks it's because camisadelgolf referred to himself in the third person.
    Could also be the Bob Dole of RedsZone, I suppose.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

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    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    nate still likes Tex but there needs to be more of a team around him in order to go for the gold.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post

    Anyway, I'm wishing more and more that they had signed Dunn to a LTC after considering these other options.
    Not if Arroyo is correct and Dunn wanted $20M over many years to sign.

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    Member chicoruiz's Avatar
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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    Chico likes Rivera, but Chico thinks we need a CF, because if Chico sees a certain person in CF in 2009, Chico is going to hurl.

    And Chico wonders about SS, too...
    "In baseball, you don't know nothin'"...Yogi Berra

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    Start the Reactor! *BaseClogger*'s Avatar
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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    Quote Originally Posted by chicoruiz View Post
    Chico likes Rivera, but Chico thinks we need a CF, because if Chico sees a certain person in CF in 2009, Chico is going to hurl.
    BaseClogger wants to see Dickerson back in CF in 2009. BaseClogger likes the idea of Brad Wilkerson as pop off the bench. Also, BaseClogger still has hope that Adam Dunn would be willing to return and fill the hole in LF...
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

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    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    Quote Originally Posted by chicoruiz View Post
    Chico likes Rivera, but Chico thinks we need a CF, because if Chico sees a certain person in CF in 2009, Chico is going to hurl.

    And Chico wonders about SS, too...
    Who are you worried about seeing in center field next year? If it's CPat, I wouldn't worry about it. There's no way Jocketty is that dumb.

    And the shortstop concerns are legitimate. I wonder about that, too. If AGon can't stay on the field, the Reds are stuck with Paul Janish and Jeff Keppinger at shortstop. One can't hit, and the other has no range. This makes me think of something interesting . . .

    Could the Reds be serious players for Rafael Furcal? Like Wilkin Castillo, Edwin Encarnacion, Danny Richar, Francisco Cordero, Edinson Volquez, Johnny Cueto, and many others in the organization, Furcal comes from the Dominican Republic, and that could make the Reds attractive.

    Sure, Furcal just turned 31 years old, which probably means he's exiting his prime, but who in the organization is going to play shortstop over the next few years? Shortstop is a defense-first position, and over the past several years, Furcal has been one of the leaders in range factor (#2 in 2007, #1 in 2006, #1 in 2005). And if you're more concerned about his offense, he showed earlier this year that he can still hit. He crushed the ball this year and has been producing very well despite spending all his time in pitcher's ballparks. He's still getting on base at a good rate (.352 career OBP), his slugging is respectable (.412 for his career), he's stealing bases, and he's been very consistent.

    The only pure shortstop in the system who looks like he could be worthy of starting down the line is Zack Cozart, who is probably at least three years away from reaching the Major Leagues. Alex Gonzalez is most likely not the answer for 2010, and the 2010 free agent shortstop class won't have anyone nearly as good as Rafael Furcal.

    The only real concern with Furcal is his health. He has had leg problems, and he had a bulging disc that was operated on, which has kept him out for a while. Soon, we should see how well he has recovered, though. If he plays like he has been playing the past few years, I would put in a serious effort to pursue the guy.

    This could be a very good lineup:
    SS Rafael Furcal (gets on base; good speed)
    1B Joey Votto (gets on base; good power)
    3B Edwin Encarnacion (gets on base; good power)
    RF Jay Bruce (very good, developing power)
    LF Juan Rivera (fairly low OBP but can drive runners in on the occasions Bruce doesn't)
    2B Brandon Phillips (another guy with a fairly low OBP but can drive runners in)
    CF Ryan Freel/Chris Dickerson (both get on base at good rates and have very good speed)
    C Ryan Hanigan (very good OBP; perfect for getting a runner over or driving a speedy runner in with a bloop single)

    It's not a lineup that has one guy who stands out and intimidates the other pitcher, but 1-8, there are guys who you can expect to OPS at least .750, and up to five of them could realistically hit 30+ homeruns.

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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    Fernando Tatis could be a nice option.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

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    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    Quote Originally Posted by lollipopcurve View Post
    Fernando Tatis could be a nice option.
    He's also from the Dominican Republic.

    The concern is that he's 34 years old next year, and aside from one amazing year, he hasn't been particularly impressive. He also has health issues. With that said, I'd say he's certainly worthy of consideration.

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    Start the Reactor! *BaseClogger*'s Avatar
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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    Another route is to move either EE or Votto to LF and target FA's or trade acquisitions. BaseClogger especially wonders if Adam LaRoche would be available in the right trade with the Pirates...
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

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    Member OnBaseMachine's Avatar
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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    If the Reds plan on moving EdE then I'd like to see them acquire Adrian Beltre in the offseason if he can be had for a decent price. He's a very good defensive third baseman and has good power that could spike in the GABP. Next year is his contract year and we all remember what he did last time in his contract season. I'm an EdE fan but if they could get a guy like Jonathan Sanchez for him, I'd make the deal and attempt to acquire Beltre.

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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    The concern is that he's 34 years old next year, and aside from one amazing year, he hasn't been particularly impressive. He also has health issues. With that said, I'd say he's certainly worthy of consideration.
    He's played well for the Mets this year. It can happen that a guy near the end of his career will have a renaissance -- and if Tatis is over whatever health issues he had, the missed time could mean he's got more tread on the tires than most 34 year olds. Jocketty knows him well from St. Louis, too.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

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    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
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    Re: camisadelgolf (the Rickey Henderson of RedsZone?) Looks at 2009

    TRF will only look at internal options.

    The SS problem is easily handled for 2009: Brandon Phillips. Have an open competition for 2B, and include Valaika. The Reds do need another OF though. I see Dickerson in CF, and Bruce obviously in RF. Somebody has to play LF, and TRF thinks within the org., the first looks are Rosales and Dorn, possibly Frazier. Stubbs is a possibility, and TRF won't even rag on him here.

    Weathers needs to go. Roenicke needs to arrive. Herrera too.

    But the big bat the Reds need is Danny Dorn. All he does is hit.
    Suck it up cupcake.


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