Bold prediction: Brandon Phillips has played his last game as a Red

[Will M]

Why?

1. His numbers at a glance ( 21 homers & 23 SB ) look better than his true numbers ( OPS+ of 88, 105 & 93 the last 3 seasons and inability to hit RHP )

He is really a guy who should hit 6th or 7th and we have a lot of these guys already.

2. He could be attractive to teams. I could envision him being part of a Matt Holliday trade.

3. We have oodles of players whose best position is 2B - Kep, Richar, Valaika.
Rosales could play here. Heck we could even bring back Hairston.

4. He was not on Walt's untouchable list.

[MWM]

I wouldn't trade BP unless the return was too much to pass up. He's signed at a reasonable value and he's the best defender the Reds have. Trading the plus players who are signed to reasonable contrace isn't the way to get better.

[Will M]

I wouldn't trade BP unless the return was too much to pass up. He's signed at a reasonable value and he's the best defender the Reds have. Trading the plus players who are signed to reasonable contrace isn't the way to get better.

Theres the rub. Is he really a 'plus player'? Yes he can pick it at 2B but his bat isn't that great. Since we have oodles of other options for 2B I think he will get shopped this offseason to fill the holes we have. Now if the Reds moved him to SS that would be another issue but the Reds have shown no signs of wanting him to play SS.

[MWM]

Theres the rub. Is he really a 'plus player'? Yes he can pick it at 2B but his bat isn't that great. Since we have oodles of other options for 2B I think he will get shopped this offseason to fill the holes we have. Now if the Reds moved him to SS that would be another issue but the Reds have shown no signs of wanting him to play SS.

I'm all for shopping him, but it would take a lot for me to pat with him. I think he's definitely a plus player. He does just about everthing well but take walks. He's fast, has some pop, and plays superb defense. I wouldn't undersell his defense. I would feel differently if he had a huge contract, but he doesn't. He's set to make $11.5MM over the next two seasons. He's the type of guy you keep.

[Sea Ray]

I'm all for shopping him, but it would take a lot for me to pat with him. I think he's definitely a plus player. He does just about everthing well but take walks. He's fast, has some pop, and plays superb defense. I wouldn't undersell his defense. I would feel differently if he had a huge contract, but he doesn't. He's set to make $11.5MM over the next two seasons. He's the type of guy you keep.

If that's the way you feel then you ought to be for getting rid of him right now. As several have stated, he is due big money in future years. So if money is a concern (and with this team it should be) then the time to move him is now.

I don't sense the front office wanting to move him but if they did I'd understand why

[REDREAD]

I'm all for shopping him, but it would take a lot for me to pat with him. I think he's definitely a plus player. He does just about everthing well but take walks. He's fast, has some pop, and plays superb defense. I wouldn't undersell his defense. I would feel differently if he had a huge contract, but he doesn't. He's set to make $11.5MM over the next two seasons. He's the type of guy you keep.

Exactly. We should be trying to acquire more guys like Phillips, not dump them.

It's not Phillips fault that he has been forced to be the primary run producer. Get more bats and then push him down.

Putting Keppinger or someone like that at 2b would be a huge downgrade.

I'm not saying Phillips is untouchable, nobody is to me. But we darn well better get a great return for him.

[princeton]

Is he really a 'plus player'?

yes

[OnBaseMachine]

I wouldn't trade BP unless the return was too much to pass up. He's signed at a reasonable value and he's the best defender the Reds have. Trading the plus players who are signed to reasonable contrace isn't the way to get better.

Agreed. It would take a huge return for me to deal Phillips.

Phillips is a good player but he's not a cleanup hitter. Jerry Narron and now Dusty Baker are handling him wrong by continuing to bat him cleanup on a nightly basis. IMO he would be better suited for either lead off where maybe he would learn to lay off more pitches and take a walk, or sixth where his solid power and low OBP would be more effective. When he's hitting cleanup it seems like he tries to hit everything out of the park, and he's just not that type of hitter.

[oneupper]

Phillips is owed the following:

2009: $4,75 mm
2010 $6,75 mm
2011: $11 mm
2012: $11 mm w $ 1mm buyout.

The "near" years look reasonable, but thereafter, not so much. Since you can't take only "part" of the contract, BP is only really tradeable now. If doesn't put up a stellar 2009 or 2010...he becomes a liability.

Walt Jocketty has had a revolving door of cheap 2B in Stlouis over the last decade. It worked.

I say trade him. 2B is hole that's not hard to fill.

[gm]

Walt Jocketty has had a revolving door of cheap 2B in Stlouis over the last decade. It worked.

I say trade him. 2B is hole that's not hard to fill.

Walt also values defense more than the average GM. I say BP stays

[RedEye]

I am definitely of the opinion that Brandon is overvalued given his counting stats. He is a good defender, but should be dealt if the Reds can get a good return. The fact that he is cheap right now should actually help them to do that. I suppose though that they'd then have to find a replacement MI with a good glove--not something there is a surplus of in the system right now.

[RedsManRick]

Trading Phillips is the kind of move that would infuriate the average fan, but personally I'd be all for it if the return is right. His offensive game is significantly overrated thanks to his low OBP, massive platoon split, and risky base-running. Obviously he's an asset to the team, but I think we could get even more value in return and we have significant organization depth at 2B.

The other piece of this equation:

08:$2.75M
09:$4.75M
10:$6.75M
11:$11M
12:$12M club option ($1M buyout)

Plus incentives. BP is no longer "cheap". He's still a bargain for 2 years, is becoming an increasing part of the payroll base.

[Chip R]

Trading Phillips is the kind of move that would infuriate the average fan, but personally I'd be all for it if the return is right.

I think there would be some fallout with the players as well. Trade Phillips, and/or Bronson and/or Cordero after both have signed long term deals and pretty soon, guys like Bruce and/or Votto and/or Volquez and/or Cueto aren't going to sign here long term because they figure if those guys got traded, so could they. It's also going to look to players outside the organization who the Reds may be looking at that they will trade anyone who signs a long term deal. That's not to say the idea of trading these guys doesn't have merit but there is a human factor to consider and if you do wind up trading these guys, those actions could have consequences.

[Tony Cloninger]

I never understood why the trading of other players with long term contracts would preclude a player from signing one?

If someone wants to give me a long term contract.....I mean it's guaranteed money so why would i tun it down? At worst i get traded.....if you put down the teams you are willing to be traded to when you sign the contract then it would not be a big deal. I still get the money.

[Chip R]

I never understood why the trading of other players with long term contracts would preclude a player from signing one?

If someone wants to give me a long term contract.....I mean it's guaranteed money so why would i tun it down? At worst i get traded.....if you put down the teams you are willing to be traded to when you sign the contract then it would not be a big deal. I still get the money.

One of the reasons you sign a long-term deal is because there's something about the place you're playing that makes you want to stay there for 3-5 years. If Team A is offering a long term deal and it's an organization that usually doesn't trade those players; if Team B is offering the same deal but they tend to trade those guys, that player is going to probably sign with Team A unless Team B really overpays. Players don't usually like to get traded. It may also affect their performance on the field if they are hearing rumors about them being traded. The player is usually giving some money back if he's signing long term. Just think of what kind of a salary Pujols could command if he had gone year to year instead of signing long term.

I'm not saying you don't do it but that if you do, there may be repercussions.