Was the game blacked out here? I didn't see it on last night.
Was the game blacked out here? I didn't see it on last night.
Originally Posted by Raisor
Last night was a nationally televised game against a ranked in-conf. opponent, and the game wasn't sold out. Even if Nippert sells out, it's a 35,000 capacity stadium. It's a great place to watch a game, but it's far far cry from "big time" college football. It translates into lack of revenue for the team, which directly impacts facilities (UC still doesn't have the type of indoor practice facilities that are all but required for the team to be in a fair recruiting fight with other places), recruiting budgets, and other team expenses.
You think Brian Kelly looks around at empty seats on game night and thinks "Yeah, this is where it's going to happen?" He's been a remarkable coach and even better advocate for his program (engaging the fanbase and locals like no coach I've seen in Clifton), but there has to come a point where he thinks to himself "I'm a damn good coach, I shouldn't have to be a cheerleader too."
Beyond that -- the administration also doesn't have the required commitment to winning football. A perfect example of this was the game @ Kent State -- that's a game that any program with designs on "big time" status buys out. You don't see teams like Ohio State or Florida going on the road to play upset-special games against a MAC team. They buy the home date out, bring the small school to their stadium and use them for target practice. It's an attitude difference -- the AD at UC doesn't have the power to cough up straight cash to make something like that happen.
Until all those things change, UC will be a stepping-stone job to bigger programs. It's sad, but it's the reality of major-level college football.
Cincinnati Reds: Farm System Champions 2022
Comparison from earlier in the season;
2-3 Indiana vs. 3-3 Iowa in Bloomington.. Attendance 33,428
5-2 Cincinnati vs. #23 South Florida.. Attendance 31,175.
I say this not to pump up Indiana or even knock down Cincinnati. But rather to point out the discrepancy between UC(really the entire Big East) and Big Ten, Big 12, and SEC schools with regards to programs.
For those who don't know, Indiana is not easy to get to, there is no interstate that comes within an hour of Bloomington. The nearest big city is an hour away, probably closer to two on game days. And the biggest problem at Indiana isn't the level of interest in getting people to the stadium, but rather getting the people from the parking lot across the street to actually go in the stadium.
My guess is, there weren't an additional 10,000 people tailgating last night.
In other words, moving from a mid level Big East program to a lower level Big Ten program is a step up. It's an even bigger step up to a lower level SEC program,(Kentucky sold out it's stadium regularly, even when it wasn't any better than Indiana.)
Is it the administration or the fanbase? This is a notorious front-runner town. UC last year was a great example. They started out like a house afire and either were undefeated or had only 1 loss at one point. Nippert sells out, everything is fine and dandy. They lose a game or two and it's back to normal.
1) It was a thursday night
2) That's the 10th biggest crowd in Nippert Stadium. There are still many people that don't realize how good this team is. Give it some time.
The reason there were a lot of open seats was students started buying cheap seats because the 8000 student tix sold out in the first day or 2.
Congrats to Cincy...I love whats going on in the Big East, all the teams are beating each other in conference games! Gives the Big East an SEC feel.
Of course as a WVU fan I'm rooting for all Big East teams to beat each other up and WVU finish with a 7-0 record!
Don't get too excited, next week is going to put a blemish on your record....
Let's hope!Don't get too excited, next week is going to put a blemish on your record....
1) UC football was practically dead as of about 10 years ago. In fact, there were very serious calls to dismantle the program. So UC football has about two years and counting of tradition unless you want to go back to the days of Sid Gilman. So there are generations of alumni and Cincinnatians that grew up not caring at all about UC football. IU doesn't have to fight that. Despite this, attendance and ticket revenue have gone up this year and should continue to increase.
2) There's no room to tailgate. UC is landlocked and there's only a few small on-campus lots for tailgating. There are many who wish that UC has acres of land surrounding Nippert in which to tailgate a la IU, but that's just not in the cards in the middle of the city.
3) UC is new to the BCS world. There's plenty of unrealized upside in the program. Let's give UC and the rest of the Big East teams a few years to grow into their shoes before dismissing them as unworthy (I'm putting some words into your mouth here, but the general idea stands). In fact, I remember reading an article during the off season about how IU and Purdue were lamenting UC's recruiting success in Indiana. At this point, the vast majority of UC recruits were also recruited by Big 10 schools.
4) UC controls their destiny to the Orange Bowl. Think about how astonishing that statement sounds. Yet it's true.
5) At this point, Brian Kelly will bolt only if Notre Dame or Boston College open up. That's the list. He's an east-coast Catholic. He's already received calls from UCLA, Georgia Tech and Nebraska regarding a job and returned none of them.
Last edited by paintmered; 10-31-2008 at 07:27 PM.
All models are wrong. Some of them are useful.
Wasn't blacked out, was on ESPN.
All good points, but also all reasons why UC isn't and may never be a big program. Maybe Kelly does what Beamer did at VT, but the odds are certainly against it. The danger is that Kelly gets to a certain point and realizes that this is as far as you can bring Cincinnati football.
I was there, and the atmosphere at the Nip was great. I really feel likes sports fans in this town are missing out if they're not going to these games. Tickets are cheap, the tailgaiting has really picked up, bars are packed before games, and the product on the field is exciting. It was an awesome night to be in Clifton.
Not buying it. Step up based on what criteria? 1,500 fans? UC has the lowest average attendance in the Big East, which tells me that the rest of the middle tier programs in the Big East are probably ahead of the lower level Big Ten schools.
I think most coaches are more concerned with going to BCS bowls and collecting a nice paycheck. There's a better chance that of a middle tier Big East team getting to a BCS bowl than a lower tier Big Ten school IMO. Less teams in the Big East, and you don't have a couple traditional powerhouses to deal with like the Big Ten does. From what I know the Big East coaches are paid pretty much on par with most BCS conference coaches, including the Big Ten.
UC football was a joke three years ago. People would have laughed if you told them they would be beating ranked teams on national tv in just a few years. People didn't care about the games, and neither did the administration. There's no doubt it's going in the right direction. People in Cincinnati are just now realizing how great the atmosphere can be, and how fun the games are. If they can carry on some level of success for a few years the fan base will continue to build, and eventually UC will be expanding Nippert. Even if Kelly leaves I don't see UC football going back to what it was, there's no doubt that Kelly will be leaving the program in better shape than what it was when he came here. I look at Kansas State basketball as an example. Huggins caught a lot of hell when he left, but they are way better off now than before Huggs went there.
As for the practice bubble, the last update I heard was that a significant portion of the money has already been raised, and it's still on schedule to be built where the sander lot is.
Actually, this argument is starting to lose weight. UC has been to 6 bowl games in 10 years. 7 in 11 years.
Why are fans going to suddenly jump in more than they have? Maybe as the Big East continues to grow(I understand it was formed only as a basketball league) they can build the program, but you're going to run into pretty high barriers.
On one hand, this was the 10th largest crowd in UC history, on the other hand it wasn't even a sell out.
On one hand you're drawing consistently in the mid 30,000 range for big games.
On the other hand, schools in the top 40-50 in College football consider anything below 45,000 to be cause for concern.
It's not because Cincinnati isn't a football market, the Bengals have sold out for half a decade with one winning season. High school football,(particularly GCL and GMC) has enough fans to support UC probably by themselves.
It's not because Cincinnati doesn't support college sports, UC, XU, and Miami all have large enough crowds, not to mention tOSU, Wright State(wrong university) and Dayton just up the road.
Just how long is it going to take? Even if you can expand Nippert, how comfortable would you feel that they could sell out a 50,000 seat stadium without playing Oklahoma or tOSU?
My fear for UC, is that the Big East is too spread out for more than one or two rivalries to really develop, limiting the potential for the football program to really expand a whole lot past where it is now.
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