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View Poll Results: Prospect #8 runoff vote

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  • Chris Dickerson

    25 28.74%
  • Juan Duran

    30 34.48%
  • Juan Francisco

    32 36.78%
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Thread: Prospect #8 runoff vote

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  1. #1
    Member OnBaseMachine's Avatar
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    Prospect #8 runoff vote

    It's down to Chris Dickerson, Juan Duran, and Juan Francisco for the Reds eighth best prospect. This poll is open only one day as opposed to the normal two.

    I'll again go with Juan Francisco at #8.
    I miss Adam Dunn.

  2. #2
    GR8NESS WMR's Avatar
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    JUAN DURAN

    Hit me baby juan more time
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    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    Dickerson

  4. #4
    Member SMcGavin's Avatar
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    I like Dickerson, but the guy is 27. His window for helping the Reds is pretty small.

    And if I have to choose between the two high potential guys, I'm taking the one who had a .799 OPS in the Florida State League during his age 20/21 season. Francisco it is.

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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    Quote Originally Posted by SMcGavin View Post
    I like Dickerson, but the guy is 27. His window for helping the Reds is pretty small.
    He's only 26. He won't be 27 until next April. I will vote once again for Dickerson, as I think he has the best chance to help the Reds.

  6. #6
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    I'll skip this vote. The choices are ridiculous. a professional Minor Leaguer, Wily Mo in the making, and someone who is barely past puberty. I am disappointed in the lack of vision for the foreseeable future.

  7. #7
    Member OnBaseMachine's Avatar
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    Oh well, we have plenty of voters. And that professional minor leaguer posted an OPS of .862 in Louisville and 1.021 in 102 major league atbats. Francisco has enormous potential and Juan Duran is one of the best hitting prospects to ever come out of the Dominican Republic according to the folks down there. I think a lot of teams would love to have one of those three as their eighth best prospect.
    I miss Adam Dunn.

  8. #8
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    Quote Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine View Post
    Oh well, we have plenty of voters. And that professional minor leaguer posted an OPS of .862 in Louisville and 1.021 in 102 major league atbats. Francisco has enormous potential and Juan Duran is one of the best hitting prospects to ever come out of the Dominican Republic according to the folks down there. I think a lot of teams would love to have one of those three as their eighth best prospect.
    This totally misses the point. No sense in elaborating.

  9. #9
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    Quote Originally Posted by gedred69 View Post
    I'll skip this vote. The choices are ridiculous. a professional Minor Leaguer, Wily Mo in the making, and someone who is barely past puberty. I am disappointed in the lack of vision for the foreseeable future.
    Regardless of how you feel about the choices for this vote, what does that have to do with the 'lack of vision for the foreseeable future'? No one on this forum makes decisions for the Reds, so I just don't see where that statement really fits....

  10. #10
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    Quote Originally Posted by gedred69 View Post
    I'll skip this vote. The choices are ridiculous. a professional Minor Leaguer, Wily Mo in the making, and someone who is barely past puberty. I am disappointed in the lack of vision for the foreseeable future.
    in a perfect world we'd all like the Reds to have 4 teams of minor league all-stars who are sure fire hall of famers, relax dude its all in fun.

  11. #11
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    Quote Originally Posted by icehole3 View Post
    in a perfect world we'd all like the Reds to have 4 teams of minor league all-stars who are sure fire hall of famers, relax dude its all in fun.
    I'm totally relaxed, "Dude". Give that advice to those who opted to assail my comment. I'm merely saying, there are other prospects with a shot at helping the org. at the MLB level a lot sooner.

  12. #12
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    Quote Originally Posted by SMcGavin View Post
    I like Dickerson, but the guy is 27. His window for helping the Reds is pretty small.

    And if I have to choose between the two high potential guys, I'm taking the one who had a .799 OPS in the Florida State League during his age 20/21 season. Francisco it is.
    I think Age is a bit over-rated in the free agent era. Top guys become too expensive after 5 or 6 years so looking longer than that when evaluating what a prospect could mean to a team may not be real useful. Age is important when projecting a player and how he'll perform, but once he's ready, the longevity angle is low on the list of things to consider. Since my criteria is based solely on how I think the player will help the Reds, I don't consider the age they hit they big leagues so much. They'll be free agents after 6 years anyway, so its only the cheap years that the team really gets benefit from them. (If we're simply projecting who will have the better career, I'd probably give age a lot more weight, and that may be the objective of these polls, but I'm looking at it only from a value to the Reds standpoint.)

    Homer Bailey is an example of a guy who is going to have to be kept on the roster in 2010 and may not be ready at age 23. He may even get pigeonholed as a swingman while collecting service time and his price increasing. Many times these guys end up let go for pennies on the dollar and emerge as top players with their new teams.

    On the other hand, with Dickerson you get his prime seasons on the cheap where he can help the team at his best. He's the player he's going to be and the Reds have him under control through his best years. They may actually could get 6 full seasons of positive contributions from him and then allow him to walk. Some of these younger guys end up with a couple of wasted years and just start to become real productive before they get to the point where the team needs to make a roster or a monetary decision while the player still has his best years ahead of him. The team actually ends up with fewer years of production from some of the younger prospects simply because of how the timetable plays out.

    I voted Dickerson here. He's going to be a 400+ At Bat guy for the major league team who will add plus defense and speed in the process. Duran and Francisco may never be heard from at the major league level.
    Last edited by mth123; 11-02-2008 at 07:24 AM.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

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  13. #13
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I think Age is a bit over-rated in the free agent era. Top guys become too expensive after 5 or 6 years so looking longer than that when evaluating what a prospect could mean to a team may not be real useful. Age is important when projecting a player and how he'll perform, but once he's ready, the longevity angle is low on the list of things to consider. Since my criteria is based solely on how I think the player will help the Reds, I don't consider the age they hit they big leagues so much. They'll be free agents after 6 years anyway, so its only the cheap years that the team really gets benefit from them. (If we're simply projecting who will have the better career, I'd probably give age a lot more weight, and that may be the objective of these polls, but I'm looking at it only from a value to the Reds standpoint.)
    Just curious, do you consider Danny Richar a prospect? His career numbers are similar to Valaika's, although he had a bad year last year. The difference being that he's 3 years older. How about Rosales? Given your criteria, I'd think those guys would rank higher than they would on a "pure prospect" list.
    Last edited by kpresidente; 11-02-2008 at 03:26 PM.

  14. #14
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    Quote Originally Posted by kpresidente View Post
    Just curious, do you consider Danny Richar a prospect? His career numbers are similar to Valaika's, although he had a bad year last year. The difference being that he's 3 years older. How about Rosales? Given your criteria, I'd think those guys would rank higher than they would on a "pure prospect" list.
    I have Valaika at number 16 on my list. Rosales is at number 24 (but maybe under-rated a bit as I think about it now) and Richar not rated. In the cases of both Valaika and Rosales, they are decent bats if they can stay at MI defensively but I have doubts that either will be able to. They don't have enough bat for a corner spot IMO. I'd consider moving Rosales higher because I actually think he is more likely to able to handle 2B than Valaika, but Valaika is the more noted player so I rated him higher because I think he has more value on the trade market. They could both be supersub types though, and while I think that is valuable those seem to be easier to find these days than in earlier eras. I don't think Richar even has enough bat for the MI.

    They differ from Dickerson because Dickerson projects as a plus defender in CF and his bat should be plenty for his position. Dickerson could be an everyday player (or at least a most of the time player based on him being the LH side of a platoon). I don't see any of the players you mentioned holding any position on a regular basis on the major league level.
    Last edited by mth123; 11-02-2008 at 03:48 PM.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  15. #15
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    Re: Prospect #8 runoff vote

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I have Valaika at number 16 on my list. Rosales is at number 24 (but maybe under-rated a bit as I think about it now) and Richar not rated. In the cases of both Valaika and Rosales, they are decent bats if they can stay at MI defensively but I have doubts that either will be able to. They don't have enough bat for a corner spot IMO. I'd consider moving Rosales higher because I actually think he is more likely to able to handle 2B than Valaika, but Valaika is the more noted player so I rated him higher because I think he has more value on the trade market. They could both be supersub types though, and while I think that is valuable those seem to be easier to find these days than in earlier eras. I don't think Richar even has enough bat for the MI.

    They differ from Dickerson because Dickerson projects as a plus defender in CF and his bat should be plenty for his position. Dickerson could be an everyday player (or at least a most of the time player based on him being the LH side of a platoon). I don't see any of the players you mentioned holding any position on a regular basis on the major league level.
    MTH123, it has been said numerous times in the BA chats by different analysts that Valakia would be an above average second baseman defensively. Are you saying that he will have to move off short or he can't play second either?


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