Turn Off Ads?
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 36

Thread: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

  1. #1
    Moderator RedlegJake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    North Kansas City, Mo
    Posts
    5,674

    The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    This time the pick is the biggest disappointment - the player that drives you crazy because everyone else props him big time but you just don't see it and expect his ultimate ineptitude to finally become obvious. You're screaming at the monitor "Whattyayounutsss!!" every time someone else mentions his name. (Kinda like what I had a bunch of ya doin' when I picked Derrick Hale as my sleeper!!)

    My ultimate primed to disappoint pick is Juan Francisco. The runner up would be Alex Buchholz. I actually love both these guys but they ARE primed to disappoint - Francisco may never find the discipline required to unlock his massive potential, and Buchholz' great Billings start is a recipe for a letdown. I give them props on the board but I'm holding my breath when I do. At this point propping them is like sawing on the limb you're sitting on but you can't tell for sure which end is attached to the tree.

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #2
    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    11,431

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Chris Heisey
    He's a backup outfielder. Get over it.

    Sean Henry
    See: Chris Heisey.

    Matt Maloney
    I realize what it says on the back of his baseball card, but he's a back-of-the-rotation starter at best. Sorry.

    Ben Jukich
    He's 26 years old, doesn't get a lot of strikeouts, doesn't have exceptional command, doesn't have much velocity, and almost always has a high WHIP. Okay, he's left-handed and has a curveball, but what am I missing?

    Chris Valaika
    Until he develops more power, he's going to be Brandon Phillips minus the speed and defense. That's not too impressive, if you ask me. I think he will gain some power at some point, but until then, I don't see him as a such a big prospect.

    Todd Frazier
    He might as well be called 'god' on RedsZone. No one seems to think he can do any wrong. The thing is, he's fated for a corner spot, where his bat will just be average (not that that doesn't have value). He's just not the future superstar many are predicting him to be.

    Jose Castro
    Thankfully, this has died down quite a bit over the past year. Relatively speaking, he's absolutely terrible. Do I need to remind you all of the last Castro with a similar skill set?

    Travis Wood
    I like the potential, but I think he's a future LOOGY. A great changeup and lacking command isn't too dominant without a good fastball.

    Phil Valiquette
    He's all potential and no production. He's got a long way to go if he's going to be a anything close to a Major League LOOGY, and I'd bet a chunk of cash that he doesn't get there.

    Zach Stewart
    Some people act like he's so amazing that he could make the Reds out of spring training. Forgive the hyperbole, but it sounds to me like people think he could already dominate AA. He's advanced for his age, but 11 BB in 16.2 IP doesn't scream "ready for big league camp" to me.

    I'm also tempted to add Nefi Soto to the list, but I think that would be a little too controversial.

  4. #3
    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Springfield, Ohio
    Posts
    9,052

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Quote Originally Posted by RedlegJake View Post
    This time the pick is the biggest disappointment - the player that drives you crazy because everyone else props him big time but you just don't see it and expect his ultimate ineptitude to finally become obvious. You're screaming at the monitor "Whattyayounutsss!!" every time someone else mentions his name. (Kinda like what I had a bunch of ya doin' when I picked Derrick Hale as my sleeper!!)

    My ultimate primed to disappoint pick is Juan Francisco. The runner up would be Alex Buchholz. I actually love both these guys but they ARE primed to disappoint - Francisco may never find the discipline required to unlock his massive potential, and Buchholz' great Billings start is a recipe for a letdown. I give them props on the board but I'm holding my breath when I do. At this point propping them is like sawing on the limb you're sitting on but you can't tell for sure which end is attached to the tree.
    I don't necc. agree with Bucholz being a prime candidate to disappoint however I don't expect the 2B version of Neftali Soto either. A 2nd year and at a higher level should tell us a little more about him, which I think eventually it will become clear he's a solid future big leaguer. However I am with you on Francisco as everyone already knows about my feelings on him. Simply put I don't expect him to be able to make enough significant contact going forward and his already low BB total isn't likely to improve either and may even diminish. That plus his growing reputation for putting on weight scream bust in the making. IMO right now he's prime trade bait and I would do it now, his value may never be higher.

    Zach Cozart may end up being a bust, IMO he's leaning that way. I hope he doesn't but it'll take another solid year out of him for me to consider him leaning the other way.

    Really I should add any prospect who hasn't done a single thing but sign a big $$$ contract and automatically get ranked high. But I won't because I wanna do right by the player's and give them a fair shake.
    Last edited by Mario-Rijo; 11-30-2008 at 08:54 AM.
    "You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one."

    --Woody Hayes

  5. #4
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    14,724

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Two guys in this category really stand out IMO:

    Devin Mesoraco

    His bat looks passable for a catcher, but so far he really can't play catcher. He has a lot of time but its the main thing that really keeps him on the radar. If he can't play catcher, not only is he not a prospect, he probably doesn't even deserve to take up a roster spot as an organizational player. He really needs to take a step forward behind the plate in 2009 IMO.

    Chris Valaika

    He projects as a sub .800 OPS guy which only plays up the middle somewhere. Guys who have endless questions about whether they can stick at a position scare the heck out of me. Usually if they stick, they struggle their entire career to avoid being a liability on defense. I'd just assume pass on that unless the bat is really special. Valaika's bat is not of the special variety. He's short on power, short on patience and is simply the above average for a MI type. Lacks defense, lacks power, lacks patience. Sounds like an offensive minded utility player who needs to hit for a high average to justify even a bench spot. He actually may do that.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  6. #5
    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Springfield, Ohio
    Posts
    9,052

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Quote Originally Posted by camisadelgolf View Post
    Chris Heisey
    He's a backup outfielder. Get over it.

    Sean Henry
    See: Chris Heisey.

    Matt Maloney
    I realize what it says on the back of his baseball card, but he's a back-of-the-rotation starter at best. Sorry.

    Ben Jukich
    He's 26 years old, doesn't get a lot of strikeouts, doesn't have exceptional command, doesn't have much velocity, and almost always has a high WHIP. Okay, he's left-handed and has a curveball, but what am I missing?

    Chris Valaika
    Until he develops more power, he's going to be Brandon Phillips minus the speed and defense. That's not too impressive, if you ask me. I think he will gain some power at some point, but until then, I don't see him as a such a big prospect.

    Todd Frazier
    He might as well be called 'god' on RedsZone. No one seems to think he can do any wrong. The thing is, he's fated for a corner spot, where his bat will just be average (not that that doesn't have value). He's just not the future superstar many are predicting him to be.

    Jose Castro
    Thankfully, this has died down quite a bit over the past year. Relatively speaking, he's absolutely terrible. Do I need to remind you all of the last Castro with a similar skill set?

    Travis Wood
    I like the potential, but I think he's a future LOOGY. A great changeup and lacking command isn't too dominant without a good fastball.

    Phil Valiquette
    He's all potential and no production. He's got a long way to go if he's going to be a anything close to a Major League LOOGY, and I'd bet a chunk of cash that he doesn't get there.

    Zach Stewart
    Some people act like he's so amazing that he could make the Reds out of spring training. Forgive the hyperbole, but it sounds to me like people think he could already dominate AA. He's advanced for his age, but 11 BB in 16.2 IP doesn't scream "ready for big league camp" to me.

    I'm also tempted to add Nefi Soto to the list, but I think that would be a little too controversial.
    Heisey - I agree.
    Henry - I agree somewhat but think he could be a tad better.
    Maloney - It's hard to argue he's any better than what you stated.
    Jukich - Huh, he's been hyped? I don't agree he's been hyped much if at all.

    Valaika - If he gains more power he's not what you described let alone now. But he still gonna be a solid starter, and BP is better than a lot of major league players.

    Frazier - Frazier is overhyped, how? He is what he is a consensus top 3 player in the system. Doesn't mean he's a superstar and i've never seen anyone call him that. But if he does play 3B which I expect him to do, he's likely more than "average".

    Castro - He's never been hyped.

    Wood - He doesn't have a FB? 88-91 & still just 21 years old so you could end up right but to call that now is a bit premature.

    Valiquette - I couldn't agree more he's got a great arm but likely no future.

    Stewart - Again a bit pre-mature.
    "You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one."

    --Woody Hayes

  7. #6
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    584

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Quote Originally Posted by camisadelgolf View Post
    Chris Heisey
    He's a backup outfielder. Get over it.

    Sean Henry
    See: Chris Heisey.

    Matt Maloney
    I realize what it says on the back of his baseball card, but he's a back-of-the-rotation starter at best. Sorry.

    Ben Jukich
    He's 26 years old, doesn't get a lot of strikeouts, doesn't have exceptional command, doesn't have much velocity, and almost always has a high WHIP. Okay, he's left-handed and has a curveball, but what am I missing?

    Chris Valaika
    Until he develops more power, he's going to be Brandon Phillips minus the speed and defense. That's not too impressive, if you ask me. I think he will gain some power at some point, but until then, I don't see him as a such a big prospect.

    Todd Frazier
    He might as well be called 'god' on RedsZone. No one seems to think he can do any wrong. The thing is, he's fated for a corner spot, where his bat will just be average (not that that doesn't have value). He's just not the future superstar many are predicting him to be.

    Jose Castro
    Thankfully, this has died down quite a bit over the past year. Relatively speaking, he's absolutely terrible. Do I need to remind you all of the last Castro with a similar skill set?

    Travis Wood
    I like the potential, but I think he's a future LOOGY. A great changeup and lacking command isn't too dominant without a good fastball.

    Phil Valiquette
    He's all potential and no production. He's got a long way to go if he's going to be a anything close to a Major League LOOGY, and I'd bet a chunk of cash that he doesn't get there.

    Zach Stewart
    Some people act like he's so amazing that he could make the Reds out of spring training. Forgive the hyperbole, but it sounds to me like people think he could already dominate AA. He's advanced for his age, but 11 BB in 16.2 IP doesn't scream "ready for big league camp" to me.

    I'm also tempted to add Nefi Soto to the list, but I think that would be a little too controversial.
    How can you make a list like this and basically include everyone even hint that you should include Neftali Soto and not mention Homer Bailey? You could actually rename this the Homer Bailey thread.

  8. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Posts
    13,263

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Quote Originally Posted by RedlegJake View Post

    My ultimate primed to disappoint pick is Juan Francisco. The runner up would be Alex Buchholz. I actually love both these guys but they ARE primed to disappoint - Francisco may never find the discipline required to unlock his massive potential, and Buchholz' great Billings start is a recipe for a letdown. I give them props on the board but I'm holding my breath when I do. At this point propping them is like sawing on the limb you're sitting on but you can't tell for sure which end is attached to the tree.
    Francisco isn't primed to disappoint because we all know his weakness, it's been the subject of post after post for years, RedZoners compare him to WM Pena. It won't be very surprising if he has trouble getting over this tendency.

    Buchholz isn't primed to disappoint because he isn't that highly touted a prospect to begin with. He's a guy who hit well in his first season, has caught the eye of RedsZoners, but nowhere is listed as one of the exceptional prospects in baseball.

    And ultimately it doesn't matter how any individual prospect does -- if the team has the depth necessary to succeed. The Reds have done a good job of stockpiling prospects and I am confident some will break through.

    If Bailey doesn't succeed, I can live with it because they acquired Volquez and developed Cueto. I don't focus on Francisco alone, because Alonso and Frazier are in the same basic age group and also are power hitters. At least one of them should make it.

    I'm a big supporter of Francisco and I do think he'll succeed for a number of reasons. But I'm more excited to see Francisco, Frazier and Alonso all at AA next year and hope that at least one emerges as a major addition.

  9. #8
    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    11,431

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Quote Originally Posted by kfm View Post
    How can you make a list like this and basically include everyone even hint that you should include Neftali Soto and not mention Homer Bailey? You could actually rename this the Homer Bailey thread.
    I feel like I see a lot more Bailey-bashing than Bailey praise. Besides, he's not a rookie anymore.

  10. #9
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    28,160

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Homer's vying with Kurt Stillwell to be the most over-hyped Reds prospect ever.

    Does Mesoraco still have hype? Maybe around here, but he wasn't on the BA top 20 for the MWL and I haven't read a single positive mention about his game for the past year.

    Anyway, my overhype radar is picking up Kyle Lotzkar. He looks to be on a blow-out-your-arm program to me.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

  11. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Shelburne Falls, MA
    Posts
    10,070

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Dorn -- corner outfielder who doesn't run or defend well. Doesn't hit lefthanders. Will be 24/25 next year and hasn't been out of AA. Wonder why he isn't playing winter ball.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

  12. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    4,654

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Carlos Fisher. Nothing against the guy. It's just that he'll be 26 and, other than 17 innings in AAA, I haven't seen anything special.

    On the hitters, my pick is split:

    Todd Frazier. Don't really see position, speed or exceptional power. I see a major-leaguer, I suppose, but not the 1 or 2 guy in the system.

    Drew Stubbs. I'm not a Stubbs-basher at all. I like his speed and defense and on-base and even his prospects of power. But without more contact, I just don't see that translating into the stardom that would befit his ranking on Redszone.

    Good thread.

  13. #12
    Titanic Struggles Caveat Emperor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    The 513
    Posts
    12,624

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Drew Stubbs -- he's Chris Dickerson, except 2 years younger and without as much pop.

    I'd love to find someone who is in love with his "toolsy" profile and unload him for something useful.
    Championships Matter.
    23 Years and Counting...

  14. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    4,654

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Quote Originally Posted by Caveat Emperor View Post

    I'd love to find someone who is in love with his "toolsy" profile and unload him for something useful.
    What do the Nationals have?

  15. #14
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    35,095

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Quote Originally Posted by Caveat Emperor View Post
    Drew Stubbs -- he's Chris Dickerson, except 2 years younger and without as much pop.

    I'd love to find someone who is in love with his "toolsy" profile and unload him for something useful.
    He is Chris Dickerson but younger, strikes out quite a bit less and has actually improved his strikeout rate at each level unlike Dickerson, and prior to Dickerson's age 26 season in AAA, had a .415 to .402 career SLG% edge on Dickerson too.

    So really, he is Chris Dickerson with more contact, better OB skills and similar power but more power potential to go with better defense and he is 2 years younger.

  16. #15
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Kettering
    Posts
    832

    Re: The 'What's All the Hype' pick

    Devin Mesoraco


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25