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Thread: Freel traded for Ramon Hernandez

  1. #391
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Trade Idea- Freel for Ramon Hernandez?

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I'm with lollipop, you can measure his raw impact on the current unit, but I don't think it really means anything.
    In a way your post (from which the above point was taken) kind of argues in favor of the alternative conclusion. By this I mean that measuring the impact of Hernandez relative to the current iteration of the roster informs (or should at least in my view) subsequent decisions.

    For instance, if the goal is the playoffs, the addition of Hernandez probably just eliminated a lot of potential options (like adding an Izturus or an Everett as the O's and Tigers have recently done) or if it hasn't eliminated them it signals the need for a huge upgrade somewhere else.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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  3. #392
    Baseball card addict MrCinatit's Avatar
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    Re: Freel traded for Ramon Hernandez

    To be frank, I am very surprised Walt was able to get a very warm body for Freel. Ryan was a lot of fun while he lasted, but his best years are far behind him.
    Yes, I realize Hernandez is the same age and has a recent history of injury - but I have very high hopes for this move. Plus, he might be able to make a very nice connection with out two young Dominican pitchers...which could be a very nice plus, indeed.

  4. #393
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Trade Idea- Freel for Ramon Hernandez?

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    In a way your post (from which the above point was taken) kind of argues in favor of the alternative conclusion. By this I mean that measuring the impact of Hernandez relative to the current iteration of the roster informs (or should at least in my view) subsequent decisions.

    For instance, if the goal is the playoffs, the addition of Hernandez probably just eliminated a lot of potential options (like adding an Izturus or an Everett as the O's and Tigers have recently done) or if it hasn't eliminated them it signals the need for a huge upgrade somewhere else.
    Since Hernandez cost no significant extra cash nor any frontline trading chips, it's an illogical leap to assume he's cost the club anything. How exactly has it eliminated anything other than other catching options?

    Izturis and Everett (the former in whom I had some interest, the latter whom I consider one of the worst players alive) are off the market because other teams signed them, not because the Reds acquired Hernandez. Simply put, there is no connection.

    Are sizable changes needed elsewhere? You bet. I believe I made that very point in my first post in this thread. That was always the case. The catcher acquisition wasn't going to be a singularly transformational event for the Reds. They weren't getting a star catcher this winter. That said, the club also couldn't afford to clod around with one foot stuck in a nothing-from-your-catcher bucket like it did last season.

    This move signals nothing. There's nothing new the Reds need to do that they didn't need to do prior to the Hernandez acquisition. There is, however, one less thing to do.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

  5. #394
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Trade Idea- Freel for Ramon Hernandez?

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Since Hernandez cost no significant extra cash nor any frontline trading chips, it's an illogical leap to assume he's cost the club anything. How exactly has it eliminated anything other than other catching options?
    That's exactly the point. They've locked their catching up and here's the impact...(insert your estimate).

    Now they still need to add this amount of impact....(insert your estimate).

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Izturis and Everett (the former in whom I had some interest, the latter whom I consider one of the worst players alive) are off the market because other teams signed them, not because the Reds acquired Hernandez. Simply put, there is no connection.
    I thought it was pretty obvious those two guys were being used as examples of a type of shortstop (i.e. ones who need substantial defensive value just to be considered an average major league player). Locking in the impact of an upgrade at one position colors the compromises that could be made at other positions if indeed the goal is to have the greatest shot at making the playoffs this season.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  6. #395
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
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    Re: Trade Idea- Freel for Ramon Hernandez?

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    That's exactly the point. They've locked their catching up and here's the impact...(insert your estimate).

    Now they still need to add this amount of impact....(insert your estimate).
    Which assumes a players contributions/impacts are fixed and neither enhanced or diminished by subsequent player moves.
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate


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