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Thread: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

  1. #166
    Boom Goes the Dynamite Screwball's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    "Ya'll" will put a higher value on a player that doesn't walk alot but has a high BA than a player who walks more but has a lower BA even if put together their OBP is identicle. *shrugs*
    You misspelled identikul.

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  3. #167
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Screwball View Post
    I just don't get it. How do you buid a perennial powerhouse that is the St. Louis Cardinals, and then decide that Willy Taveras is a good signing?? It really doesn't add up.
    He traded for Mark McGwire and the HR chase that followed made the Cardinals a financial powerhouse. Then he stumbled into Albert Pujols to keep it going. It enabled bringing in the likes of Edmonds and Rolen.

    I think FCB is right, this team is not going to spend big bucks right now and is filling in with cheap guys that will actually agree to play here (i.e. have few other options at this point). I'm starting to believe it is the real reason that Adam Dunn is no longer a Red. He didn't want to stay IMO. Hairston's limited success in 2008 opened some doors elsewhere and now apparantly he won't even come back.

    The team really needs to find a way to keep all its best home grown guys and that may mean that position changes for EdE and Votto are in order to make room for Alonso and Frazier. I don't see impact acquisitions in this team's future unless it come from dealing Harang and Arroyo for young guys who turn out to be studs.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  4. #168
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    You know, I wish there was some stat that was easy to look at to get a good idea on how a player produces on offense. It would need to be something the common internet fan could find in about 30 seconds on ESPN.com if they wanted. It would also need to be really accurate (about 98% would work). It would pretty much include everything you needed to know about a player (inlcuding scrappy things like SB and CS).
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  5. #169
    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by _Sir_Charles_ View Post
    That's what I think too. But since batting average doesn't mean ANYTHING...we're forced to ignore the .280 average.

    The way I look at it, his lack of power is compensated somewhat by his basestealing skills. Those singles are turned into doubles and triples after the SB's essentially. Sometimes I think people here put too much emphasis on the value of a walk. They'll put a higher value on a player who walks a lot but has a low BA than a player who walks very little but has a higher BA even if put together their OBP is identicle. *shrugs*
    When you have NO POWER, getting on base is your biggest weapon. You cannot steal 1st. The ability to take a walk is very important, and for a guy with Taveras game, he needs to BB 50+ times a season just to be freaking AVERAGE. Never mind the fact that despite what Jocketty says, all defensive metrics show him to be below average.
    Suck it up cupcake.

  6. #170
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    "Ya'll" will put a higher value on a player that doesn't walk alot but has a high BA than a player who walks more but has a lower BA even if put together their OBP is identicle. *shrugs*
    If by "Ya'll" you mean me, then the answer is yes. While the 2 get on base at the exact same pace in terms of OBP, I value the hit over the walk. The hit has more value. It advances runners, puts pressure on the defense and creates more options for the manager. But I don't undervalue the walk. Many here simply OVERvalue it. Just like many here OVERvalued Dunn.
    2014 predictions:
    99-63 WS champs (Cards take 2nd WC, Mil 3rd, Pit 4th, Chi 5th)
    Bruce/Votto neck and neck MVP race (neither takes it)
    Bailey CYA winner
    Hamilton ROY & GG

  7. #171
    Something clever pahster's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    You know, I wish there was some stat that was easy to look at to get a good idea on how a player produces on offense. It would need to be something the common internet fan could find in about 30 seconds on ESPN.com if they wanted. It would also need to be really accurate (about 98% would work). It would pretty much include everything you needed to know about a player (inlcuding scrappy things like SB and CS).
    Whatever are you talking about? :

  8. #172
    Member OnBaseMachine's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Walt hasn't even sniffed fixing the biggest problem with this team: up the middle defense.
    I miss Adam Dunn.

  9. #173
    Attack Cat! OUReds's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    There are holes on this team large enough to run a semi through. SS, LF, infield defense, pathetic OB potential, take your pick.

    Instead of addressing these, Walt comes up with a move that will almost certainly make the team worse.

    There are no words.

  10. #174
    Will post for food BuckeyeRedleg's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    How about if I can show that 08 was just Willy returning to his norm?

    Let me use a slightly different number, RC per 100 PA.

    05 11.01 (66.06 per 600 pa)
    06 11.11 (66.66 per 600 pa)
    07 14.09 (84.54 per 600 pa)
    08 10.54 (63.24 per 600 PA)

    That's mighty stinky.

    I'd rather platoon Stubbs and Dickerson and see what they give us. I guarantee Stubbs would be more productive than Tavares (I know, not saying much) and we all know his defense in CF would be way better.

    I don't see anything wrong with pushing our 24-year old former 1st round pick and seeing what he can do.

    I'm amazed that someone gets paid to make these kind of baseball decisions. I was pretty cool with Walt, just like I was once with Krivsky, but this reminds me of the day Wayne traded for Juan Castro. Wayne was never the same in my eyes after that day.

    Well, I guess now I'm forced to wonder if Walt is clueless as well.

  11. #175
    Member Ron Madden's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by _Sir_Charles_ View Post
    That's what I think too. But since batting average doesn't mean ANYTHING...we're forced to ignore the .280 average.
    Sometimes I think people here put too much emphasis on the value of a walk. They'll put a higher value on a player who walks a lot but has a low BA than a player who walks very little but has a higher BA even if put together their OBP is identicle. *shrugs*

    Nobody ever said that batting average doesn't mean anything.

    All hitters have slumps. When a hitter with a BA driven OBP slumps he's just making outs.

    When a hitter with a high walk rate slumps he can still avoid making outs by getting on base via a base on balls.

    It aint that hard to understand.


  12. #176
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by pahster View Post
    Whatever are you talking about? :
    Well there has to be SOMETHING like that, don't you think?


    Wait. Maybe something like this:


    [(H + BB + HBP - CS - GIDP) times (Total bases + .26[BB - IBB + HBP] + .52[SH + SF + SB])] divided by (AB + BB + HBP + SH+ SF)

    Nah, that's crazy talk.
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  13. #177
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Madden View Post
    It aint that hard to understand.

    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  14. #178
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    I find it a little sad that the season will be nearly ruined for lots of regular posters because of this signing. It's a weird thing.

    Personally, I find Tavares entertaining. Looking forward to seeing him play for the Reds.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

  15. #179
    Member icehole3's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I like Dickerson a lot. But if he's the LF with Taveras in CF, then the Reds better be saving some dough for the first pick in the 2010 draft.

    I think with this signing, the team was mathematically eliminated from play-off contention.
    you thought we we're going to the playoffs????

  16. #180
    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by lollipopcurve View Post
    I find it a little sad that the season will be nearly ruined for lots of regular posters because of this signing. It's a weird thing.

    Personally, I find Tavares entertaining. Looking forward to seeing him play for the Reds.

    Freel was entertaining. and he could get on base at least. He was a better defender too.
    Suck it up cupcake.


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