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Thread: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

  1. #376
    Member membengal's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Nice chart, WOY. Taveras' career average OPS puts him between Eddie Milner's 1984 season and Cesar Geronimo's 1978 season. On the BAD part of the chart. If everything in the world goes right for Taveras? He a l m o s t makes it out of the bad part of the chart.

    But not quite.

    Really, hard to capture just how awful this is for the team. Especially when they hand him 600 at-bats. Which we all know they will...

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  3. #377
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Will M View Post
    CF is a defense first position.
    Tell that to Tris Speaker, Ty Cobb and Oscar Charleston. It's a defense-and position, always has been. If you're getting a pile of offense out of C, SS and 2B -- like the BRM -- then you can carry a glove guy out in in CF, but for most teams the CF needs to be a significant contributor on offense.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

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  4. #378
    Resident optimist OldRightHander's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by remdog View Post
    Willie could very well end up doing good in Cincinnati. He could volenteer in a soup kitchen, appear as the 'player to be dunked' at a charity event, collect 'Toys for Tots'. That would be 'doing good'.

    Baseball? Can he play well? I'd guess not.

    Rem
    If he does the above, hustles out to the field and runs hard on ground outs, and looks upset when he strikes out, he will be a hero in Cincinnati.
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  5. #379
    You're soaking in it! MartyFan's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Just read about the signing and while I am not "Jumping for Joy"...I am not ready to slit my wrists or withdraw my support of the team because of it.

    I trust Walt's judgment and the judgment of the people he has put around him.

    I could see Willy doing better here in Cincinnati than he did in Colorado defensively. The thing that scares me is that he is another FREE SWINGING slot in the lineup and we already have a TON OF THAT though, not as much as we used to.

    He is speedy, a decent defender and he is speedy.

    So, I am not looking for high buildings to jump from though I do not think he is "THE ANSWER" or the final piece this team needs to be a contender.

    Still looking for that RH POWER HITTER we've heard about.

    Also, I still think my signature quote from Special K still is accurate and it is exactly the way this team is being built.
    "Sometimes, it's not the sexiest moves that put you over the top," Krivsky said. "It's a series of transactions that help you get there."

  6. #380
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    just got home. I think it is safe to write off the 09 and 10 Reds. A freakin' disaster.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

  7. #381
    Hey Cubs Fans RFS62's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Wow, I'm late to the wake, uh, party.

    Methinks the Big Red Machine just developed the Red Circle of Death.
    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    ~ Mark Twain

  8. #382
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Rounding Third View Post
    Phillips and Bruce could be around .330
    or be around .300
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

  9. #383
    Member membengal's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    How does this not cripple the club's chances? If Votto or Bruce or Edwin go "Pujols" for the club this year, and cover Walt's transgression. I like each of those players, but to hope they go "Pujols"? Not exactly realistic.

  10. #384
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Krusty View Post
    The Rockies released Taveras because they didn't want to risk losing in arbitration and have Taveras make more money than he did in the 2008 season.
    the real reason is they had seen enough of his act to know they didn't want him around anymore. And if Taveras and his speed is not wanted in Coors it isnt going to play in almost any other stadium in baseball.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

  11. #385
    Member SMcGavin's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Screwball View Post
    I just don't get it. How do you buid a perennial powerhouse that is the St. Louis Cardinals, and then decide that Willy Taveras is a good signing?? It really doesn't add up.
    Yeah. Faith in Walt's history was carrying me through the offseason. When he made the Hernandez deal, I thought "this is how a pro does it". Now - ugh. Though it makes a little more sense when you consider that two crucial parts of his STL plan were "draft one of the best hitters in MLB history in the 13th round" and "sign nobody pitchers for cheap and let the best pitching coach in the league turn them into contributors".

  12. #386
    Brett William Moore Will M's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Tell that to Tris Speaker, Ty Cobb and Oscar Charleston. It's a defense-and position, always has been. If you're getting a pile of offense out of C, SS and 2B -- like the BRM -- then you can carry a glove guy out in in CF, but for most teams the CF needs to be a significant contributor on offense.
    I disagree. Catcher, shortstop & centerfield are the three positions where the player has to be able to play defense. If a team can get strong defense and an OPS of 700 out these positions they are doing well.

    Jocketty has said that he is trying to field a better defensive team.
    C: Hernadez/Hanigan is better defensively than Ross/Bako.
    CF: Dickerson/Taveras is better defensively than Bruce.
    RF: Bruce is better defensively than Griffey.
    1B: 2nd half 2008 Votto was better defensively than 1rst half 2008 Votto.
    Thats four positions improved. The team ERA will be a lot better next year.

    Obviously Jocketty is under budget constraints. Were he not he would have signed Tex for 1B and moved Votto to LF. Or made the Dye trade.
    I am sure he is trying his best with the limits set on him.

    I hope Taveras has a great turnaround and plays well for the Reds.
    If he doesn't I hope Dusty has the sense to bench him.

    I of course had hoped Walt could have really made some great deals and the team becomes an instant contender. I am truly happy that Walt has not traded away the future for short term fixes. Barring BC opening up his checkbook the team was not going to make the playoffs in 2009 unless Walt traded away guys like Frazier, Soto, etc. Then we could have had a couple decent years then gone back to futility due to a barren farm system.
    .

  13. #387
    You're soaking in it! MartyFan's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by OldRightHander View Post
    If he does the above, hustles out to the field and runs hard on ground outs, and looks upset when he strikes out, he will be a hero in Cincinnati.
    THAT IS AWESOME!!!!!

    And true!

    "Sometimes, it's not the sexiest moves that put you over the top," Krivsky said. "It's a series of transactions that help you get there."

  14. #388
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    How does this not cripple the club's chances? If Votto or Bruce or Edwin go "Pujols" for the club this year, and cover Walt's transgression. I like each of those players, but to hope they go "Pujols"? Not exactly realistic.
    The club's chances were crippled before this signing. Cincy needed multiple prime time bats to be a legit contender in '09. As long as your expectations have been reasonable, then this shouldn't be a death blow.

    However, I can't figure out why they won't just tear it down. The Bruce/Votto/Cueto/Volquez window will be shutting awfully quick.

  15. #389
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    The worst part about this signing is that the game threads will be flat out unreadable.

  16. #390
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Austin Kearns View Post
    Because Wily Taveras has proven he can handle hitting leadoff.
    uh ... NO. He has shown he can make a boatload of outs while batting at the top of the order. Just shows how clueless walt and Reds really are. Taveras should never bat anywhere but 8th. He is an offensive black hole.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand


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