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Thread: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

  1. #406
    Member SteelSD's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Not sure I'd reduce Walt's tenure to Pujols and the nebulous benefits of a pitching coach.
    Over the past three years, Albert Pujols has produced 171.4 Runs Above Position. Think about that for a moment.
    "The problem with strikeouts isn't that they hurt your team, it's that they hurt your feelings..." --Rob Neyer

    "The single most important thing for a hitter is to get a good pitch to hit. A good hitter can hit a pitch that’s over the plate three times better than a great hitter with a ball in a tough spot.”
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  3. #407
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelSD View Post
    Over the past three years, Albert Pujols has produced 171.4 Runs Above Position. Think about that for a moment.
    Yep. And Walt drafted him. Smacks of the "take out his 'worst' starts" argument.

    He succeeded because he succeeded. He may have lost it, but come on, this revisionism is garbage.

  4. #408
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    The two best scenarios now?

    1) They sign Hairston AND a bat for LF. Taveras sux so bad in ST they jettison him ala Womack

    2) They limit Taveras' exposure by using him in a strict platoon with Dickerson - using Willy only vs. LHers and in late inning defensive switches with dickerson going to LF.

    Past history and WJ's statements today make both pipedreams though. He'll most likely get every chance that Patterson got and more with even more damaging results. They should know better - if noting else,they learned nothing from the Ptteron disater and then they turn around a pull this. Horrible, horrendous signing and a black way to head into the New Year.

  5. #409
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    But, hey, he OPS's .720, and I will call that a "win" for Jocketty. For finding and signing a guy who, in the best case scenario, is worse than league average. More than likely, he's gonna OPS around .650. Which is tragic. And fatal to this club.

    Whole thing blows.
    the 2009 Reds have likely been DOA for some time. They had to find 175 runs to be hopeful of playoff contention. This issue is that Walt is moving in the wrong direction ... and the best part is that he doesn't know it.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

  6. #410
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelSD View Post
    Over the past three years, Albert Pujols has produced 171.4 Runs Above Position. Think about that for a moment.
    Walt won before Pujols. Besides, I can't think of many GM's who were successful without a great individual player or two.

  7. #411
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by corkedbat View Post
    1) They sign Hairston AND a bat for LF. Taveras sux so bad in ST they jettison him ala Womack
    only if Walt is no longer the GM, as was the case with Womack.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

  8. #412
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    No, the 2009 Reds have NOT been DOA for some time. But they are headed that direction now. It's now not just the rather problematic replacing of Dunn's lost production, but it is also covering that AND making up for the suck that will be inserting Taveras' bat into the line-up. So, yeah, it's not good.

  9. #413
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    This is making my not renewing MLB Extra Innings decision a little easier.

  10. #414
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    No, the 2009 Reds have NOT been DOA for some time. .
    Yes they have. Too far away to garner the benefits of the prospects; unwilling to move said prospects for current production = DOA.

  11. #415
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by cincrazy View Post
    Walt won before Pujols. Besides, I can't think of many GM's who were successful without a great individual player or two.
    Roided up McGwire, and then the Pujols era. And, sorry FCB, I am not handing Jock "genius of the year" for lucking into a 13th round Hall of Fame bullet in Pujols.

  12. #416
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    Roided up McGwire, and then the Pujols era. And, sorry FCB, I am not handing Jock "genius of the year" for lucking into a 13th round Hall of Fame bullet in Pujols.
    Wainwright, Carpenter, Edmonds, Izzy, and an endless litany of bullpen arms for dirt cheap. Getting career year after career year out of almost every temp player he got.

  13. #417
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    No, the 2009 Reds have NOT been DOA for some time.
    there were -96 in 2008. Without something bordering the miraculous the 2009 Reds were toast.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

  14. #418
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Cedric View Post
    He doesnt hit or walk enough. Pretty simple to figure out that he is not the answer. This ballclub needs real talent. Not just some ideological idea of talent from 1984.
    So...who IS that answer then? Who out there on the free agent market is there this year that is the answer to our problems?

    *waits patiently*



    I fully agree with many here that Taveras should not be leading off. I think that's fairly obvious. But I've got no problem at all with his defense, his speed or his hitting for that matter. I'm not expecting him to be a slugger. Heck, I'm not even expecting him to be handed the CF starting job. The results of ST will determine that. Jocketty is in charge or acquiring the players...Baker is in charge of who plays and where. If Jocketty is going to be taking over who bats where and where players play...then he needs to dump the manager whoever he is. And to be clear, this isn't Dusty bashing either. Other than his batting orders and his choice of starters in the first half, I didn't really have much of a problem with Baker. But to be fair, he didn't have many other options did he?

    I think too many people here are assuming that Taveras will start in CF and lead off simply because of what Walt said. If asked again, I bet he'll say it's Dusty's decision and that decision will be made after ST.
    2014 predictions:
    99-63 WS champs (Cards take 2nd WC, Mil 3rd, Pit 4th, Chi 5th)
    Bruce/Votto neck and neck MVP race (neither takes it)
    Bailey CYA winner
    Hamilton ROY & GG

  15. #419
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    I still say sign Dunn and be done with it.... With out pitching staff and that line-up we would certainly compete in 09.... It's merely a dream to sign Dunn though.. Jock doesn't want him.... He'd rather sign Hairston Jr and focus on Small ball...

    1. Willy Taveras- CF
    2. Jay Bruce- RF
    3. Joey Votto- 1st
    4. Edwin Encarnacion-3rd
    5. Adam Dunn-LF
    6. Brandon Phillips-2nd
    7. Ramon Hernandez-C
    8. Alex Gonzalez-SS
    "There is a great man who makes every man feel small. But the real great man is the man who makes every man feel great." G.K Charleston

  16. #420
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Willy Taveras to 2 year deal....

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    How about if I can show that 08 was just Willy returning to below his norm?

    Let me use a slightly different number, RC per 100 PA.

    05 11.01 (66.06 per 600 pa)
    06 11.11 (66.66 per 600 pa)
    07 14.09 (84.54 per 600 pa)
    08 10.54 (63.24 per 600 PA)
    After all the times you've copied and pasted that, I thought I'd fix it for you. :O) j/k
    2014 predictions:
    99-63 WS champs (Cards take 2nd WC, Mil 3rd, Pit 4th, Chi 5th)
    Bruce/Votto neck and neck MVP race (neither takes it)
    Bailey CYA winner
    Hamilton ROY & GG


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