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Thread: Reds are at payroll budget

  1. #61
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    I still would double the bet if I could.
    I would gladly double the bet. What else would you like to wager?
    This team, will now struggle to score 700 runs, forget 750...

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    Anyway, I think you are right when you said that owner lied, but I am glad that he did. I would rather have the Reds focused on the future than wasting resources on an older big bat. This allows the team flexiblity to make a move midseason if they are in contention.
    WOW, that is a HOOT!!! Seriously, Comedy Gold!! I'm laughing because otherwise I'd cry at how absurd that is...
    They'll be out of it by Memorial Day...

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    I am glad that Cast has seen the light and understands that with the Reds young core, a long term, build from within plan is best.
    Then they might as well trade everyone making over $5M on this roster.

    What's the use of having 3 $12M pitchers with this offense/defense? Harang, Arroyo, Cordero are wastes of money at this point.

    Currently on Offense, CF, LF, and SS are a joke. I know Drew Stubbs will be OPS-ing .900 in 2010 according to you, but here in reality...

    Sad Sad state of affairs...

    PEACE

    -BLEEDS
    I think that in a year or two, one of these guys - Frazier, Dorn, Valaika, Cumberland, Stubbs - will be ready to replace Dunn. They won't hit as many home runs as Dunn, but they should have similar OPS. - 757690, July 22, 2008

    Alonso will be playing 1B for the REDS and batting 4th one year from today. - Kingspoint, July 9, 2009

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  3. #62
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    Quote Originally Posted by mlh1981 View Post
    Why do you say this? Seems to me that getting a ballpark just a short 6 seasons ago all but guarantees to keep them in town a long time, and never once have I heard a rumor about the team moving. Even in lean years, they still draw decent, and from someone who lives in Pittsburgh and goes to all the Reds/Pirates game, I can vouch and say that Reds fans, even during this recent bad run, are still WAYY more into the game, and more knowledgable, than Pirates fans (although I guess 16 losing seasons will do that to ya.)
    Sure, they are about the only team the Reds can beat, of course the Reds fans are into the games played in PNC!!!

    Pittsburgh might be the only team worse than the Reds, and IMO they are going to give us a run for our money for the basement in the NL Central this year...

    PEACE

    -BLEEDS
    I think that in a year or two, one of these guys - Frazier, Dorn, Valaika, Cumberland, Stubbs - will be ready to replace Dunn. They won't hit as many home runs as Dunn, but they should have similar OPS. - 757690, July 22, 2008

    Alonso will be playing 1B for the REDS and batting 4th one year from today. - Kingspoint, July 9, 2009

  4. #63
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    Quote Originally Posted by mlh1981 View Post
    Thankfully, noone else in that division outside of the Cubs looks to be very competitive this season. All have either suffered too many losses in the free agent market, or have done absolutely nothing this offseason. I think the Reds can leapfrog several teams this year.
    Better get that record, it's skipping, heard this same tune last year...

    PEACE

    -BLEEDS
    I think that in a year or two, one of these guys - Frazier, Dorn, Valaika, Cumberland, Stubbs - will be ready to replace Dunn. They won't hit as many home runs as Dunn, but they should have similar OPS. - 757690, July 22, 2008

    Alonso will be playing 1B for the REDS and batting 4th one year from today. - Kingspoint, July 9, 2009

  5. #64
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    Quote Originally Posted by DannyB View Post
    For the record, here is what Bob Castellini said when he took over as Reds owner Friday, Jan. 20, 2006:

    "Weíre buying the Reds to win. Anything else is unacceptable. We will not rest until we put a winner on the field Ė year in and year out."

    Other Castellini snippets from that day:

    "The bottom line is that we are not going to rest until our fans are happy. My wife, Susie, has a pillow in our living room. Stitched into the pillow is the phrase, 'If Mama ainít happy, ainít nobody happy.í In the Reds organization, if our fans ainít happy, ainít nobody happy."

    "I want to make a promise today to Reds fans, a promise from one fan to another: We will bring championship baseball to Cincinnati."
    Those quotes literally make me sick.

    They obviously don't give a crap about any of the fans. Only the dumb ones who are impressed with the signing of Wily Tavares.

    He obviously is only intent on making money - which he won't do with this team, since Nobody is going to come out to watch this team.

    PEACE

    -BLEEDS
    I think that in a year or two, one of these guys - Frazier, Dorn, Valaika, Cumberland, Stubbs - will be ready to replace Dunn. They won't hit as many home runs as Dunn, but they should have similar OPS. - 757690, July 22, 2008

    Alonso will be playing 1B for the REDS and batting 4th one year from today. - Kingspoint, July 9, 2009

  6. #65
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    Quote Originally Posted by Nasty_Boy View Post
    The Reds need to understand that if you put a good product on the field people will show up. The economy is bad, but people will come see a winning team. This is such a lame excuse to go cheap. I would have been okay with not spending money and going with the young guys, but the signing of Taveras makes the front office look like idiots. They overpaid for a non-tendered CF that is teh suck at getting on base! The also give 2 years to a league average reliever (Lincoln) that you should be able to produce from the farm system (hello Roenicke, Manuel, Fisher). This organization is a freeaking joke!
    Quote Originally Posted by Old NDN View Post
    It sure motivates me to get in the car, drive 31/2 hr, get scalped tickets and go to a game. The Reds sure aren't doing much to encourage the fans. I can think of a lot of things I could/should be spending $$ on, instead of Reds tickets. Now, I don't have too tough a choice to make.
    Quote Originally Posted by bounty37h View Post
    I agree, but the Reds have to realize its a business, and businesses have to put out a product consumers want/need, esp in hard times, if they want said consumers to still purchase and keep business in, well, business.
    Agree 1,000,000%.

    If Bob C thinks that people are going to come watch this pathetic team in July/August/September, he's got another thing coming.

    Reds fans aren't stupid. They know this team sucks. They also heard all the lies he's told.

    Sad thing is, this stadium could be sold out if they put a winner in it. Reds fans love winners. But, instead of INVESTING in a team to make it better, they are cutting back - and over-investing in crap players instead, throwing 10 $100 bills away instead of spending $1000 once.

    All this team needed was a SERIOUS LF bat, and they could have lived with a no-stick/all D SS if Gonzo couldn't go, and Dickerson in CF with guys from the AAA system competing in ST for a chance to to back him up/platoon if necessary. Instead we invest $6M in a NEGATIVE VORP CF-er and JHJ for LF.

    Pathetic.
    Simply.
    Pathetic.

    PEACE

    -BLEEDS
    I think that in a year or two, one of these guys - Frazier, Dorn, Valaika, Cumberland, Stubbs - will be ready to replace Dunn. They won't hit as many home runs as Dunn, but they should have similar OPS. - 757690, July 22, 2008

    Alonso will be playing 1B for the REDS and batting 4th one year from today. - Kingspoint, July 9, 2009

  7. #66
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    The losing stops now.....lol. The sad thing is Bleeds I'm not even mad or angry anymore, but rather just feel pure apathy. I can say that I will not make the drive up this year to watch crappy baseball. As a matter of fact, until the Reds show they are serious about putting a decent product on the field I am done giving them my money.

    I'll still watch on TV, and post here with you guys, because it's free. However, I am not going to continue to support the "Bob Cast Retirement Fund"

  8. #67
    Socratic Gadfly TheNext44's Avatar
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    Quote Originally Posted by BLEEDS View Post
    I would gladly double the bet. What else would you like to wager?
    This team, will now struggle to score 700 runs, forget 750...

    PEACE

    -BLEEDS
    Just so you know the bet you have between 757690 is that the Reds will score more runs in 2009 than they did in 2008. They scored 704 runs in 2008, not 750. Just making sure you know that before you double your bet.

  9. #68
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    Quote Originally Posted by BLEEDS View Post
    Those quotes literally make me sick.

    They obviously don't give a crap about any of the fans. Only the dumb ones who are impressed with the signing of Wily Tavares.

    He obviously is only intent on making money - which he won't do with this team, since Nobody is going to come out to watch this team.

    PEACE

    -BLEEDS
    I was impressed by the signing of Willy Taveras. It was quite impressive to get rid of a guy like Freel and give a guy as poor as Taveras a two year deal, that is backloaded no less. Anyone who thinks that that move is a good thing for the reds has got an impressively optimistic outlook on life, I certainly cannot criticize that.
    Baseball is not necessarily an obsessive-compulsive disorder, like washing your hands 100 times a day, but it's beginning to seem that way. We're reaching the point where you can be a truly dedicated, state-of-the-art fan or you can have a life. Take your pick. ~Thomas Boswell

    Having a life is overrated.

  10. #69
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    I am going to go to 3 reds games in Cincy this upcoming year. The white sox play down there for a 3 game set and I loved eating skyline cheese coneys
    Baseball is not necessarily an obsessive-compulsive disorder, like washing your hands 100 times a day, but it's beginning to seem that way. We're reaching the point where you can be a truly dedicated, state-of-the-art fan or you can have a life. Take your pick. ~Thomas Boswell

    Having a life is overrated.

  11. #70
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    I think baseball will be the most susceptible of the major sports to the economic downturn. They have less revenue sharing than the other leagues, larger guaranteed contracts, and a larger reliance on the gate (particularly in smaller markets). Ohio's economy stinks, and I'm sure that we will see a significant downturn in attendance around the game this year.

    As a side not, I'm hoping that this trend will begin to bring ballpark prices back to a reasonable level.
    Variatio delectat - Cicero

  12. #71
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    Quote Originally Posted by improbus View Post
    I think baseball will be the most susceptible of the major sports to the economic downturn. They have less revenue sharing than the other leagues, larger guaranteed contracts, and a larger reliance on the gate (particularly in smaller markets). Ohio's economy stinks, and I'm sure that we will see a significant downturn in attendance around the game this year. ...
    It's interesting that you mention Ohio's economy cuz I think Michigan's economy is in even worse shape. Makes me wonder if it could affect the Tigers to the point where they have to unload a contract or two.
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

  13. #72
    Socratic Gadfly TheNext44's Avatar
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    I am glad that Walt finally talked some sense into Cast's head. The only way a mid market team can compete is to build from within, put up a solid, but not great team with a flexible payroll, coming out of spring training, hope everyone stays healthy, you get a few breaks along the way and are in contention at midseason. Then you fill in your weakness and go for it, but only when you know that you are in contention.

    This is why payflex is so important to a mid market team. If you blow your wad on big name players in the off season, you don't have the resources to fix what needs to be fixed mid season, or even worse, as we found out last year, you find yourself out of it and have wasted a ton of money, and have some dead weight on your payroll.

    I like this approach, as long as it is stuck to as a long term plan, and Cast doesn't changes his mind again next year and signs a bunch of free agents.

  14. #73
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    Quote Originally Posted by JoshFogg View Post
    The Cincinnati Reds, as you know them, will not be a professional franchise for much longer. If you look at all of the teams in the league, the Reds really do not deserve to have the franchise anymore. Despite the history, there is nothing present that keeps this team in Cincinnati. Nashville, Orlando, Jacksonville, Memphis, Vegas, Columbus....all of those cities can better support a team. Plus, new owners and an entire new staff would help too. by 2015....the REds will be out of Cincy...IMO
    Moving the Reds won't solve anything. If you put lipstick on a pig to try to make it look prettier, guess what? It's still a pig! Just like if you moved the Reds to a city you think would support them more, you'll likely have the same garbage front office making the same bonehead decisions. You have to have a shrewd front office to create a contender with a smaller payroll, and the Reds haven't necessarily had that in the last few years.

  15. #74
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    I don't really get it. Why spend money on Hernandez, Weathers, Willy, Hairston at all if you're not going to spend more money to compete? None of the four are bargains for a cash-strapped team. Like Fay said, if you didnt waste the bucks on them, you could've afforded something of quality. Makes no sense unless you are playing for 4th instead of 5th. Either way you suck. The Cubs have improved as well as other clubs in the NL. Why would anyone come to watch a team that finished poorly last season that has went backwards to terms of personnel compared to their competition?

    Also, either the Reds need to spend the extra dollars to compete or gut the big contracts and trade off Harang, Arroyo, Cordero, Phillips, etc. and stockpile prospects. The middle of the road route gets you in the middle of the standings. Does anyone care if you're 4th instead of 6th at the end of the season? I don't.

    I won't be attending one game this season. If Bob won't spend money then neither will I. I can imagine the economy affects me more than him.
    If you ain't first, you're last! - Ricky Bobby

  16. #75
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    Re: Reds are at payroll budget

    Newman, I agree with you, but I think the Reds management actually thinks that the players they've brought in will make the team good - they believe this speed, defense, pitching and manufacturing runs line that they're selling. Dusty appears to be high on Willy and Gomes, and I think Dusty is playing a bigger role than people suspect in shaping the team. He was big on bringing in Patterson and Bako last year and that's what the Reds did. So, you've got Dusty planning his lineup based on ideas like his stated belief that Tavaras had 30 doubles and double-digit triples last year.

    What's most disappointing to me about the confirmation that the Reds are finished with their offseason additions is that even for the relatively small amount of money they spent, they didn't spend it well. I don't know how anybody could without bias give them a grade of higher than a "C" for this offseason. The Reds need better than a C from their management to take the step from where they've been the past 15 decade to regaining their place as a competent and winning franchise. If Castellini and Jocketty aren't doing A or at least B work in this smallish market, the Reds will continue to fail.

    I agree with many that the Reds have better pitching and more young talent in their system than they've had in a while, but without smart moves and using money and trades wisely to bring in good players to fill the inevitable holes in their in-house talent, they'll squander this opportunity. The Reds' in-house talent isn't so overwhelming compared to other teams that management can just sit back and wait for the youngsters to start winning pennants. And in the meantime, each year that the team posts another losing record makes it just that much harder to attract fans (revenue) and good players from outside their own system.


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