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Thread: What if...

  1. #1
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    What if...

    Homer Bailey and Micah Owings both continue to do well throughout Spring Training. Would you consider trading Arroyo or even Harang for a package centered around a Leftfielder that could hit clean up?
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  3. #2
    We Need Our Myths reds1869's Avatar
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    Re: What if...

    That depends on the LF. In most cases I would say no...long term track record means more to me than a good spring.

  4. #3
    Mr.Redlegs is my homeboy Eric_the_Red's Avatar
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    Re: What if...

    No....you can never have too much pitching.

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    Re: What if...

    No, but I wouldn't mind moving Arroyo for a SS. I think that Votto (or Frazier if Alonso doesn't pan out) will be in LF before too long. You also have to look at a guy like Franscisco that mind end up in LF if Edwin lives up to the potential. I think SS is the biggest question mark for now and the future, that's the hole I would try and fill by trading Arroyo. Not to mention I think we are a least a year away from serious contention.

    I would also explore moving BP and his large contract, if he continues to show signs of regression.
    I know a lot of people are talking about his on-base percentage (.308 in 2008), but I like to think more in terms of him his in-scoring position percentage. - Our Beloved Manager

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    Re: What if...

    No way. 6 starters will end up being necessary. If they both get to pitch enough in the big leagues, and pitch well, I would consider it by the all-star break.

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    Re: What if...

    You have to keep both. You can use an extra starter as a spot starter or for long relief.

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    Re: What if...

    Dont ever trade pitching.........I think thats obvious after watching the Reds forever. We finally have some ....why trade it away?

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    Re: What if...

    No way. Even if they both pitch brilliantly throughout ST there is no guarantee that either will continue their success into the season. Plus, I dont imagine there is really hot market out there for teams looking for Arroyo/Harang at this point. Surely no one would give up a whole lot more than what we already have.

    And I agree--you can NEVER have too much pitching.

  10. #9
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    Re: What if...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nasty_Boy View Post
    No, but I wouldn't mind moving Arroyo for a SS. I think that Votto (or Frazier if Alonso doesn't pan out) will be in LF before too long. You also have to look at a guy like Franscisco that mind end up in LF if Edwin lives up to the potential. I think SS is the biggest question mark for now and the future, that's the hole I would try and fill by trading Arroyo. Not to mention I think we are a least a year away from serious contention...
    x2 Finding our next ss is the #1 priority this year. If we can find one than that will make playoffs in 2010 a more realistic possibility.

    Maybe at the all-star break. But we can't just jump the gun off of a couple weeks of results in spring training. I still think Bailey will benefit from a little more time in AAA. If two of: Owings, Bailey, Thompson, Ramirez are pitching well over the next three months than I'd make Arroyo available in a deal in june/july. Teams that have a shot at the playoffs tend to be a little more willing to deal good prospects.
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

  11. #10
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    Re: What if...

    I third the notion that if we believe ourselves to be over-loaded with SP, then Arroyo should be the one we look to flip, and it would ideally be for an everyday SS.

    But I can't help finding myself a little bit sad that the Yankees managed to get a deal done with Pettite to shore up their rotation, because if they came to us and offered Swisher for Arroyo (straight up, or close to it), I'd jump on it. Jump, I says. Prying Dukes away from DC would be cool, too, but with the salary inequity there, I have a feeling it'd take Arroyo+ (or require us taking on a bad contract along with Dukes).

    But more than likely, I'm sure this discussio will be moot by June 1. Injuries have a way of happening, and what looks promising after 5 IP of spring training tends not to hold up once the games count. [And let's not forget that Volquez/Cueto aren't exactly proven commodities, yet.] Right now, I actually like the idea of being well-stocked enough to weather that kind of storm, without having to resort to counting on Ramirez or Thompson to be much more than an emergency spot-starting call-up every now and again.


    Rick

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    Re: What if...

    Quote Originally Posted by FlightRick View Post
    I third the notion that if we believe ourselves to be over-loaded with SP, then Arroyo should be the one we look to flip, and it would ideally be for an everyday SS.

    But I can't help finding myself a little bit sad that the Yankees managed to get a deal done with Pettite to shore up their rotation, because if they came to us and offered Swisher for Arroyo (straight up, or close to it), I'd jump on it. Jump, I says. Prying Dukes away from DC would be cool, too, but with the salary inequity there, I have a feeling it'd take Arroyo+ (or require us taking on a bad contract along with Dukes).

    But more than likely, I'm sure this discussio will be moot by June 1. Injuries have a way of happening, and what looks promising after 5 IP of spring training tends not to hold up once the games count. [And let's not forget that Volquez/Cueto aren't exactly proven commodities, yet.] Right now, I actually like the idea of being well-stocked enough to weather that kind of storm, without having to resort to counting on Ramirez or Thompson to be much more than an emergency spot-starting call-up every now and again.


    Rick
    I agree that trading for a SS would be a good option as well if we feel like we have a surplus. I like the Arroyo for Swisher deal as well. Anyone else on agree?
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  13. #12
    Mr.Redlegs is my homeboy Eric_the_Red's Avatar
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    Re: What if...

    Again, a bad idea to trade away pitching. But IF Arroyo were traded, you honestly think the team would receive a starting SS worth anything in return?!

    C'mon, use your heads. Don't be like those callers to the post-game show last year suggesting the team trade Dave Ross, Ryan Freel and Gary Majewski for Carlos Beltran, or some similar nonsense.

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    Re: What if...

    Quote Originally Posted by Newman4 View Post
    I agree that trading for a SS would be a good option as well if we feel like we have a surplus. I like the Arroyo for Swisher deal as well. Anyone else on agree?

    Take a wait and see on the surplus, but if they do hold up to June, than I like either the SS or big bat. Swisher could be, but he needs to bounce back this spring first.

    Again, a bad idea to trade away pitching. But IF Arroyo were traded, you honestly think the team would receive a starting SS worth anything in return?!
    If Arroyo is pitching adequately, then a decent SS isn't, IMO, out of line. There will be teams looking for average, innings-eater pitching come June. Guaranteed.

    But I'm with you that I'm dubious of us actually having the "surplus".
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  15. #14
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    Re: What if...

    But I'm with you that I'm dubious of us actually having the "surplus".
    As am I... I thought we were speaking in hypotheticals.

    But at any point during the season especially trade deadline time that you can move that money, if you are not in contention, then you move it... especially if a SS can be had in return.

    As for Swisher, I absolutely love him as a player and I think he and the Reds would benefit greatly by coming together. But Arroyo is a top trade chip and I would rather him fill a bigger need. In the past I would have been all about trading for the proven veteran player, but my confidence in the Reds farm system and player development has grown to the point that I'm content to turn it over to the prospects. There is (young) top level projected talent to be found at every position, except SS, between the rookies and the prospects. Even though the jury is still out on guys like Valaika (range, glove) and Cozart (bat) over whether they can be major league regulars. Honestly every big contract would be available for trade if it were up to me. You're gonna need that money when Jay, Joey, Volquie, and Cueto hit their arbitration/free agent years.
    I know a lot of people are talking about his on-base percentage (.308 in 2008), but I like to think more in terms of him his in-scoring position percentage. - Our Beloved Manager

  16. #15
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    Re: What if...

    I would keep all of our pitchers as long as we are in contention for the play offs.

    Let me ask you guys this.

    How bad would we all feel if the Reds traded Arroyo now for a ok SS(probably the best we could get for him at this point).Then come July we are contending but have some injuries in the rotation(happens to all most all teams at some point during a long season).Then we would end up having to trade some of our young talent that we are so excited about for somebody probably not even as good as Arroyo.

    IMO we take our chances with what we have at SS and keep all of our pitching.


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