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Thread: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

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    Member membengal's Avatar
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    Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    They have started three games, each time when Arroyo has started.

    Reds are 3-0 in those games.

    Reds are 4-6 in games not started by Janish/Hanigan.

    So, yeah, small sample size and all that, but...one can start to make a pretty good case, based on what we see when those two are in the game, that this team more completely lives up to its lip service to emphasis on defense, and Janish, at least, has more of a stick in limited action than we saw from him last year. Point in fact, Janish was really actually raking pretty good and with some authority in spring training as well.

    So, now what? I am NOT advocating for a switch in starters, per se. But I am thinking that it would be nice to see Janish/Hanigan starting more than once every five games. Janish should be starting three or so games a week, and Hanigan at least a second game a week. This team is potentially stronger if they do.

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    They have started three games, each time when Arroyo has started.

    Reds are 3-0 in those games.

    Reds are 4-6 in games not started by Janish/Hanigan.

    So, yeah, small sample size and all that, but...one can start to make a pretty good case, based on what we see when those two are in the game, that this team more completely lives up to its lip service to emphasis on defense, and Janish, at least, has more of a stick in limited action than we saw from him last year. Point in fact, Janish was really actually raking pretty good and with some authority in spring training as well.

    So, now what? I am NOT advocating for a switch in starters, per se. But I am thinking that it would be nice to see Janish/Hanigan starting more than once every five games. Janish should be starting three or so games a week, and Hanigan at least a second game a week. This team is potentially stronger if they do.
    I'm in mucho agreement here -- been thinking the same thing. Let it play out for awhile, but if trends continue much longer this will become a playing time issue that sees play in the media mainstream, I think. You can already sense the TV broadcasters' preference for Janish and Hanigan.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    I'd just pitch Arroyo every game.

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    I haven't watched any games in which Arroyo has pitched this season, nor looked at the offensive numbers. They would suffer from the same sample-size issue.

    The popular pre-season perception was that they were both the superior defenders at their positions, but the Reds offense would suffer with Janish/Hanigan in the lineup. To what extent are those perceptions proving true or false?
    /r/reds

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    Princeton: Do Janish and Hanigan come with him? (Nice small sample size snark, but I did note that issue in the header and my first post...)

    Yes, Arroyo has pitched well (other than Game 1). But not out-of-this-world well. And I think having Janish/Hanigan for defense, at the least, has helped him in his starts...
    Last edited by membengal; 04-22-2009 at 12:01 PM.

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    Quote Originally Posted by Unassisted View Post
    I haven't watched any games in which Arroyo has pitched this season, nor looked at the offensive numbers. They would suffer from the same sample-size issue.

    The popular pre-season perception was that they were both the superior defenders at their positions, but the Reds offense would suffer with Janish/Hanigan in the lineup. To what extent is that proving true or false?
    Janish has been far better with the stick in the limited sample size (4 for 10, a double among his four hits, two rbi and a run scored). And, to my eye, far better with the glove (far superior range).

    Hanigan is 3 for 11 with a BB. But he's had a cannon behind the dish and is just erasing base-runners.

    Alex G has been woeful at the plate (3 for 32, two doubles in the three hits, one run and one rbi).

    Ramon H has struggled (7 for 36, 3 walks, one HR, one double, three runs, four rbi) but has also had some big hits (that homer in Houston, obviously).
    Last edited by membengal; 04-22-2009 at 11:59 AM.

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    Janish has been far better with the stick in the limited sample size (4 for 10, a double among his four hits, two rbi and a run scored). And, to my eye, far better with the glove (far superior range).

    Hanigan is 3 for 11 with a BB. But he's had a cannon behind the dish and is just erasing base-runners.

    Alex G has been woeful at the plate (3 for 32, two doubles in the three hits, one run and one rbi).

    Ramon H has struggled (7 for 36, 3 walks, one HR, one double, three runs, four rbi) but has also had some big hits (that homer in Houston, obviously).
    I liked Janish's approach last season he just wasn't strong enough at the plate. Apparently he got strong over the off season and it looks like he has more pop in his swing. Hanigan doesn't look lost at the plate, but Hernandez has a better offensive game. If Hernandez doesn't start to hit soon Hanigan may replace him based upon defensive merits.

    The issue that I have with a quick hook with Gonzo and Hernandez is that you are giving up some power. Both players can hit 20+ hrs especially playing in GABP. I don't think either Janish or Hanigan can do that.

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    Not advocating a quick hook. Musing about a little extra playing time a week.

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    I'd vote for letting Hanigan and Janish keep starting for a few games and see what happens. When given the opportunity, they're getting the job done quite well. If they're out-performing the de facto starters, I'd stick with them.

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    You guys are missing the all important point: Hernandez and Gonzo make about 20x what Hanigan and Janish make, they MUST be better players.

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    Hanigan has been impressive in terms of throwing out runners, but there is more to defense at that position than throwing. Hanigan is a good defender, but I have enjoyed watching Hernandez. He frames pitches, handles plays at the plate and blocks balls as well as any catcher the Reds have had in a while. Personally, I think the guy is a major upgrade. You don't give up on him and his track record because of a slow start.

    It's great to have a good backup in Hanigan, but Hernandez is the starter.

    I'm not sure what to do about shortstop. Gonzo is the superior player when right, but will he be right this season? Again, you don't cast him aside based on a slow start. Plus, I'm fairly certain Janish will struggle to hit much at all if he gets extended playing time. The bottom line is we don't have an answer at that position -- and that's a problem.

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    Quote Originally Posted by hebroncougar View Post
    You guys are missing the all important point: Hernandez and Gonzo make about 20x what Hanigan and Janish make, they MUST be better players.
    There's also the intangible "manager-respect" factor. Hopefully Dusty will be able to respect the results of the young guys as much the number of digits on the veterans' paychecks.
    /r/reds

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    It's nice having a SS who can actually field the position.

    Hanigan has a cannon.

    Are Gonzo and Ramon anywhere close to being clearly superior offensive players to justify starting over Hanigan and Janish? My opinion is: "Hell No."
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    I think this senario is what Redszone was flipping off the hook about this winter, and why so many(myself included) hated the Taveras signing. I think everyone felt that unless a big bat was added this team would struggle to compete. Therefore most were in favor of going young and living with the results instead of adding payroll beyond this season. Even though Willy has played well so far, wouldn't a platoon of Stubbs, Dickerson, and whoever have the Reds in the same position? The same can be said about Hanigan behind the plate, especially if a cheap veteran was acquired to back him up... Gonzo was a product of offseason's past, but the money given to below average players the last few offseasons for multiple years is really comical. And you can throw Mike Lincoln into that mix as well.

    Stubbs CF
    Dickerson LF/CF
    Votto 1b
    Edwin 3b
    Bruce RF
    BP 2b
    Hanigan C
    Janish SS

    Bring in a decent OF bat to play LF (for Hernandez's money) and even mix and match with CD in CF.

    Is that lineup really less competitive than what we have? For the money, I'd much rather live and die with the above.
    I know a lot of people are talking about his on-base percentage (.308 in 2008), but I like to think more in terms of him his in-scoring position percentage. - Our Beloved Manager

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    Re: Janish/ Hanigan: Small Sample Size Food for Thought

    Quote Originally Posted by Nasty_Boy View Post
    I think this senario is what Redszone was flipping off the hook about this winter, and why so many(myself included) hated the Taveras signing. I think everyone felt that unless a big bat was added this team would struggle to compete. Therefore most were in favor of going young and living with the results instead of adding payroll beyond this season. Even though Willy has played well so far, wouldn't a platoon of Stubbs, Dickerson, and whoever have the Reds in the same position? The same can be said about Hanigan behind the plate, especially if a cheap veteran was acquired to back him up... Gonzo was a product of offseason's past, but the money given to below average players the last few offseasons for multiple years is really comical. And you can throw Mike Lincoln into that mix as well.

    Stubbs CF
    Dickerson LF/CF
    Votto 1b
    Edwin 3b
    Bruce RF
    BP 2b
    Hanigan C
    Janish SS

    Is that lineup really less competitive than what we have? For the money, I'd much rather live and die with the above.
    To be fair, the only reason we added Ramon was by swapping the undesirable contract of Freel. Overpaid vet for Overpaid vet, if you will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
    "Cheering for Kentucky is like watching Star Wars and hoping Darth Vader chokes an ewok"



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