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Thread: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

  1. #811
    Member OnBaseMachine's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    TAVERAS SITS: Center fielder Willy Taveras gets the night off tonight. Taveras entered today having gone 0-for-13 since getting one hit to snap an 0-for-32 streak.

    Lefty-hitting Chris Dickerson fills in tonight against Sox righty Jose Contreras. But, Baker indicated that the righty-hitting Taveras will play Saturday and Sunday against two lefty Chicago pitchers, Clayton Richard and Mark Buehrle.

    In his pre-game media session, Baker spoke with his usual calm candor but again expressed dismay at having to explain his lineups. Baker is aware of the public clamor to bench cold-hitting players.

    “First they want (Laynce) Nix to play instead of Dickerson,” Baker said. “... Now they want Dickerson instead of Taveras. It’s a long season, and you’ve got to go with a guy’s track record as well as what he’s doing now too. Quite honestly, I’m getting a little tired of having to testify to who I play and why, and how long and when.”

    http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs...cincinnati.com

    Taveras's track record says he's a bad player.
    I miss Adam Dunn.

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  3. #812
    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    Quote Originally Posted by GOYA View Post
    Compared to how Dickerson tears up lefties?

    .091/.286/.091/.377
    ...in 11 ABs this year.

    Dickerson's career splits:

    Code:
    I          Split  G GS  PA  AB R  H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO   BA  OBP  SLG  OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE BAbip tOPS+
        vs RHP as LH 81    234 196   55 10  4  8  22  7  3 34 60 .281 .391 .495 .885 97   2   2  1  1   1   1  .364   106
        vs LHP as LH 26     41  32    7  3  0  0   2  1  2  7  9 .219 .375 .313 .688 10   0   1  1  0   0   0  .304    63
    Not a whole lot to go on either way but I'll take that OBP if it's the best option.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  4. #813
    Start the Reactor! *BaseClogger*'s Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    Quote Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine View Post
    Taveras's track record says he's a bad player.
    Couldn't have put it better myself, OBM.

    There is a difference between "playing the hot hand" and sitting a guy who has gotten on base exactly once in his last 48 PAs...
    Last edited by *BaseClogger*; 06-19-2009 at 06:06 PM.
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

  5. #814
    Member Highlifeman21's Avatar
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    Re: If Taveras is the Villian, Why does Everyone Else Get a Pass?

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    I think if one is displeased with the topics being discussed, they should start a new topic.

    Complaining about complaining is worse than the complaining.
    Or maybe one should just not participate in the thread at all.

    If you don't like the soup, don't order the soup as an appetizer or entree.

  6. #815
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    deleted
    Last edited by Red in Chicago; 06-19-2009 at 11:02 PM. Reason: deleted for rudeness

  7. #816
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    You've got to love Dusty's track record comment. Taveras' track record says he's only a decent offensive player when he's getting unsustainably lucky with infield singles. Considering his legs aren't even 100%, his track record suggests he belongs on the bench.

    Dickerson's track record suggests he can get on base with regularity. This IS the 'Dusty plays veterans' complaint that we've not seen much evidence of thus far. Dusty might play a young guy if he's clearly the best option, but give him a "proven veteran" whose past performance gives him a shred of justification and it's going to take a monster breakthrough for the young guy to be the preferred option.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  8. #817
    Member Highlifeman21's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    Giles would not have his own thread like this.
    Griffey made a lot of ching, refused at least 1 trade out of town prior to actually letting us get rid of his deadweight, and we watched his number plummet while a Red.

    He got plenty of threads.

    Why in the world wouldn't Giles not have his own thread like this?

    If RZ is consistent about 1 thing, it's railing on players that are overpaid based on production. Or perception of overpaying based on perception of production. I guess those are 2 things.

    Regardless, if Brian Giles were a Red, you bet your bottom dollar he'd have threads like this.

  9. #818
    Member Highlifeman21's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    That there wouldn't be nearly as much hubbub about him since much of the board would have been pro-Giles.
    We would have been pro-Giles until Giles stopped being Brian Giles and started being like his brother, Marcus Giles, while continuing to make Brian Giles kinda money.

  10. #819
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    Quote Originally Posted by Highlifeman21 View Post
    You and I both know well that some people like to argue just for the sake of arguing.

    1/2 the time, they've contradicted themselves multiple times within a thread just b/c they want to take the other side, or stand up for the minority voice.

    Lately I've been accused of contradicting myself, but if posters could take a step back, look at the context and understand a poster's history, then they'd recognize consistency.

    But as I learned in a training seminar today, reading comprehension and literacy rates are why we have a social classes, and separate people on many levels.
    Maybe those others who seem to have contradicted themselves might not really have done so when their history and context are considered as well....
    "This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  11. #820
    Member Highlifeman21's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    I don't think so.

    We have a $12MM pitcher with an ERA of well over 5 and a $5MM SS with stats that are extremely Taveras like and there aren't 700 post threads on what they are doing to the team. We also have a guy who was supposed to be an anchor in the bullpen with an ERA over 5 and a WHIP of over 1.70. He isn't getting destroyed nearly as much. Same with Bruce, he of the career .311 OBP. And I won't even bring up the injured Encarnacion.

    Meanwhile, many would like us to believe that Taveras' contract is out of control, a drain on the payroll and the main reason why this team isn't in first place.

    Giles would have been heralded as a smart acquisition because of his saberfriendly statistics and maybe that would have been the correct assessment. Some of people leading the anti-Taveras movement are the ones who lean more to the stat side of the game and that is fine as well. But they are also the ones who continue to harp on about Taveras and his out making abilities and his OBP and about how everyone knew this except Walt and Dusty and everything else and they sure as heck wouldn't be banging on about Giles this way.
    I've banged on Arroyo since the end of 2006, when we should have traded him.

    I'm constantly reminded that he's "a good value for a league average pitcher". Yet in my eye, he's a waste of money and resources, when with or without Arroyo this isn't a competing or a winning club.

    Believe me, the "stat posters" would bang on Giles if he were currently a Red b/c he's being un-Giles.

  12. #821
    Member Highlifeman21's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    Maybe those others who seem to have contradicted themselves might not really have done so when their history and context are considered as well....
    I was speaking more to posters using both sides of their mouths within the same thread, as opposed to posters contradicting themselves in different threads.

  13. #822
    GR8NESS WMR's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    “First they want (Laynce) Nix to play instead of Dickerson,” Baker said. “... Now they want Dickerson instead of Taveras. It’s a long season, and you’ve got to go with a guy’s track record as well as what he’s doing now too. Quite honestly, I’m getting a little tired of having to testify to who I play and why, and how long and when.”
    Dusty is really something.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
    "Cheering for Kentucky is like watching Star Wars and hoping Darth Vader chokes an ewok"


  14. #823
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    Willy Taveras badminton, knocking over the net and back... too easy a game for me.

  15. #824
    I'm gettin paper Homer Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    Dusty makes me want to punch a wall. Seriously unbelievable. Oh my god the fans wanted the better player to play in left, and the better player to play in center. Shame on them. Why should I have to explain why I continue to play the wrong guy.

  16. #825
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Willy Taveras - 2009 to date

    Dusty: Quite honestly, I’m getting a little tired of having to testify to who I play and why, and how long and when.”
    Translation: I don't care what the numbers say, don't question my decisions because I'm smart and your dumb.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand


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