Per Buster Olney: Reds looking for a 3rd baseman

[GAC]

Based on his combined offensive and defensive production and the price of that production on the free agent market, Fangraphs shows him worth $48.1M over the last 3 years

What formula does Fangraph utilize to determine a player's monetary worth? That's interesting. And just how reliable is it?

You can certainly make the argument that the Reds can't afford market prices if you want to, but Beltre is not overpaid.

Agree. It's not an issue of worth, but of affordability.

We spend 33M, out of a 74M payroll, on three pitchers (Cordero, Harang, Arroyo). Are they worth it? Look at how much improved out pitching overall is this year. They are primarily the reason we are in the hunt this year. Now is the amount of money we're paying them "hindering" us in other areas? Good question. I'd say logically yes. You only have so much to spend. And this organization, as well as numerous others, are forced into a "rob Peter to pay Paul" mentality. We use to look for the "Harnischs" in pitching, while generously paying for position players.

I don't know if it was an intentional approach by this FO, but it appears they have sacrificed offense (a lot IMO) for pitching/defense. Look at out situation in LF right now. IMO, we obviously traded away Dunn for financial reasons and regardless of what one thinks of Dickerson/Nix/Gomes, IMO, we went on the cheap in a "crap shoot" approach. I have no problem with the cheap approach if a young player is at the ready (i.e. Bruce, Votto), or even has acquired an alternative solution in the market. But that is not what the Reds seem to do in various cases.

That is why we have the "holes" that we do on this team. Or else have a guy like JHJ who can be moved around the horn all the time.

[Hooligan]

How about getting Marte (AAA) from the Tribe. Once a hot prospect that is now rebuilding his way back into being a starting major league third baseman. Wouldn't cost much from a trade standpoint, young, inexpensive, would be here for years.

[fearofpopvol1]

The enthusiasm for DeRosa baffles me. His current OPS is .765, Hairston's is .780.

Current, being key.

Career:

DeRosa - .769
Hairston - .704

65 points is notable.

[RedLegSuperStar]

Texas is dangling Hank Blahlock in exchange for a reliever.

- MLBTradeRumors.com

[Eric_the_Red]

Texas is dangling Hank Blahlock in exchange for a reliever.

- MLBTradeRumors.com

"Mr. Lincoln, welcome to Texas."

[Bumstead]

lol...my guess is: not that reliever!

[Brutus]

I went through some of the possible 3B options that have been mentioned as potentially available, and compared their 3-year averages (2006-2008) with one another. I used only road splits to get a more adjusted comparison.

Here is what I came up with:

			AVG 	OBP 	SLG 	OPS	BB%	K%   HR%   GPA   wOBA PA/RC
Edwin Encarnacion	0.263	0.328	0.434	0.762	7.15% 17.82% 3.25% 0.256 0.335 7.7
Adrian Beltre		0.287	0.338	0.503	0.841	6.58% 15.93% 4.01% 0.278 0.362 6.5
Kevin Kouzmanoff	0.282	0.330	0.488	0.818	5.11% 17.80% 4.33% 0.271 0.353 7.0
Mark DeRosa		0.278	0.350	0.446	0.796	9.57% 17.38% 2.72% 0.269 0.351 7.0
Miguel Tejada		0.283	0.338	0.408	0.746	6.46% 12.17% 1.90% 0.254 0.332 8.0
Hank Blalock		0.254	0.305	0.414	0.719	7.02% 16.27% 2.91% 0.241 0.315 8.2
Jorge Cantu		0.231	0.282	0.379	0.661	6.17% 17.25% 3.01% 0.222 0.293 9.6

Again, this is based on AWAY splits for a 3-year period dating 2006-2008.

After seeing this, throwing in defense, it looks like Beltre is the best option by far. Kouzmanoff is actually an intriguing option if he is available. However, Beltre is my choice.

[Will M]

I went through some of the possible 3B options that have been mentioned as potentially available, and compared their 3-year averages (2006-2008) with one another. I used only road splits to get a more adjusted comparison.

Here is what I came up with:


Player ...............Ave/OBP/SLG/OPS... GPA...wOBA...PA/RC...BB%...K%
Edwin Encarnacion .263/.328/.434/.762 .256 .335 ... 7.7 ... 7.15% ... 17.82%
Adrian Beltre .........287/.338/.503/.841 .278 .362 ... 6.5 ... 6.56% ... 15.93%
Kevin Kouzmanoff....282/.330/.488/.818 .271 .353 ... 7.0 ... 5.11% ... 17.80%
Mark DeRosa..........278/.350/.446/.796 .269 .351 ... 7.0 ... 9.57% ... 17.38%
Miguel Tejada.........283/.338/.408/.746 .254 .332 ... 8.0 ... 6.46% ... 12.17%
Hank Blalock...........254/.305/.414/.719 .241 .315 ... 8.2 ... 7.02% ... 16.27%
Jorge Cantu............231/.282/.379/.661 .222 .293 .. 9.6 ... 6.17% ... 17.25%


And, though I did not include it, Beltre & Kouzmanoff had the highest HR% of these options in that time period as well. Again, this is based on AWAY splits for a 3-year period dating 2006-2008.

After seeing this, throwing in defense, it looks like Beltre is the best option by far. Kouzmanoff is actually an intriguing option if he is available. However, Beltre is my choice.

Brutus: back during the offseason lots of ORG members thought Beltre was a good target for the Reds. Unfortunately Walt doesn't listen to us.

[Ron Madden]

Good Bye Redszone ORG. We have morphed into Reds.com.

[Mario-Rijo]

Good Bye Redszone ORG. We have morphed into Reds.com.

Huh? What did I miss?

Holy crap I just realized I am at 4,999 posts, sorry but I didn't want to waste my 5,000th post on mentioning this.

[Ron Madden]

Huh? What did I miss?

Holy crap I just realized I am at 4,999 posts, sorry but I didn't want to waste my 5,000th post on mentioning this.

I'm sorry you wasted your 5,000th post with bullcrap. (That's my point.)

I used to come here for information about the Reds and to learn more about the game I love because RedsZone used to be the most informative Reds site on the Internet.

There was a time when we could acually learn something from the discussions here.

I'm afraid that's just not the case anymore.

[LoganBuck]

I'm sorry you wasted your 5,000th post with bullcrap. (That's my point.)

I used to come here for information about the Reds and to learn more about the game I love because RedsZone used to be the most informative Reds site on the Internet.

There was a time when we could acually learn something from the discussions here.

I'm afraid that's just not the case anymore.

I think what you are seeing is the descent into frustration again. Every year about this time, people throw out whatever ideas they can about how to fix the situation. Take a look around at other Reds forums, they have a negative tone as well.

We can all see it, the Reds just aren't good enough right now, especially without Votto, Volquez, and EdE. Take two impact players, and a solid everyday player away from any team, for months at a time, and things get pretty scary. They have to tread water, at least until next Sunday, when they hopefully, maybe, get all of them back. No amount of in depth statistical analysis, trade speculation, or whimsical prose will change that. Walt can't be a buyer, or seller, until he knows what they have.

[jojo]

I'm sorry you wasted your 5,000th post with bullcrap. (That's my point.)

I used to come here for information about the Reds and to learn more about the game I love because RedsZone used to be the most informative Reds site on the Internet.

There was a time when we could acually learn something from the discussions here.

I'm afraid that's just not the case anymore.

I still don't get the reds.com reference.

[Tony Cloninger]

I am more partial to Fastball.com....I had my Vada Pinson moniker then.

What we need is a shot of Chris Stynes/Jon Nunally type production from someone....anyone.