Alex Rios?

[OnBaseMachine]

Alex Rios may have talked his way right out of Toronto after profane exchange with fan
By STEVE SIMMONS

Last Updated: 7th June 2009, 4:47am

Alex Rios has turned into a $10-million embarrassment for the Toronto Blue Jays.

Never mind that he plays the outfield with a not-so-reckless indifference. Never mind that he has taken his five-tool gifts and squandered them with his lack of passion and apathy. Never mind that the hitting numbers aren't anywhere near where they are supposed to be.

All that pales when compared with his foolish act of the other night, exchanging swear words with a fan after turning down an autograph request from a kid, at a charity event no less. Available in today's technology for all to see on YouTube.

Whether management will see it this way or not, Rios essentially is done as a Blue Jay. Failing on the field can be accepted. Failing off the field reflects a certain lack of character. All the apologies in the world may not be able to correct that.

http://www.torontosun.com/sports/col...03471-sun.html

I won't post the video here since it contains some not-so-friendly language, but go to YouTube and type in Alex Rios to see the incident.

Anyways, I would like to see Jocketty go after Rios. He's a stud defender in the outfield (+11.9 UZR/150 in CF, +14.7 in RF) and has a chance to be a 25 HR, .850+ OPS hitter. He just hasn't put it together consistently with the bat yet but the potential is there. I'd offer Alonso + Bailey.

[NJReds]

Anyways, I would like to see Jocketty go after Rios. He's a stud defender in the outfield (+11.9 UZR/150 in CF, +14.7 in RF) and has a chance to be a 25 HR, .850+ OPS hitter. He just hasn't put it together consistently with the bat yet but the potential is there. I'd offer Alonso + Bailey.

I don't have a problem taking a chance on an overpaid, underachieiver with an attitude problem. Sometimes a change of scenery will do a guy good (although I see the Mets as a better landing spot for him).

No way I give up Alonso and Bailey, especially with Toronto being fed up with him. Taking a risk on a guy like that being paid over $10M? They'll get some middle of the road prospects, but that's it. Unless they're willing to pay more than half of his salary. Even then, I say no on Alonso.

[IslandRed]

Anyways, I would like to see Jocketty go after Rios. He's a stud defender in the outfield (+11.9 UZR/150 in CF, +14.7 in RF) and has a chance to be a 25 HR, .850+ OPS hitter. He just hasn't put it together consistently with the bat yet but the potential is there. I'd offer Alonso + Bailey.

I don't have a problem taking a chance on an overpaid, underachieiver with an attitude problem. Sometimes a change of scenery will do a guy good (although I see the Mets as a better landing spot for him).

Based on NJ's post later in the thread, Rios has about $60 million in guaranteed money coming over the next five years. For that price, I don't want any truck with a guy based on the ballplayer he hasn't yet become, nor am I going to invest that much in a change of scenery trade. I'm especially not going to hand over the cream of the farm system to roll the dice.

Consider that the payoff if the deal does work is simply a very good ballplayer earning his considerable salary. The downside is a huge albatross contract with little or no chance for the club to cut its losses. Admittedly, every long, expensive contract has that risk. But it's one thing when it happens unexpectedly, quite another when you can hear the albatross' wings flapping already.

If Toronto kicks in a bunch of money and doesn't want our best prospects in return, then it's a different discussion.

[fearofpopvol1]

I'd give them any guy in the system not named Alonso for Rios.

How about Stubbs and Bailey? I think that'd be pretty fair.

[wolfboy]

Alex Rios may have talked his way right out of Toronto after profane exchange with fan
By STEVE SIMMONS

Last Updated: 7th June 2009, 4:47am

Alex Rios has turned into a $10-million embarrassment for the Toronto Blue Jays.

Never mind that he plays the outfield with a not-so-reckless indifference. Never mind that he has taken his five-tool gifts and squandered them with his lack of passion and apathy. Never mind that the hitting numbers aren't anywhere near where they are supposed to be.

All that pales when compared with his foolish act of the other night, exchanging swear words with a fan after turning down an autograph request from a kid, at a charity event no less. Available in today's technology for all to see on YouTube.

Whether management will see it this way or not, Rios essentially is done as a Blue Jay. Failing on the field can be accepted. Failing off the field reflects a certain lack of character. All the apologies in the world may not be able to correct that.

http://www.torontosun.com/sports/col...03471-sun.html

I won't post the video here since it contains some not-so-friendly language, but go to YouTube and type in Alex Rios to see the incident.

Anyways, I would like to see Jocketty go after Rios. He's a stud defender in the outfield (+11.9 UZR/150 in CF, +14.7 in RF) and has a chance to be a 25 HR, .850+ OPS hitter. He just hasn't put it together consistently with the bat yet but the potential is there. I'd offer Alonso + Bailey.

Alonso and Bailey for Rios? That's a BIG no thanks for me, and that's just based on his on-field performance.

[OnBaseMachine]

Yeah, Alonso + Bailey may be a little too much. I figure it would take at least one of those two though, probably Alonso, plus another solid prospect.

[NJReds]

Here is his current contract info. He has a full no-trade clause:

7 years/$69.835M (2008-14), plus 2015 club option

08:$0.735M, 09:$5.9M, 10:$9.7M, 11:$12M, 12:$12M, 13:$12.5M, 14:$12.5M, 15:$13.5M club option ($1M buyout)

full no-trade clause, 2009-10
limited no-trade clause, 2011 - end of deal (may block trades to 6 clubs)

[Chip R]

You have to wonder if his stats are down because he's trying to get the Jays to trade him or if his skills have declined. If it's the former, what makes anyone think he wouldn't do it again once he's unhappy with his new team? That's one thing everyone gave Sheffield crap about when he was a kid with MIL and said he intentionally messed up to get traded. If it's the latter, do you really want him if his skills have declined?

[Kc61]

Arroyo and Heisey?

[Johnny Footstool]

If Rios is available, you go get him, period.

You start low, but if it takes Alonso and Bailey (I don't think it would), you make that deal.

I'll bet the Braves are kicking themselves right now.

[Blitz Dorsey]

If Rios is available, you go get him, period.

You start low, but if it takes Alonso and Bailey (I don't think it would), you make that deal.

I'll bet the Braves are kicking themselves right now.

You go get him period? Not even close. The guy is grossly overpaid, he's average-at-best at the plate, he'll steal less and less bases as he gets older (including this year so far), he's not good defensively and he's a jerk off the field. Other than that, I love him.

I wouldn't trade Yonder Alonso for that clown in a million years even if he didn't have that ridiculous contract. That is nonsense.

Sorry Blue Jays, you are stuck with Rios and his awful contract that will strap you for years.

[jojo]

You go get him period? Not even close. The guy is grossly overpaid, he's average-at-best at the plate, he'll steal less and less bases as he gets older (including this year so far), he's not good defensively and he's a jerk off the field. Other than that, I love him.

I wouldn't trade Yonder Alonso for that clown in a million years even if he didn't have that ridiculous contract. That is nonsense.

Sorry Blue Jays, you are stuck with Rios and his awful contract that will strap you for years.

He's a significantly above average bat and a plus defender who has yet to be overpaid but other than that you may be right.

[Blitz Dorsey]

He's a significantly above average bat and a plus defender who has yet to be overpaid but other than that you may be right.

Honestly, I haven't watched the guy play D all that much, but the general consensus coming out of Toronto is that the guy is afraid of walls, won't go all-out after fly balls, doesn't get good jumps, etc. I'm sure he has the tools to be a good defensive outfielder, but that doesn't mean he is.

The guy has over 230 ABs this year already (hardly a small sample size) and his OPS is in the .700s. That's pretty darn average. I know he's been better than than in his career, but I think he's a guy that has plateaued and even his manager Cito Gaston has said his swing is a complete mess. Says he's a mechanical nightmare. Maybe he can get it back, who knows. But right now, I'd call him an average hitter at best.

(Yes, I'm just mad I drafted the guy in my fantasy $$ league. Ha.)

[PuffyPig]

He's a significantly above average bat ......

He has a .790 lifetime OPS.....

Define "significantly above average".

[jojo]

He has a .790 lifetime OPS.....

Define "significantly above average".

What's more informative, his first 1000 PAs as a major leaguer in his early 20's where he struggled to OPS .700 or his last 2200 PAs where he has OPS'd significantly higher than .800?

His true offensive skill looks to be that of roughly a .360 wOBA hitter. League average is around .330. That makes him 15 runs better than average over 600 PAs. If he plays centerfield, he gets another 2.5 for position and another +5 for his defense (he looks to be a slightly plus defender in center) and another 20 runs for the difference between average and replacement over 600 PAs.

That adds up to him roughly being a 4 win player (over replacement). While that's not elite, it's significantly above average.