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Thread: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

  1. #61
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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by Edd Roush View Post
    They always say that catchers take longer to develop, so let's hope that Devin keeps his OPS going the right way.
    They say that because they are talking about a catcher's defense. It has nothing to do with the development of their offense.

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  3. #62
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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by BuckeyeRedleg View Post
    And AGAIN, you are missing my point. I wasn't saying he'd be a top college catcher had he gone to college. My point was that ANY top college catcher starts out at A (where he is) or Low A.
    Mitch Canham was taken in the supplemental 1st Round the same year as Mesoraco having just led his team to back-to-back College World Series Titles. Canham started out where you say (he was a 5-year College player). He's in AA now, and OPS's .800 in June and .975 in July. But, he's not throwing out any runners now or at any level so far in the pros.

    He's one of only a handful of catchers who called all his own games in College, good enough to win two World Series Titles while he was at it, so he had an advantage over many others entering pro ball. How well he's doing at calling games for San Antonio and for Lake Elsinore last year, I don't know.

    We took Mesoraco because he's young, and won't have any bad habits. The REDS get to train him the way they want to train a pro. I'm looking forward to what product comes out of him in the year 2012 and 2013. I'm not expecting anything from him at the Major League level until after that.

    It's just so early with him.

  4. #63
    Two-Time Batting Champ Edd Roush's Avatar
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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    All this should be put to rest next year. He will (hopefully) repeat High A, and it will be put up or shut up time in terms of his ability to hit (not to mention his defense.)
    I agree with this statement whole-heartedly. This view will be enhanced as well if our high A franchise moves out of the FSL and into Lynchburg. Playing in a pitcher-neutral league rather than a pitching-favoring league will allow us to get a good barometer of Mes's bat and we can start making assessments in July of next year (injuries permitting).

    I really hope we get out of the FSL next year and on into the future. I hate seeing pitchers stats inflated and wondering to what to degree as well as hitters stats deflated and wondering to what degree. At this point, all of the peripherals should look much more in line with the slash lines than they do in the FSL.

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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    They say that because they are talking about a catcher's defense. It has nothing to do with the development of their offense.
    actually, they're usually talking about offense. young catchers are so banged up that they don't get good offensive reps that they need to develop quickly.
    2015, baby!

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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Offensively, his month to month improvement has been impressive. Yes, his overall average suggests he should repeat high A. I believe, however, that he could start at AA if he continues to improve in August. He seems to be on a fast track. A repeat of high A would also block the advancement of others within a system that needs to graduate catchers.

    The answer to the thread question depends a lot on one's expectations. A ML catcher who hits .250 with 15-20 HRs and above average defense would be worth the number 1 pick.

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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by RED VAN HOT View Post
    The answer to the thread question depends a lot on one's expectations. A ML catcher who hits .250 with 15-20 HRs and above average defense would be worth the number 1 pick.
    +1 Absolutly. Jason Vartiek says hello.

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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Don't look now but Devin has now thrown out over 30% of the attempted base stealers against him this season. Since Mid May he is now at 47% (22 of 47).

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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by princeton View Post
    young catchers are so banged up that they don't get good offensive reps that they need to develop quickly.
    That might be, but they keep them around High-A and AA for longer periods because it's at those two levels where they learn the majority of their defensive signal calling. It's common for 95% of them to spend 3-4 years at those two levels for that purpose alone.

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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Don't look now but Devin has now thrown out over 30% of the attempted base stealers against him this season. Since Mid May he is now at 47% (22 of 47).
    Don't know how well he's doing at signal calling, but that's impressive...very impressive. Mesoraco is ahead of the curve at this point of his career in that area. The kid's obviously's got a gun.

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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by RED VAN HOT View Post
    Offensively, his month to month improvement has been impressive. Yes, his overall average suggests he should repeat high A. I believe, however, that he could start at AA if he continues to improve in August. He seems to be on a fast track. A repeat of high A would also block the advancement of others within a system that needs to graduate catchers.
    No chance. D-Mes has been overpromoted enough already. He needs to repeat high A next year, no matter what he does in the last month of the season.

    The answer to the thread question depends a lot on one's expectations. A ML catcher who hits .250 with 15-20 HRs and above average defense would be worth the number 1 pick.
    Of course- I think everyone on this board (and in the Reds organization) would happily take that from D-Mes. As of this point in time, it looks questionable at best as to whether he'll be able to provide that. That said of course, there is still plenty of time.

    I'd just like to see him put up a .750 OPS once (at any level.)
    Go BLUE!!!

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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    I don't know that he's been overpromoted at all. He's beginning to hold his own offensively at Sarasota and, as Doug has shown, he's making clear progress on his defense. In fact, it's entirely possible they put him at Sarasota instead of Dayton because they thought it would be easier for him to learn to catch with more experienced pitchers--and ones they weren't trying to teach as much new stuff. Placing guys in the minor leagues is not as simple as looking at their offensive stats and then making a call about where they belong.

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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    I don't know that he's been overpromoted at all. He's beginning to hold his own offensively at Sarasota and, as Doug has shown, he's making clear progress on his defense. In fact, it's entirely possible they put him at Sarasota instead of Dayton because they thought it would be easier for him to learn to catch with more experienced pitchers--and ones they weren't trying to teach as much new stuff. Placing guys in the minor leagues is not as simple as looking at their offensive stats and then making a call about where they belong.
    Ask any scout in the game. They'll tell you he's been overpromoted.
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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Ask any scout in the game. They'll tell you he's been overpromoted.

    I advocate challenging hitters, myself. And DMes's main attribute was always his bat. he's in the right place offensively. as he climbs the ladder, I think that he'll need a lot of time at AAA defensively.

    Zack Cozart is another player that has been aggressively promoted and has really responded offensively. I think that Reds should call up Cozart in September for a look-see, but I think that they'll cite the fact that he doesn't have to be protected for another year and won't advance him. Probably that's the best for Cozart long-term, but Reds really need a shortstop.
    2015, baby!

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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Ask any scout in the game. They'll tell you he's been overpromoted.

    How many have seen him?

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    Re: Will Devin Mesoraco be a bust?

    Quote Originally Posted by princeton View Post
    I advocate challenging hitters, myself. And DMes's main attribute was always his bat. he's in the right place offensively. as he climbs the ladder, I think that he'll need a lot of time at AAA defensively.

    Zack Cozart is another player that has been aggressively promoted and has really responded offensively. I think that Reds should call up Cozart in September for a look-see, but I think that they'll cite the fact that he doesn't have to be protected for another year and won't advance him. Probably that's the best for Cozart long-term, but Reds really need a shortstop.
    I like challenging hitters too. But there's a difference between challenging a hitter and promoting someone before they have shown any ability to hit (let alone play defense) in a lower league. Cozart came from a major college program and has put up back to back OPS of .785. That's pretty different than coming from a podunk high school and putting up OPS of .580, .710, and .680 respectively.

    There are many players from the SEC that have made the majors by the time they are Cozart's age. I don't know if anyone from Mesoraco's county has ever played professional ball. Big difference.

    As far as challenging hitters goes, I think that Todd Frazier and Cody Puckett should have been promoted months ago.
    Last edited by Benihana; 08-07-2009 at 11:15 AM.
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