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Thread: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

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  1. #1
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    I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    Lets hear someone refute it. The numbers support it. The guy throws absolute batting practice. I am not questioning his guts, his heart, his effort, anything like that. I am sure he's a nice guy. He's a decent hitting pitcher although I think too often that is getting him a free pass for the 88 mph batting practice he throws each start. The guy just doesn't miss any bats and throws a really hittable pitch. A disaster in our park. I wish they'd pull the plug on the Owings as the 5th starter experiment.
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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    Find another team, plug in their fifth starter's name everywhere in your post where you used the word Owings, and I'm sure your post would still hold up pretty accurate.
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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    Quote Originally Posted by TC81190 View Post
    Find another team, plug in their fifth starter's name everywhere in your post where you used the word Owings, and I'm sure your post would still hold up pretty accurate.
    You hit the nail on the head.

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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    ...and I told you he is, and he still is.

    He's a young pitcher, who's trading good starts with bad ones. Nobody would have pitched well today, not Harang, not Volquez, not Arroyo, not Cueto, if they saw that pitiful lineup that Dusty put together to back them up tonight.

    Having to throw a shutout just to give your team the ability to go into extra innings is way too much pressure to put onto a young pitcher like Cueto or Owings.

    Anything other than what happened tonight would have been a surprise.

    If it wasn't for Owing's 3-run homer last game, he would have lost after giving up only 2 runs. This time, he doesn't even get the opportunity to bat. That had to get into his head (that Baker is such an idiot).

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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    Owens is good enough to be our 5th starter.I think it will take at least a few starts in a row like tonight's before management would even start thinking(if they think at all) about replacing him.Seems like he bounces back after really bad outings though.

    Its will get more and more tempting to see what Baily could do in the bigs with that splitter but Owens hasn't lost his spot yet and Homer needs to keep proving he can get the job done at a high level for a littler longer at AAA.

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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    The numbers?

    Owings (even after tonight) has a 4.7-ish ERA, and (MUCH more tellingly to me, since I kind of like this stat) has 7 Quality Starts in 13 Games Started. If you count his 14th appearance (in relief during the marathon in San Diego), he basically has 8 Quality Appearances out of 14.

    In short: that means our #5 starter has kept us in the game and given us a chance to win more often than he's single-handedly put us out of a game. Eight times out of 14, he's held his own and done his job. Not setting the world on fire, maybe, but to say that's not "worthy" of being our #5 would seem to indicate a fundamental lack of understanding of what a fifth starter is expected to do or a fundamental belief that this is just a videogame where you can press a few buttons and force a dimwitted Xbox GM to make a trade in order to create a Dream Rotation.

    Something much more interesting about Owings that I was talking about with a friend tonight: does the DH have to bat for the pitcher? Or can you Designate a Hitter for anyone in the line-up? Neither of us knew what the MLB rule was... but if the DH exists without a specific clause about replacing the pitcher, would you let Owings hit if he were an AL pitcher (or an NL pitcher playing in an AL park)? I figure the hang-up there would be that if Owings didn't pitch well enough to get 2 ABs (which, as I outlined above, appears to happen roughly 6 times out of 14), then you're hamstringing yourself by letting Owings hit and DH'ing somebody in the place of Rosales or Taveras or whoever...

    A little something fun to think about. What would you do? And if anybody knows the exact MLB rule about DHs, I'd be interesting in learning about that, too....



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    Last edited by FlightRick; 06-23-2009 at 09:28 PM.

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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our * 5th spot *

    Quote Originally Posted by JayBruce32 View Post
    Lets hear someone refute it. The numbers support it. The guy throws absolute batting practice. I am not questioning his guts, his heart, his effort, anything like that.
    He is Cy Young compared to the last few years 5th starter slots for us.
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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    Quote Originally Posted by JayBruce32 View Post
    Lets hear someone refute it. The numbers support it. The guy throws absolute batting practice. I am not questioning his guts, his heart, his effort, anything like that. I am sure he's a nice guy. He's a decent hitting pitcher although I think too often that is getting him a free pass for the 88 mph batting practice he throws each start. The guy just doesn't miss any bats and throws a really hittable pitch. A disaster in our park. I wish they'd pull the plug on the Owings as the 5th starter experiment.
    You really don't get it do you? This isn't MLB 2K9 with the block trades turned off. Your not going to have an ace in your 5th spot in the rotation. Go look at other 5th starter in this league and compare Owings stats to thier's and then come back and answer your own question. You are always bashing him but you never have any answer to who should be in there. Well you do said it should be Bailey( How did that work out) but you also say Bailey should have been in the rotation ahead of Harang comming out of spring tranning.
    Last edited by Lockdwn11; 06-23-2009 at 09:42 PM.

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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    Quote Originally Posted by Lockdwn11 View Post
    You really don't get it do you? Go look at other 5th starter in this league and compare Owings stats to thier's and then come back and answer your own question.
    Your first post did just fine. Why make a second ripping into the same point?

    We'd be better suited with Bailey, Maloney, or someone with a future....... Owings throws batting practice. I am not imagining things.
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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    Quote Originally Posted by JayBruce32 View Post
    Your first post did just fine. Why make a second ripping into the same point?

    We'd be better suited with Bailey, Maloney, or someone with a future....... Owings throws batting practice. I am not imagining things.
    Not really rippin you but it gets old. We get it you don't like Owings. You think he sucks and he isn't good enough to be a 5th starter in this league even though he is only 26 and the numbers don't back up your clams, but did you really need to start a new thread on this I mean you have made your postion clear on how you feel about Owings in the past.

  11. #11
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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    Quote Originally Posted by Lockdwn11 View Post
    Not really rippin you but it gets old. We get it you don't like Owings. You think he sucks and he isn't good enough to be a 5th starter in this league even though he is only 26 and the numbers don't back up your clams, but did you really need to start a new thread on this I mean you have made your postion clear on how you feel about Owings in the past.
    But owings continues to prove my point and I'm not sure how anyone can defend it anymore..... he consistently gets hit hard.
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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    Quote Originally Posted by JayBruce32 View Post
    Your first post did just fine. Why make a second ripping into the same point?

    We'd be better suited with Bailey, Maloney, or someone with a future....... Owings throws batting practice. I am not imagining things.
    He probably did because this isn't your second, but maybe second dozenth post on the same thing.

    You seem to have a disconnect with reality on what a 5th starter is expected to do. Let me ask, what did Bailey and Maloney do on their last starts with the Reds?

    Also, why isn't this title about say, Arroyo? He still likely has a higher ERA than Owings even after this start, and is getting paid over $10 mil a year to do it. He seem to have some kind of odd rage against Owings, for whatever reason. Did he run over your dog or something? Sheesh.

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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    Quote Originally Posted by LouisvilleCARDS View Post
    You seem to have a disconnect with reality on what a 5th starter is expected to do. Let me ask, what did Bailey and Maloney do on their last starts with the Reds?

    Also, why isn't this title about say, Arroyo? He still likely has a higher ERA than Owings even after this start, and is getting paid over $10 mil a year to do it. He seem to have some kind of odd rage against Owings, for whatever reason. Did he run over your dog or something? Sheesh.
    Arroyo has pitched pretty darn good...but I guess if we look at ONE of his starts he has been terrible.

    Oh and on Homer I forgot that one start is enough to tell you that he isn't ready for big league hitters. If were making assumptions on one start why don't we look at Cueto's last start?? Lets get Cueto out of here I mean if you can't hole a 5 run lead you don't deserve to be in the Majors.



    What I am trying to say here is that Owings shows no improvement start after start. If Homer was in Owings spot, yes Homer may get knocked around a few times but im willing to bet he would at least show some improvement start after start.
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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    I dont have a problem with Owings either...not for a #5 anyway. But I decided to check a few other good options that other teams have as a #5 just for fun.

    Houston
    Russ Ortiz 3-3 3.47era

    Oakland
    V.Mazzaro 2-2 2.56era (only 31 ip though)

    StLouis
    B.Thompson 2-2 3.89

    Cubs
    Randy Wells 1-2 2.57

    TB
    J.Niemann 6-4 4.23


    so, to compare to the one post about plug in anyone's 5th starter and get the same results, I cant agree. I only checked about 10 teams and these 5 were superior. I'd say Owings is somewhere in the middle, closer to the bottom half than the top actually.

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    Re: I told you guys Owings wasn't worthy of our 5th spot

    Regardless of the way Owings pitched last night, he has consistently kept the team in the game, whereas in years past our 5th starter would lose the game by the 3rd inning. Keep in mind that Owings has pitched in many games where he has been opposed by the other team's #1 or #2, and look at the "Exited" stat on his game log. Besides the game in against the Phillies and last night's start, Micah has consistently kept the Reds in the game.
    Code:
    Rk     Gcar  Gtm  Date  Tm  Opp  Rslt     Inngs    Dec DR  IP H R ER BB SO HR HBP  ERA Exited
    1        52    8 Apr15 CIN  MIL  L3-9      GS-6 L(0-1) 99 5.0 5 4  4  2  2  2   0 7.20 tie
    2        53   13 Apr21 CIN  CHC  L2-7      GS-5 L(0-2)  5 4.2 5 5  2  4  3  1   0 5.59 d2
    3        54   18 Apr26 CIN  ATL  W8-2      GS-7 W(1-2)  4 7.0 6 1  1  3  6  1   0 3.78 a7
    4        55   23  May2 CIN  PIT  L6-8      GS-6 L(1-3)  5 5.2 9 5  5  2  0  0   1 4.84 d2
    5        56   28  May7 CIN  MIL  W6-5      GS-6 W(2-3)  4 6.0 7 5  4  1  4  0   0 5.08 a1
    6        57   33 May12 CIN  ARI  W3-1      GS-8 W(3-3)  4 7.0 4 1  1  2  4  0   1 4.33 a3
    7        59   40 May21 CIN  PHI L5-12      GS-3 L(3-5)  4 3.0 6 5  5  3  3  1   0 4.70 d5
    8        60   45 May26 CIN  HOU  W6-4      GS-5         4 5.0 6 3  3  4  3  0   0 4.78 tie
    9        61   49 May31 CIN  MIL  L2-5      GS-6 L(3-6)  4 5.2 8 5  5  3  5  1   0 5.10 d3
    10       62   54  Jun5 CIN  CHC  L1-2      GS-6 L(3-7)  4 6.0 5 2  2  3  6  1   0 4.90 d2
    11       63   59 Jun11 CIN  WSN  L2-3      GS-6         5 5.1 4 1  1  4  4  0   2 4.64 a2
    12       64   64 Jun17 CIN  ATL  W4-3      GS-6 W(4-7)  5 6.0 6 2  2  2  0  1   0 4.50 a2
    13       65   69 Jun23 CIN  TOR  L5-7      GS-6 L(4-8)  5 5.2 9 6  6  2  1  3   0 4.87 d6
    He has left with the lead 5 times, left with the team losing 6 times, and left tied twice, which isn't bad for a fifth starter who has faced several TOR starters.
    This will not change until the Reds win the World Series.......

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