Turn Off Ads?
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 24

Thread: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

  1. #1
    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    Amarillo, TX
    Posts
    13,837

    Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    At 40-40, theoretically, the team is in the mix. a 8-10 game winning streak, not impossible, could give them the division or WC lead.

    OR.....

    They make the move right now to really get better. We all know the areas of need.. SS, LF, 3B, CF.

    My plan doesn't preclude a trip to the playoffs, but it does make the team stronger for 2010.

    • DFA Willy Taveras

    He's an absolute drain on the offense, and he's more than replaceable with Dickerson for 2009, and Stubbs or Heisey in 2010. Eat his salary and move on.

    Improvement: 2009 and beyond.

    • DFA Arroyo

    He'll never clear waivers. Work out a trade and get what you can. Again, eat whatever salary you have to. Bailey slides to the #5 spot in the rotation.

    Improvement: 2009 possible, 2010 probable.

    • Option Jay Bruce to AAA

    He's overmatched right now, and needs some development and confidence. He's a kid that got the Dunn treatment without dominating the minor like Dunn did.

    • Trade for Josh Willingham and Brandon Wood


    Both players would instantly solidify the Reds lineup. Willingham in RF for the rest of this year and Wood at SS. Willingham slides over to LF next year or in Sept. when Bruce returns.

    Improvement at SS immediate, Improvement in the OF Immediate.

    That gives the Reds this lineup and rotation for 2009, in no particular order...

    ok, in my order.

    CF Dickerson
    3B EE
    1B Votto
    RF Willingham
    2B BP
    LF Gomes Nix
    C Hanigan/Hernandez
    SS Wood
    P


    Rotation

    Harang
    Cueto
    Owings
    Bailey
    Volquez when he returns, Maloney till then

    This requires bold action and assumes Maloney isn't a part of any deal for Wood or Willingham. If he is, Lehr is the guy. But t hat's a temporary move as Volquez should be ready by the trade deadline. This scenario doesn't make use of unrealistic trade proposals, just some common sense moves. Trading for Wood will require a talent for talent swap. So what are the Angel's area's of need? Willingham likely won't cost as much. Maybe one of Stubbs/Heisey and a pitcher. LeCure maybe?

    Thoughts?

    Add your REALISTIC moves. I'd like to see how far out there I am.
    Last edited by TRF; 07-06-2009 at 02:48 PM.
    Suck it up cupcake.

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #2
    Member OnBaseMachine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    34,844

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    Send Jay Bruce to Triple-A? Big no thanks. For all of his struggles, Jay Bruce has a .756 OPS despite having guys like Alex Gonzalez and Ramon Hernandez protecting him in the lineup. Not to mention he's one of the best defensive outfielders in baseball. Sending him to Triple-A would be one of the worst moves the Reds have made in a long time. Bruce posted a .974 OPS in AAA and .921 OPS in the minors. He has nothing left to in the minors.

    As for the other moves, I agree with ya on Taveras. I would DFA him immediately.

    I also like Brandon Wood as a trade target.
    I miss Adam Dunn.

  4. #3
    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    Amarillo, TX
    Posts
    13,837

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    OBM, it has nothing to do with protection. The power is there, but he's being fooled by EVERYBODY. He's getting worse as the season progresses.

    He needs something.
    Suck it up cupcake.

  5. #4
    High five! nate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Irvine, CA
    Posts
    6,976

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    I don't agree with sending Bruce down. Let him learn up here. He's not going to learn what he needs to learn in Louisville. JMO.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  6. #5
    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    Amarillo, TX
    Posts
    13,837

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    I don't agree with sending Bruce down. Let him learn up here. He's not going to learn what he needs to learn in Louisville. JMO.
    And if at the end of July he posts another sub .700 OPS?
    Suck it up cupcake.

  7. #6
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Cincinnati
    Posts
    10,296

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    I don't agree with sending Bruce down. Let him learn up here. He's not going to learn what he needs to learn in Louisville. JMO.
    I agree but if he continues to struggle he needs to go down and get his confidence up. He needs to see the ball better. A 10 game stint in the minors may be helpful for Bruce if the continues to struggle.

  8. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Posts
    10,076

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    No reason to DFA Arroyo. I agree he needs to improve, but I'd wait until he shows something, then try to slip him through (revocable) waivers- in August, he might get through. If he doesn't improve in the next 2-3 starts, I might consider DL'ing him.

    I also wouldn't send Bruce down. I might get him a RH-platoon partner (Dukes, D.Young, Willingham, etc.) to face lefties, but I think he needs to work this out in the bigs. I also like Wood as a trade target, as well as the guys I mentioned above.
    Go BLUE!!!

  9. #8
    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    Amarillo, TX
    Posts
    13,837

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    I've been giving D. Young a lot of thought, and the ONLY way I go after him is if I can option him immediately.
    Suck it up cupcake.

  10. #9
    High five! nate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Irvine, CA
    Posts
    6,976

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    Quote Originally Posted by TRF View Post
    And if at the end of July he posts another sub .700 OPS?
    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    I agree but if he continues to struggle he needs to go down and get his confidence up. He needs to see the ball better. A 10 game stint in the minors may be helpful for Bruce if the continues to struggle.
    I don't think he's suffering from a lack of confidence. I think he's suffering from a lack of big league pitch recognition. Namely, big league breaking balls. I think he just needs to work through it.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  11. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Posts
    10,076

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    Quote Originally Posted by TRF View Post
    I've been giving D. Young a lot of thought, and the ONLY way I go after him is if I can option him immediately.
    I think he would benefit by just hitting against lefties (and not playing everyday.) While his splits are only slightly better vs. lefties (.770 OPS vs. 712 vs. righties) I do think it might serve as a wake-up call when he only gets to play 2-3 days a week. That said, if/when he snaps out of it, you have your everyday RH-hitting LF with All-Star written all over him.

    The exact same thing could be said for Elijah Dukes. Both are reportedly available right now on the cheap. These are the exact type of crafty, low-risk, long-term high-upside moves that Fay was referring to. Make something happen Walt.
    Go BLUE!!!

  12. #11
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    35,918

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    Quote Originally Posted by TRF View Post
    OBM, it has nothing to do with protection. The power is there, but he's being fooled by EVERYBODY. He's getting worse as the season progresses.

    He needs something.
    If he is being fooled by everybody why isn't he striking out a ton? Why is he walking plenty? Why is he holding an isolated power number of .241?

    What is sending him to AAA going to do? Make his solid strikeout numbers get better? Make his strong walk rate get better? Make his power numbers get better? What will AAA do for him? What can be 'fixed' there that can't be here? Is Louisville where he can learn to hit it where they aren't?

  13. #12
    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    Amarillo, TX
    Posts
    13,837

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    If he is being fooled by everybody why isn't he striking out a ton? Why is he walking plenty? Why is he holding an isolated power number of .241?

    What is sending him to AAA going to do? Make his solid strikeout numbers get better? Make his strong walk rate get better? Make his power numbers get better? What will AAA do for him? What can be 'fixed' there that can't be here? Is Louisville where he can learn to hit it where they aren't?
    dunno... maybe fix that sub .300 OBP?
    Suck it up cupcake.

  14. #13
    I'm gettin paper Homer Bailey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Chicago, IL
    Posts
    4,689

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    Quote Originally Posted by TRF View Post
    dunno... maybe fix that sub .300 OBP?
    It's been discussed in great detail here.... http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75819

    .... that if he has a somewhat normal BABIP he'd be getting on base at around a .340 clip.

  15. #14
    No half measures, Walter RedEye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    8,447

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    Put me on the "Jay Bruce doesn't need to be sent down" bandwagon. He has nothing left to prove at AAA. He needs to learn in the majors. If he had a .250/.340/.500 line right now, I don't think anyone would be concerned--and one of the main reasons he doesn't have that line is pure, dumb luck.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  16. #15
    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    Amarillo, TX
    Posts
    13,837

    Re: Bold Future or Playoff Present?

    I'm not a Bruce hater. I think he's the single most important position player the Reds have.

    That stated, I don't completely buy into BABIP as luck only. You don't hover around .200 for two straight months because of luck. And he doesn't have Dunn's BB ability to offset it.
    Suck it up cupcake.


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25