Heyman says Rolen to the Reds

[Puffy]

Stewart walked 8 batters in 10 innings in AAA. I saw him in AAA and he nibbled. Perhaps good hitters lay off the slider/ heavy fastball and he can't throw strikes. (Ryan Wagner says hello.) Roenicke's walked four in 13 major league innings.

I saw both of them in AAA and both are high pitch count relievers who don't mind 3-ball counts. They both nibble.

Come on Scrap - don't you know that Zach Stewart is going to win a Cy Young??

[Ltlabner]

People think he has been doing nothing, but if he thought like RZ, talk about a hamstrung organization afraid to make a move because "gee, that prospect might be a Cy Young award winner some day."

There's only a couple of folks that are really upset about trading those two specific guys. Most of us understand you gotta give to get. Right now they are lotto tickets and I have no issue with trading them. I also agree we get way too in love with our prospects around here.

It's what we got in return that I don't like.

(which is ironic because I missed-the-boat on "the trade" where we also didn't get the right return for our resources)

[westofyou]

I think there are plenty more Zach Stewart's and Josh Roenicke's........ if he thought like RZ, talk about a hamstrung organization afraid to make a move because "gee, that prospect might be a Cy Young award winner some day."

I used to think they'd all be stars, now I also think they all perhaps have an equal chance to sell insurance too.

[mth123]

I think there are plenty more Zach Stewart's and Josh Roenicke's. Our prospects are adequately hyped right now, so I'm sure some more deals can be hammered home including some of our "maybe's" talent for some major leaguers that can produce now. If not, the draft is next June to get some more. Just glad to see Walt finally crap and get off the pot on something.

I don't think the Reds have any other pitching prospects that would rate as highly at Stewart. Roenicke may be replaceable, but he's probably a reliever who could pitch in high leverage situations on a team that has had a recent history of too many soft tossers in the pen. They may be guys to trade, but it should have been in a package that aimed a lot higher. Stick 'em with Stubbs, Alonso and Valaika and go after an ace. Rolen's a bit player these days. He's expensive, probably too short term to matter in the bigger scheme of righting this ship and most importantly a high liklihood of being sidelined while he siphons needed funds from the budget.

This was a case of overpaying due to man love.

[nate]

Stewart walked 8 batters in 10 innings in AAA. I saw him in AAA and he nibbled. Perhaps good hitters lay off the slider/ heavy fastball and he can't throw strikes. (Ryan Wagner says hello.) Roenicke's walked four in 13 major league innings.

I saw both of them in AAA and both are high pitch count relievers who don't mind 3-ball counts. They both nibble.

I think if Walt is going off a tiny slice of an already small sample size, he should transition from the front office into doing JTM commercials.

[OnBaseMachine]

I think if Walt is going off a tiny slice of an already small sample size, he should transition from the front office into doing JTM commercials.

Yep. If Walt is judging pitchers on 10 innings then he's even worse than I thought.

[OnBaseMachine]

The Jays believe the arms they received from the Reds for Rolen - Josh Roenicke and Zach Stewart - will provide depth. Stewart, they think, can be a No. 3 starter. And third baseman Edwin Encarnacion will be going into a contract year next season. He will be motivated.

But mostly, the Blue Jays netted $6-million in swapping Rolen for Encarnacion's salary. So nothing that happened yesterday will remove the doubts lingering over this team - that they have just slightly interested ownership and no direction, bouncing from crisis to crisis while awaiting a 2010 payroll that will likely be right in the middle of the major-league scale.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sport...rticle1238761/

[nate]

Further, even if Walt didn't think the prospects were "all that," the Blue Jays certainly did.

[nate]

Did anyone catch these two Walt quotes from Jhno Fya?

"Scott Rolen makes up better for this year and next."

Jocketty also said he hopes to keep Rolen beyond 2010.

[WMR]

Following in the rich tradition of his predecessors, I could definitely see Jocketty extending Rolen for another 2-3 years before he pawns this job off on the next sap.

[VR]

Yep. If Walt is judging pitchers on 10 innings then he's even worse than I thought.

How about 100 innings?

[jojo]

Trade minor league bullpen arms for above average major league position players all day, every day, twice on Sunday, and three times on the important holidays.

[Caveat Emperor]

Come on Scrap - don't you know that Zach Stewart is going to win a Cy Young??

The amusing part of all this is that maybe a dozen people on the board have actually seen Stewart pitch.

There are about 50 pitching prospects I wish the Reds had traded sooner over the years. Additionally, there are about 50 pitching prospects (many of whom were "top 10" guys themselves) that were acquired by the Reds in deals like this one who never amounted to squat (see: Ramirez, Elizardo / Chick, Travis / Valentine, Joe / Germano, Justin etc.).

I've watched too much baseball to put total faith in a 20-something in the minors. Some are gonna be good, some are gonna be bad -- the only mistake you can make is selling 'em all or hording 'em all and hoping for the best.

Maybe the Reds screwed the pooch on this, but look at anyone who tells you the answer to that question with certainty or conviction with a health dose of skepticsm.

[OnBaseMachine]

How about 100 innings?

Stewart has a 2.57 BB/9 in 91.2 innings this season. For his career his minor league walk rate is 2.90 BB/9, which is very solid.

[reds44]

The odds that Zack Stewart end up being a produtive major league player aren't very high. They never are for pitching prospects.

The trade still sucks.