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    4 3.70%
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    24 22.22%
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    28 25.93%
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    27 25.00%
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    25 23.15%
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Thread: How did Walt do?

  1. #76
    Member redsfandan's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    No, I don't think that's silly in any way, shape or form. It's a legit question to ask and have a discussion about. Yes, Rolen is an excellent player but he is older and a decline would be natural. Throw in his injury history and we _could_ have an OPS of .800, but in how many games? 120? 100?
    It's not a silly proposition.



    Again, I say it's a reasonable concern.
    And you're pointing towards how many games he plays as the bigger concern. Just like I did.
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

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  3. #77
    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfandan View Post
    Of course you could also look at players like Chipper Jones and Mike Lowell who are still productive and are both older than Rolen.
    But haven't they both spent quite a bit of time on the DL?
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  4. #78
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfandan View Post
    Of course you could also look at players like Chipper Jones and Mike Lowell who are still productive and are both older than Rolen.
    you argued that you can't see "any reason" that Rolen can't OPS .800 next year.

    but now you do, correct? older players sometimes fall right off a cliff-- following up a good season at 34 with several poor seasons thereafter. age'll do that. and even if they OPS .800, it doesn't much help if they can't get on the field, and older players have more injuries as Larkin/Jr surely showed. so there are a couple of reasons right there.


    personally, I hope that Rolen plays every day and wins the 2010 NL MVP. but I do see that we're not getting a 27 year old player. matter of fact, we gave one up

  5. #79
    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfandan View Post
    And you're pointing towards how many games he plays as the bigger concern. Just like I did.
    So this one reason why he perhaps wouldn't OPS .800. Or, if he does, it could be in less than a full season.

    Like I said, these concerns aren't silly.

    I like having him on the team and am concerned about these very things.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  6. #80
    Member redsfandan's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by princeton View Post
    you argued that you can't see "any reason" that Rolen can't OPS .800 next year.

    but now you do, correct? older players sometimes fall right off a cliff-- following up a good season at 34 with several poor seasons thereafter. age'll do that. and even if they OPS .800, it doesn't much help if they can't get on the field, and older players have more injuries as Larkin/Jr surely showed. so there are a couple of reasons right there.


    personally, I hope that Rolen plays every day and wins the 2010 NL MVP. but I do see that we're not getting a 27 year old player. matter of fact, we gave one up
    Not really. I don't think anyone, including me, is expecting Rolen to have a mvp type season. Similar offense to EE with MUCH better defense. That's all. Like I've said, repeatedly, how much he plays is the MUCH bigger concern.
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

  7. #81
    Designated Threadkiller LincolnparkRed's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Well Buster Olney chimed in to say Walt confused him as well

    The Reds have a $74 million payroll this season, and if they stay at that level next year, Scott Rolen's $11 million salary will account for about 15 percent of that total. That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever given his age, injury history and decline in power. Rolen, who will turn 35 years old in April, mashed 34 homers in 2004 but has hit 54 homers in the four-plus seasons since.
    Climbing down from the bridge, but keeping the torch lit until Dusty's fate is settled

  8. #82
    Let's ride BRM's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Bob Miller said in his most recent chat that the Reds are not on the hook for his entire 2010 salary.

    EDIT: I may have misread that. His answer doesn't specifically say next year.

    ethanator9:
    11:29 am How are the Reds going to have money to pay for Rolen next year?

    bob_miller:
    11:31 am The reports on the amount owed Rolen floating around is incorrect. While I'm not at liberty to say what the amount is, we are not responsible for some of it.
    Last edited by BRM; 08-03-2009 at 12:51 PM.

  9. #83
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfandan View Post
    How was that a decent move? If we had actually saved some money it would be different but he wasn't getting that much money anyway.
    They gave away a couple months of Hairston for minor league talent that they don't have to pay a bonus.
    "Even a bad day at the ballpark beats the snot out of most other good days. I'll take my scorecard and pencil and beer and hot dog and rage at the dips and cheer at the highs, but I'm not ever going to stop loving this game and this team and nobody will ever take that away from me." Roy Tucker October 2010

  10. #84
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by BRM View Post
    Bob Miller said in his most recent chat that the Reds are not on the hook for his entire 2010 salary.

    EDIT: I may have misread that. His answer doesn't specifically say next year.
    The question says next year.

    Interesting if the $$$ estimate is incorrect.

  11. #85
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfandan View Post
    edabbs44 showed that his skills aren't declining. But you keep saying they are. How about proving your point? I don't see any reason why he can't be an .800+ OPS player next season. His health is a much bigger concern.
    His production isn't declining (as shown by his hot 2009) but that doesn't mean his raw skills aren't.

    People generally slow down, lose a step, suffer more injuries and take longer to recover as they get older. I'm not sure why anybody would want to argue that point.
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate

  12. #86
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    I assume that the Reds staff disagrees on the "declining skills" part of the discussion.
    They also thought they could "fix" Taveras.
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate

  13. #87
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Miller: "I know that it seems like a totally idiotic trade but trust me, it's not. I just can't tell you why though."
    2015, baby!

  14. #88
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    That is obvious, however the argument is that his stats are in decline.
    No, I said skills. Big difference.

    And as Nate correctly pointed out, the big question is at what rate do the decline and how far do they drop during the next 1.5 years. Maybe they don't drop at all, maybe his injury history goes away and maybe we'll all look back and say "Edwin who?".

    But those are big maybes, and it's not out of bounds to suggest they exist.
    Last edited by Ltlabner; 08-03-2009 at 01:05 PM.
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate

  15. #89
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ltlabner View Post
    They also thought they could "fix" Taveras.
    I think everyone is entitled to a screwup every so often. Especially one that is fairly cheap.

  16. #90
    Let's ride BRM's Avatar
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    Re: How did Walt do?

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    The question says next year.

    Interesting if the $$$ estimate is incorrect.
    Yeah, the question says next year but Miller's answer was a little vague.


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