Stewart's not pitching for any MLB team in 2010 (and making it out alive).Originally Posted by BuckeyeRedleg
Neither kid sent up north helps with the true cancer on this team: the rotation.
Obviously, if nothing's done about it, none of what we're talking about now matters a bit. But that's a separate matter.
“And when finally they sense that some position cannot be sustained, they do not re-examine their ideas. Instead, they simply change the subject.” Jamie Galbraith
Seems like mostly positive reviews on the Blue Jay message board:
I love this trade. EE could very well be better then Rolen NEXT year. He might have been last season, defense considered. I could see Rolen limping his way through 100 games next season and his average dropping to his career norm and contuing not to hit for power.
But no, this trade wasn't even straight up. We got two very capable arms, and Stewart seems to have some potential.
On top of it all, we seemingly save about 5 million or so off next year's payroll. I think we fleeced the Reds in this one.Such an eye opener. Rolen's great year has really made me forgotten what he's really like. It's was a GOOD trade by J.P. today.Some negative comments also in the mix:"I think we fleeced the Reds in this one."
Agree with this statement totally. I didn't think Ricciardi had it in him. Rolen's value, during his tenure with the Jays, was at an all time high and they cash it in for 2 great young arms...
I don't think this is a good day for Jays fans. Rolen is probably the best defensive 3B in the teams history. He is a clutch hitter. EE has a very poor defensive track record. I think Rolen is one of the Jays leaders. He plays the game with heart. He is an excellent baserunner. Who will be our cleanup hitter now? I am glad I got to see him play in person several times this year. Our defense will be much weaker from now on. Do we really need 2 more young pitchers? Perhaps our next GM will trade some of your pitchers for some bats. We need more offense for 2010.Mostly positive views on the other end. Looks like Edwin is already penciled in at DH while Bautista moves back to 3rd base.Again this deal is great for them... as Juan francisco 3b , zack cozart, yonder alsono would have been a better deal for us then bullpen arms. As they fill to our needs more then pitching. this deal blows chunks!!!
If you have a losing record at Reds games, please stop going.
The problem is though that we never make the right moves at the right time. When we where in the race we sat on our hands even as we all foresaw the bottom falling out claiming to be hamstrung by the economy. Now we are no longer in the race and our great pitching staff is not looking so, including our big contract guys which we were not able to unload. What do we do, take on salary in a 3b who is nearly 35. How is that a good thing? We should be dumping salary and acquiring prospects (as they have become gold in this economy) and gearing up for the offseason continuing with the youth movements. This is a Yankee move not a out of contention low budget reds move.
As for EE pumping his fists, I would also if I got to leave this sorry franchise.
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Strikeouts are boring - besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls. More democratic. ~Bull Durham
Yeah, that bothered me too. EE can't wait to get out of Cincy.
Regardless of the prevailing opinion at RedsZone regarding veteran leadership, I think that Dusty and Walt buy in completely. I think they see that as a problem on this team.
Walt is big on defense, and can't seem to suffer EE's frequent mental errors and seeming lack of focus.
This team is in a death spiral. All the deficiencies have been exposed.
Rolen is a name the casual fan knows, and respects. He plays the Cincinnati Way.
As dismal as the past few weeks has been, we'll at least get to watch one of the premier thirdbasemen in baseball history. Yeah, he's old, and getting older.
I loved watching Buddy Bell when he was here. He was also past his prime, but one of the smoothest fielders I've ever seen.
I guess I'm not disappointed because I expected absolutely nothing.
We'll go down in history as the first society that wouldn't save itself because it wasn't cost effective ~ Kurt Vonnegut
I think you are right Stormy....but we stil had the benefit of some optimism for EE, that this would be the year he turns the corner.
The Reds gave EE every chance to be a major league ballplayer, it just didn't work out. The finally cut bait....and I for one, am relieved he's finally been moved....he's a good poster boy for the Reds penchant of hanging on to players too long.
Baseball is like church. Many attend, few understand
That's what wears on me. As a fan I just want a front office with a plan and a purpose - to at least give a chance to contend and the savvy to know how that can best be done.
I know that any chance to contend is not that great for a team like the Reds anymore - it's not easy - I understand. That's why it makes me so mad when I see a reactionary panic move like Jocketty did today. At the least he got fleeced out of a pitcher that could have value for the major league club or in another deal. I truly believe that most good GMs would not have made the deal or at least could have done it without a price as high as Stewart.
Hey, I was in a rush to post because the game was getting ready to start and I didn't want to be "that guy" at the ballpark with his head glued to his blackberry!
The Reds traded for a bona-fide Major Leaguer that I know I will enjoy watching in the field and at the bat. It almost feels like they are trying.
I don't particularly care for the package they sent to get him or the stage of his career that he is in, but beggars can't be choosers.
GL
As someone who has actually seen Zach Stewart pitch in person, you can't help but cringe at seeing him included in this type of deal. For those of you that question his talent, he is at least a taller healthy Scott Williamson right now. And yet he has room for growth.
My initial reaction was a stream of obscenity.
EE and Roenicke + Chaff for Rolen and Cash OK
EE, Roenicke, and Stewart for Rolen and Cash, they had better sign Aroldis Chapman.
Hugs, smiling, and interactive Twitter accounts, don't mean winning baseball. Until this community understands that we are cursed to relive the madness.
I'm just coming back into the thread so I hope I'm not repeating anything, but I wonder how BPhil is going to like having "leadership" on the team? Not that I much care, but since he considers himself the defacto-leader I wonder if it will lead to friction.
Sorry, Scott Rolen got his money.
Reading this thread you would think that Rolen will need a wheelchair to get from the dugout to third base.
In reality, since being full time in 1997, Rolen has only played less than 100 games in one season- 2005. He played 142 games in 2006, 112 in 2007, 115 in 2008, and will probably play in about 130 games in 2009. And that is the worst stretch in his career.
He is a 6 time All Star, 7 time Gold Glove, and as for his "declining power" he actually has better power numbers this year than 2007 and 2008.
By the way, Buddy Bell was 33 when the Reds got him and he had 3 1/2 pretty decent years here.
I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrous.- Stan Helsing
About 90% of the criticism on this board amounts to faulting Walt for being unable to walk on water or doing its baseball equivalent: trading 4 and 5 starters with ridiculous contracts like Harang and Arroyo for top quality prospects at exactly the spots we need and getting the other teams to take on all their salaries in addition. If he hasn't done this, the claim is he's not proactive. The Rolen trade is a real deal, the kind that actually gets made, where both sides take calculated risks for returns they think make sense for them. We get one of the top 20 third basemen who's ever played; they get a replacement they need to sell to their fans and two decent prospects. Seems an even, realistic deal to me. I see no evidence in it that Walt's not proactive or that there is no plan or anything to support any of the other high-level inferences here.
Then they should have kept Dunn.
It wouldn't be impossible at all to trade for him in the offseason.
“And when finally they sense that some position cannot be sustained, they do not re-examine their ideas. Instead, they simply change the subject.” Jamie Galbraith
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