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Thread: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

  1. #61
    Member Spring~Fields's Avatar
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    I would like Brandon better if he was not a cleanup batter breaking up the left handed batters, oh, wait, Rolen bats right handed.

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  3. #62
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    Quote Originally Posted by Highlifeman21 View Post
    Adam Dunn refusing to play 1B and Barry Larkin refusing to bat leadoff are 2 of the biggest Reds urban legends ever....
    I can't really speak on Larkin's situation, but Dunn, while maybe not outright refusing, definitely made it a point to say he did not want to move there. I have no problem with the honesty, but he sure made it tough on the Reds to consider such a move if they were going to do so.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  4. #63
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    Putting Phillips at SS makes perfect sense... just like it made perfect sense 3 years or so ago...

    which is why the Reds didn't do it then and likely won't do it now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
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  5. #64
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    Quote Originally Posted by Highlifeman21 View Post
    I don't even know where to start with this, but I'll do my best....

    1. Gonzo was out for a full season. That was the time to try out Phillips @ SS, but it just so happens that Phillips won himself a Gold Glove @ 2B while Gonzo was out. Phillips is ridiculously good defensively, and he's one of the only exciting reasons to watch the Reds anymore. Tune in, see what great play Brandon might make tonight! Honestly, I hope he wins multiple Gold Gloves, b/c then it draws some kind of attention to the Reds.

    2. Love Phillips' D, hate his game at the plate. Until Phillips realizes that walks are good too, embrace them, I'll continue to hate his offensive game. I think he has plenty of potential, but he just seems really selfish at the plate, IMO. While I want to believe that he's trying to put the ball in play to help the club, I'm more convinced he wants to put the ball in play to help his personal numbers.

    3. I'm not arguing 2 things at all. When Phillips came up thru the Expos and Indians systems, he was a SS. He gets traded to the Reds, and now he's essentially asked to play a different position, 2B. My frustration with the Reds is that in 2006, Phillips was our best SS option, yet we tried him out as a 2B experiment, and that experiment's worked extremely well. However, why did we try him as a 2B and not a SS?

    4. While Gonzo had a good year defensively @ SS in 2007 (and I definitely remember him doing so), why did we go after Gonzo in the first place? Why didn't we move Phillips back to SS? We could have plugged in any number of guys to play 2B, but instead, we chose to commit a sizeable amount of money to a SS on the wrong side of 30.

    5. Brandon Phillips is a very selfish ballplayer, make no mistake about it.
    You almost seem personal about your hatred for Brandon. Weird, weird, weird. I'm not sure how you haven't broken the rules yet on here.
    This is the time. The real Reds organization is back.

  6. #65
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    Quote Originally Posted by Cedric View Post
    You almost seem personal about your hatred for Brandon. Weird, weird, weird. I'm not sure how you haven't broken the rules yet on here.
    So loving his defense but not being a fan of his approach at the plate constitutes "personal hatred"?
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate

  7. #66
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    I don't even know where to start with this, but I'll do my best....
    Next time start with the facts.

    2. Love Phillips' D, hate his game at the plate. Until Phillips realizes that walks are good too, embrace them, I'll continue to hate his offensive game. I think he has plenty of potential, but he just seems really selfish at the plate, IMO. While I want to believe that he's trying to put the ball in play to help the club, I'm more convinced he wants to put the ball in play to help his personal numbers.
    Right. OBP is all that matters. Failure to have a high OBP = selfishness. Got it.

    3. I'm not arguing 2 things at all. When Phillips came up thru the Expos and Indians systems, he was a SS. He gets traded to the Reds, and now he's essentially asked to play a different position, 2B. My frustration with the Reds is that in 2006, Phillips was our best SS option, yet we tried him out as a 2B experiment, and that experiment's worked extremely well. However, why did we try him as a 2B and not a SS?
    Phillips played about 1,080 innings in the majors over four years before joining the Reds. He played exactly three of those at shortstop. The other 1,077 or so were at second base. If the Reds had asked him to play shortstop, they would have been asking him to play a different position. Throw in the fact that Felipe Lopez had put up a 118 OPS+ at shortstop the previous season, and I don't think the Reds' actions were at all unreasonable.

    4. While Gonzo had a good year defensively @ SS in 2007 (and I definitely remember him doing so), why did we go after Gonzo in the first place? Why didn't we move Phillips back to SS? We could have plugged in any number of guys to play 2B, but instead, we chose to commit a sizeable amount of money to a SS on the wrong side of 30.
    Maybe Phillips could have handled it. Maybe. But he was then five years removed from playing shortstop. Again, I don't think signing a guy like Gonzalez was unreasonable considering the circumstances. And if he had put together three years comparable to 2007, it would have been a good signing. He didn't. Doesn't make the Reds idiots for not moving Phillips to SS back then.

    5. Brandon Phillips is a very selfish ballplayer, make no mistake about it.
    Well, that clears that up.
    Last edited by osuceltic; 08-06-2009 at 05:52 PM. Reason: spelling

  8. #67
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    Quote Originally Posted by Cedric View Post
    You almost seem personal about your hatred for Brandon. Weird, weird, weird. I'm not sure how you haven't broken the rules yet on here.
    What rules?

    Is not liking a player grounds for RZ banishment?

    Am I missing something?


    As for Brandon playing SS, I believe that ship has sailed.

    As for Brandons OB%, it's not Joe Morgan's OB% that's for sure.

    That said he's got a lot of other tools in his kit to help a team. Until he can't field, hit for power or steal the not getting on base tool isn't that important, and with players like Brandon it's good to not overpay for future performance, because once thoses other tools wane his warts will seem larger to the masses than currently.

    And that's when you'll start to see real hatred for him... maybe we can get rule in place before that happens.

  9. #68
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    What rules?

    Is not liking a player grounds for RZ banishment?

    Am I missing something?
    If it is, then I might as well check out now, because I have made it no secret that I loathe Matt Holliday with the intensity of a thousand suns.
    Eric Stratton, Rush Chairman. Damn glad to meet ya.

  10. #69
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    I think an experiment makes sense. But I don't think Phillips would be a very good SS. His actions are somewhat long for a middle infielder, and he's faster than he is quick. His feet aren't great -- you rarely see him plant and fire, going to his right he generally throws while still moving away from first. That won't work so well at SS because he can't get real zip on the throws. To his left, he often dives and throws from his knees. Or, if he manages to stay on his feet, he's a bit awkward in getting oriented for his throw. He just doesn't have the real quick feet -- he's fast, very athletic and very accurate with his throws (though his arm isn't nearly as tested at 2B as it would be at SS), but I have a feeling the proximity of 2B to 1B makes his skills play up nicely.

    I'm a big Phillips fan, and I think he's underappreciated on this board. But while I love the offensive upside of a Phillips SS/Frazier 2B keystone, I have real doubts about how well it would anchor the defense.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

  11. #70
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    I thought this should have been done years ago. Easier to find a 2B then SS it seems and he'd be a good one. At this point I don't care. Depends on who they can find out there. But they need a impact bat at which ever position he doesn't play. Votto probably needs to go to LF now since we have a stud hitter in the minors - I"m just saying. This team can use a different look.
    And This One Belongs to the REDS!!!

  12. #71
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    Quote Originally Posted by lollipopcurve View Post
    I think an experiment makes sense. But I don't think Phillips would be a very good SS. His actions are somewhat long for a middle infielder, and he's faster than he is quick. His feet aren't great -- you rarely see him plant and fire, going to his right he generally throws while still moving away from first. That won't work so well at SS because he can't get real zip on the throws. To his left, he often dives and throws from his knees. Or, if he manages to stay on his feet, he's a bit awkward in getting oriented for his throw. He just doesn't have the real quick feet -- he's fast, very athletic and very accurate with his throws (though his arm isn't nearly as tested at 2B as it would be at SS), but I have a feeling the proximity of 2B to 1B makes his skills play up nicely.

    I'm a big Phillips fan, and I think he's underappreciated on this board. But while I love the offensive upside of a Phillips SS/Frazier 2B keystone, I have real doubts about how well it would anchor the defense.
    Good points. I've always been of the opinion that 2B is Phillips' optimum position and, all things being equal, that's where he should play.

    Yet the reason why I'd be open to trying him at SS for the rest of this season (in order to make a decision on whether he should be the SS in 2010) is that all things are not equal. The Reds have a laundry list of needs and the club has failed to find an adequate SS during Phillips' first four seasons with the club. He's only got two guaranteed seasons left on his contract and the Reds seem to be waiting for Godot at that position. Plus, Rolen's the best left side cover he's ever going to get.

    Short contract window, no viable in-house secondary option, multiple needs elsewhere and a superior 3B partner - it would seem the conditions are right to make the move. Also, the Reds need a lot more offense and it's easier to add that at 2B.
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  13. #72
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Good points. I've always been of the opinion that 2B is Phillips' optimum position and, all things being equal, that's where he should play.

    Yet the reason why I'd be open to trying him at SS for the rest of this season (in order to make a decision on whether he should be the SS in 2010) is that all things are not equal. The Reds have a laundry list of needs and the club has failed to find an adequate SS during Phillips' first four seasons with the club. He's only got two guaranteed seasons left on his contract and the Reds seem to be waiting for Godot at that position. Plus, Rolen's the best left side cover he's ever going to get.

    Short contract window, no viable in-house secondary option, multiple needs elsewhere and a superior 3B partner - it would seem the conditions are right to make the move. Also, the Reds need a lot more offense and it's easier to add that at 2B.

    The thing is, he can always move back to 2nd just like Ripkin moved from 3rd to SS back to 3rd.
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  14. #73
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    The thing is, he can always move back to 2nd just like Ripkin moved from 3rd to SS back to 3rd.
    Exactly. This might only be a temporary solution for the time he has remaining with the Reds. The key would be to try it now so the team can make a decision on whether it's filling a SS or 2B hole during the offseason.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

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  15. #74
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    The key would be to try it now so the team can make a decision on whether it's filling a SS or 2B hole during the offseason.
    Which is exactly why this inept organization won't do it now. Same thing for Balentien playing everyday.
    Go BLUE!!!

  16. #75
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    Re: Per John Fays Twitter _Brandon would play SS if the reds want him too

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Which is exactly why this inept organization won't do it now. Same thing for Balentien playing everyday.
    It wouldn't surprise me if they just try it out for a week or two at the end of the season. It won't be nearly enough time but they'll be able to say they gave it a shot.


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