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Thread: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

  1. #16
    Charlie Brown All-Star IslandRed's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    A rookie wage scale might fall under the "be careful what you wish for" category.

    The harsh reality of the NFL is that it chews up guys and spits them out. No one gets paid for what they've done, only what they're expected to do in the future. And with non-guaranteed contracts, the gravy train is over as soon as the team doesn't feel like paying it any more, for whatever reason. That's why every veteran gets as much money up front as he can.

    So, if they're not going to pay top rookies because they're unproven and they're also not going to pay them like they're expected to be stars, even though their draft position suggests that's what they believe, everyone knows what's coming after that: holdouts. These guys aren't going to wait three or four years to get paid, the nature of the sport being what it is. So they're going to demand new contracts the instant they become "proven." Or else they'll simply refuse to sign long-term contracts in the first place.

    I also think it's a solution in search of a real problem; only the top half of the first round is making excessive money and most teams aren't pressed against the cap anyway, which suggests the savings will be pocketed by ownership more than redistributed to veteran players.
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  3. #17
    Kmac5 KoryMac5's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    Looks like the Raiders signing of Bey is affecting the Bengals negotiations with Smith as well:

    As evidence begins to emerge regarding the specific numbers relating to the negotiation between the Bengals and tackle Andre Smith, the sixth overall pick in the draft, a source with knowledge of the situation tells us that the holdout could last into the regular season.

    Joe Reedy of the Cincinnati Enquirer reports that the Bengals have offered Smith a contract worth $33 million, $5.25 million less than the base value of the contract given to Raiders receiver Darrius Heyward-Bey, the seventh pick in the 2009 draft.

    Per Reedy, Smith's camp is looking for something slightly greater than Heyward-Bey's deal.

    In this instance, waiting to work out a deal with Smith has hurt the Bengals. If they'd moved before Heyward-Bey had signed, the Bengals likely could have gotten Smith for a reasonable increase over the base value of the contract given to last year's sixth overall pick, which a league source tells us was $32.5 million, not $40 million.

    Instead, the Bengals are now faced with the floor created by the Heyward-Bey contract, and Smith most likely won't be accepting a penny less.

    Really, why should he? For the same reason that receiver Michael Crabtree should respect the slotting system, so should the Bengals.
    Could be a very long holdout as the Bengals usually don't blink in contract negotiations when they are dug in like this.
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  4. #18
    GR8NESS WMR's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    Might as well just go ahead and cut off Carson's elbow and knee, they'll be useless by week six anyway.

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  5. #19
    GR8NESS WMR's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    You know... it does make perfect sense in a way that this would happen. As well as the Bengals did in their drafting, it was automatically fated that they would screw things up somehow in the negotiation stage. It's the way Mike Brown does business.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
    "Cheering for Kentucky is like watching Star Wars and hoping Darth Vader chokes an ewok"


  6. #20
    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    Quote Originally Posted by WMR View Post
    Might as well just go ahead and cut off Carson's elbow and knee, they'll be useless by week six anyway.

    Bengals and Reds. A Confederacy of Dunces.
    Yep.
    Al Davis is way past his prime, but at least he will do anything he thinks will help the Raiders win. "Just win baby" wasn't just a slogan for Al Davis; it was all he wanted--he just doesn't know how to get it done anymore. In contrast, winning football games has never been the primary focus of the Bengals--it apparently has been make money.
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  7. #21
    Member Highlifeman21's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    Quote Originally Posted by GIDP View Post
    I would love to see someone actually do this.
    I'm with you on that one.

    This potentially opens a pandora's box for the NFL if Crabtree sits out b/c the 7th pick in the draft, who just so happens to play WR, will possibly sit out an entire year b/c he'll make less money as the 10th pick.

    What's next, some kinda Olineman or Dlineman getting drafted in the end of the 1st Round demanding to get paid as much or more than guys playing the same position that maybe got drafted just out of the top 10, or in the middle of the 1st?

    Just for pure amusement, I wanna see him sit out.

  8. #22
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    I understand that they should have been more pro-active in signing him first.....So they are supposed to overpay beacuse of the Raiders decided to get stupid with their numbers?

  9. #23
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    The problem is the FO's never have a big enough pair to call a bluff. An fat OT with potential attitude issues would love to skip two a days.

    Make a more than fair offer and then reduce it by a set amount each day.
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  10. #24
    Mr.Redlegs is my homeboy Eric_the_Red's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    Quote Originally Posted by flyer85 View Post
    The problem is the FO's never have a big enough pair to call a bluff. An fat OT with potential attitude issues would love to skip two a days.

    Make a more than fair offer and then reduce it by a set amount each day.
    Not exactly the same, but I think the Bengals did a good job in not succumbing to the trade demands of Ochocinco.

  11. #25
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric_the_Red View Post
    Not exactly the same, but I think the Bengals did a good job in not succumbing to the trade demands of Ochocinco.
    If Smith wants to sit out, get fatter and blow millions in the process the Bangals need to tell him to have at it. These negotiations are not about the player, they are about the agent. The agent doesn't want to "look bad" by having their player agree to a lesser contract than a later pick. For the agent it is about the ability to market themselves to the next player rather than doing what is in the best interest of their current player.
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  12. #26
    Kmac5 KoryMac5's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    Looks like Crabtree's agent Eugene Parker has told the cousin to zip his lip and stop running his mouth to the press. This comes from Mike Fisher who covers Dallas Area Sports:

    I have what you might call “second-hand knowledge’’ of the Michael Crabtree matter. Second-hand in the sense that I was sitting right there as my man Nate Newton was engaged in phone conversations with David Wells, the Dallas-based bodyguard/bail bondsman who happens to be the cousin and advisor of Crabtree, the spectacular Texas Tech receiver engaged in a rookie-contract dispute with the 49ers.

    And here’s what I know: It’s not really Crabtree who is telling the 49ers he might sit out the entire year and re-enter the NFL Draft next season if San Francisco doesn’t meet his demands. Nor is it veteran agent Eugene Parker who is telling the 49ers such an incendiary thing.

    No, it’s David Wells. And David isn’t even saying it to the 49ers! He’s just saying it to reporters.

    That’s creating the impression that Crabtree is some sort of a “diva’’ when in fact, all we’ve got here is a cousin who thinks Michael is “the best player in the whole draft’’ – the sort of thing an agent wouldn’t say but the sort of thing a relative would say.

    On Friday, David Wells popped off one more time, to ESPN’s Joe Schad. And then after that, I’m told, Team Crabtree convened and – led by Eugene Parker, as it should be – ordered David Wells to quit talking to reporters.

    There’s a reason lawyers don’t represent themselves in court. And there’s a reason smart lawyers don’t let their cousins who are bodyguard/bail bondsmen represent them in court, either.
    I would have to imagine Crabtree will cut ties with Wells soon.
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  13. #27
    Mr.Redlegs is my homeboy Eric_the_Red's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.


  14. #28
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    Quote Originally Posted by flyer85 View Post
    If Smith wants to sit out, get fatter and blow millions in the process the Bangals need to tell him to have at it. These negotiations are not about the player, they are about the agent. The agent doesn't want to "look bad" by having their player agree to a lesser contract than a later pick. For the agent it is about the ability to market themselves to the next player rather than doing what is in the best interest of their current player.
    That is probably my biggest problem with camp holdouts. Its never about the player and getting a fair contract. It is about the agent's ability to get $1 than expected. Its about being able to go to prospective clients and say "I got this guy this, when he only expected to get this."

  15. #29
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    That is probably my biggest problem with camp holdouts. Its never about the player and getting a fair contract. It is about the agent's ability to get $1 than expected. Its about being able to go to prospective clients and say "I got this guy this, when he only expected to get this."
    and most players aren't smart enough to realize that the agent is doing what he perceives to be in HIS best interest, not necessarily the players best interest (sometimes they may be the same but it doesn't have to be).

    The best example ever is the Harrington/Tanzer/Rockies episode.
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  16. #30
    Kmac5 KoryMac5's Avatar
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    Re: Crabtree to hold out, blame the Raiders.

    Eugene Parker continues to distance himself from Crabtree. This holdout might get nasty really quick:

    No contact between Niners, Crabtree
    Posted by Mike Florio on August 25, 2009 6:26 PM ET
    As the contract impasse between the San Francisco 49ers and the tenth overall pick in the 2009 draft approaches September 1, a league source tells us that there has been "no contact" between the Niners and Eugene Parker, the agent for receiver Michael Crabtree.

    It's widely believed that Crabtree wants to secure more money in the tenth slot than receiver Darrius Heyward-Bey finagled from the Raiders as the seventh overall pick.

    It's also widely believed that the 49ers won't pay Crabtree a dime more than the Packers gave to defensive lineman B.J. Raji at the ninth overall slot.

    Meanwhile, we're hearing that Parker is dealing with the Crabtree conundrum on the recruiting trail by blaming the holdout on the player. Parker, we're told, is pointing to the deal he negotiated for defensive end Tyson Jackson at the third overall slot as proof that Parker is willing and able to negotiate a fair deal for a first-round pick.

    We continue to think that the two sides will come together not long before the regular season begins. But we also think that Crabtree won't have the kind of impact he could have had as a rookie, if he'd merely taken a slotted deal and gotten into camp.

    And we recognize the possibility that Crabtree thinks enough of his skills (after all, he said he can run a 4.4 with crutches) that he could re-enter the draft and be picked even higher next year.

    We're still kind of rooting for that, primarily since Peter King has vowed to change his name to Derek Jeter if Crabtree goes into the 2010 draft pool.
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