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Thread: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

  1. #106
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    Quote Originally Posted by osuceltic View Post
    Maybe the Reds know more than you know about Francisco and Frazier. Just maybe.
    It's possible, but then again we arent talking about a major league team that is know for making all the right moves now are we?

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  3. #107
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    Quote Originally Posted by camisadelgolf View Post
    What if Louisville has the better doctors?
    They need to higher some more PHDs then!

  4. #108
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    Quote Originally Posted by lollipopcurve View Post
    Always? He's always been young. And why do you think his plate discipline has "gotten into the acceptable range"? Sample size? Luck? If it isn't those things, what is it, and does it stand a good chance of continuing to inform his play?
    I really don't know think its luck. I don't know what else it is, but I doubt its luck. Maybe someone finally said the right thing to him and something clicked in his head.

  5. #109
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    There you go. Good work, doug.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  6. #110
    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    Quote Originally Posted by lollipopcurve View Post
    Time will tell. But, based on the 100% certainty with which you foresee his future, my guess is that he's already proven you wrong more than once.
    No not yet, his few extra BB's don't surprise me he was bound to improve to some extent he was just that horrible at accepting them. He'll surprise me if he spends more than a couple of months in the pros in his life, or completely changes his approach at least to an acceptable level. Even the worst hackers in MLB history have to walk and not K at a certain level and he has yet to do that at any stop in the minors and he still has to go up 2 levels and improve, not very likely when most guys numbers in those areas go the wrong way as they move up.
    "You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one."

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  7. #111
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    He'll surprise me if he spends more than a couple of months in the pros in his life
    Prepare to be surprised.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

  8. #112
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    No. 10 JUAN FRANCISCO, 3B, REDS

    Team: Triple-A Louisville (International)
    Age: 22
    Why He's Here: .435/.440/1.000 (10-for-23), 2 HR, 1 3B, 3 HR, 8 RBIs, 1 BB, 9SO
    The Scoop: He still strikes out in buckets and he doesn't like to watch pitches. But it hasn't seemed to matter for the recently-promoted Francisco. The lefty-hitter has as much power as anyone in the minors, and in August he's been punishing pitchers in the Southern League, where he hit .404/.436/.712 in 13 games, and in the International League, where he's hit three more home runs to go with his .435 average. Francisco has struck out in all six of his Triple-A games, and there's still concerns about how his approach will play in the majors, but he has shown he can succeed at Double-A and Triple-A, when many swing-at-everything hitters flame out by Double-A.

    http://www.baseballamerica.com/today...09/268728.html
    I miss Adam Dunn.

  9. #113
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    Quote Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine View Post
    No. 10 JUAN FRANCISCO, 3B, REDS

    Team: Triple-A Louisville (International)
    Age: 22
    Why He's Here: .435/.440/1.000 (10-for-23), 2 HR, 1 3B, 3 HR, 8 RBIs, 1 BB, 9SO
    The Scoop: He still strikes out in buckets and he doesn't like to watch pitches. But it hasn't seemed to matter for the recently-promoted Francisco. The lefty-hitter has as much power as anyone in the minors, and in August he's been punishing pitchers in the Southern League, where he hit .404/.436/.712 in 13 games, and in the International League, where he's hit three more home runs to go with his .435 average. Francisco has struck out in all six of his Triple-A games, and there's still concerns about how his approach will play in the majors, but he has shown he can succeed at Double-A and Triple-A, when many swing-at-everything hitters flame out by Double-A.

    http://www.baseballamerica.com/today...09/268728.html
    JJ Cooper spent much of today's chat discussing Francisco. He encouraged readers to scrounge for a comparable player that had success in the majors after walking as little as Francisco.

    The conclusion at the end of the chat?

    Juan Francisco = Wily Mo Pena

    I would trade him NOW while his value is at an all-time high. I think we may look back on this three years from now and wish we had done so. Hopefully WJ can take a page from WK's book and spin Francisco into a quality SP.
    Go BLUE!!!

  10. #114
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    JJ Cooper spent much of today's chat discussing Francisco. He encouraged readers to scrounge for a comparable player that had success in the majors after walking as little as Francisco.

    The conclusion at the end of the chat?

    Juan Francisco = Wily Mo Pena

    I would trade him NOW while his value is at an all-time high. I think we may look back on this three years from now and wish we had done so. Hopefully WJ can take a page from WK's book and spin Francisco into a quality SP.
    I have been clamoring this for a long time. His value is at it's peak now. Trade him and fill a hole. There's not going to be a spot for him anyhow with Rolen/Frazier etc. anyway.

  11. #115
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    JJ Cooper spent much of today's chat discussing Francisco. He encouraged readers to scrounge for a comparable player that had success in the majors after walking as little as Francisco.

    The conclusion at the end of the chat?

    Juan Francisco = Wily Mo Pena

    I would trade him NOW while his value is at an all-time high. I think we may look back on this three years from now and wish we had done so. Hopefully WJ can take a page from WK's book and spin Francisco into a quality SP.
    The missing link in Cooper's analysis and the "trade him now" analyis is that JF just turned 22 in June, is already doing well at AAA, and has two more minor league seasons if he needs them.

    I don't see any focus in Cooper's analysis - or your conclusion - that takes into account the stage of Francisco's development.

    I happen to disagree with the conclusion. I think JF is an unusually gifted talent who has achieved a great deal with an approach that is less than optimal. You guys are all essentially giving up on him at the age of 22, a young 22.

    Put aside the hype for a minute. Look at Jay Bruce's approach this year. The upper cutting and all the pop flies. Look at his OBP. I don't see people writing him off. His approach has flaws too, but people give him the time he deserves.

    The other point is that Francisco has steadily improved. His K rate went way down as he hit the higher levels. All the talk that he Ks a lot is untrue. For a power hitter, his K rate is not high. Yes, in his first AAA games he fanned quite a bit, but it's a brand new level for him.

    I think Francisco will be far more valuable in a year. Either as one of AAA's dominant hitters, or as a raw member of the Reds with enormous potential. My only concern about him is defensive position.
    Last edited by Kc61; 08-21-2009 at 05:40 PM.

  12. #116
    Kmac5 KoryMac5's Avatar
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    The conclusion at the end of the chat?

    Juan Francisco = Wily Mo Pena
    Pablo Sandoval says Hi. From looking at the numbers Sandoval's walk rate is right in line with Cisco's. Pablo hit for higher average but Cisco has more power. A better comparison than Wily Mo in my opinion.
    If you have a losing record at Reds games, please stop going.

  13. #117
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    Quote Originally Posted by KoryMac5 View Post
    Pablo Sandoval says Hi. From looking at the numbers Sandoval's walk rate is right in line with Cisco's. Pablo hit for higher average but Cisco has more power. A better comparison than Wily Mo in my opinion.
    Sandoval's strikeout rate in the minors was HALF of what Francisco's is. Until Francisco walks 4% of the time and strikes out around 11% of the time, Sandoval isn't a good comparison for him at all.

  14. #118
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    BAKER ALSO was asked about the soon-to-be crowded third base situation. If Scott Rolen is the man for the next couple of years, what’s to be done with top prospect Juan Francisco, promoted to Class AAA Louisville last week and not far from the bigs? Could Francisco be moved to left field?

    “I don’t know, man,” said Baker. “I haven’t seen him enough. We worked him there some during spring training (left field) and (coach) Billy Hatcher worked with him. You know if a guy carries a big bat you’re going to find somewhere for him to play. We know he is going to be a good hitter, especially when he learns the strike zone. He’s still young (22).”

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    I miss Adam Dunn.

  15. #119
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    I love that dusty baker has the idea that hes the greatest scout in the world. If he hasnt seen a player then no ones opinion matters.

  16. #120
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    Re: Juan Fransisco is now a Louisville Bat!

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Sandoval's strikeout rate in the minors was HALF of what Francisco's is. Until Francisco walks 4% of the time and strikes out around 11% of the time, Sandoval isn't a good comparison for him at all.
    For me the question that was posed by Cooper was "What major leaguer has had success as a player with a walk rate similiar to Cisco's." To me Sandoval has similiar walk rate to Juan but has found success at the MLB level. So it is possible to find a player with a low walk rate who has success in the major leagues. I do agree with your point in that contact is not Juan's strongest suit, where Pablo makes contact with almost everything he swings at.
    If you have a losing record at Reds games, please stop going.


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