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Thread: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

  1. #31
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hondo View Post
    Isn't anyone disapointed with this Draft Class?
    Reds signed 16 out of 22 players drafted between rounds 22 to 43. when you do that, you wind up with the Billings that you now see. worst set of Billings hitting stats that I can ever recall, and I go WAY back. Reds can pull the plug on Fleury already, and that's sad for a 4th rounder. A couple of 10th rounders from past drafts (Connor, Oliveras) are also apparent busts. Reds have done what we've complained that they have not been doing, drafting a boom-or-bust player like Billy Hamilton. So, get used to seeing some busts.

    but I saw 2009 as a pitcher draft, and like what Serrano and Pearl and especially Joseph has done. Jacob Johnson's only 18 and looks mighty interesting so far. I think that Leake and Boxberger fit the system well and will really jump quickly, but that's sight unseen.

    I'm not disappointed. but, give me a year and I might come over to your side.
    2015, baby!

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  3. #32
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by princeton View Post
    Reds signed 16 out of 22 players drafted between rounds 22 to 43. when you do that, you wind up with the Billings that you now see. worst set of Billings hitting stats that I can ever recall, and I go WAY back. Reds can pull the plug on Fleury already, and that's sad for a 4th rounder. A couple of 10th rounders from past drafts (Connor, Oliveras) are also apparent busts. Reds have done what we've complained that they have not been doing, drafting a boom-or-bust player like Billy Hamilton. So, get used to seeing some busts.

    but I saw 2009 as a pitcher draft, and like what Serrano and Pearl and especially Joseph has done. Jacob Johnson's only 18 and looks mighty interesting so far. I think that Leake and Boxberger fit the system well and will really jump quickly, but that's sight unseen.

    I'm not disappointed. but, give me a year and I might come over to your side.
    I certainly don't see Oliveras as a bust. He's 20 years old and OPSing .751 in Dayton. And on the days when he and Fellhauer are both in the lineup, he's the one in CF.

    Agree on Jacob Johnson. I get the feeling that he could be the plum of this year's draft.

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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by princeton View Post
    Reds can pull the plug on Fleury already, and that's sad for a 4th rounder.
    Good thing they took him over Stassi and Bailey.

    (That move didn't scream cheap at all)
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  5. #34
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by redsof72 View Post
    I would have to say that the talent level currently in Billings (or lack thereof) is rather disturbing. You have to get some decent players after the seventh round (Heisey, Dorn, Rosales, etc.).

    I have to wonder, quite frankly, if the Reds need to figure out what is going wrong. Are they not investing enough in the scouting department? Are the scouts being asked to cover too much territory and thus, not able to see players enough times to make an accurate judgment? Are the scouts just not doing a good job of evaluating?

    If you look at the talent level right now in Billings, Dayton, and Sarasota, I think it is way down.
    And Carolina. With Heisey, Francisco, Alonso, Wood, Stewart and Ondrusek out of there, that roster is practically bereft (with all respect to Frazier and Cozart). Especially pitching-wise. It's painful to follow that team right now.

    It's a great point about the scouting department, and you can add player development. If I'm running a team like the Reds and deciding where to place my resources, it sure seems like the best bang for the buck would be in scouting and player development. Those guys are paid a pittance in baseball terms, yet they can make a profound, incalculable difference. For the price of Willy Taveras, you could stock your organization with some of the best scouts and instructors in the business. The potential rewards are practically off the charts.
    Last edited by mace; 08-19-2009 at 01:06 PM.

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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Good thing they took him over Stassi and Bailey.

    (That move didn't scream cheap at all)
    I thought Stassi and Bailey weren't worth the scratch it took to sign them. High school catchers are largely a waste of money.
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  7. #36
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I thought Stassi and Bailey weren't worth the scratch it took to sign them. High school catchers are largely a waste of money.
    Maybe, but I'd rather take a chance on one that dominated competition in CA or GA in the fourth round then one that emerged late playing against groundhogs in Punxsatawney in the first round.

    Much better risk/reward.
    Last edited by Benihana; 08-19-2009 at 01:06 PM.
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  8. #37
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by mace View Post
    I certainly don't see Oliveras as a bust. He's 20 years old and OPSing .751 in Dayton. And on the days when he and Fellhauer are both in the lineup, he's the one in CF.

    Agree on Jacob Johnson. I get the feeling that he could be the plum of this year's draft.
    Daniel Tuttle and Mitchell Clarke are interesting too. Tuttle has a 2.66 ERA, 7 BB/18 K, and 2.08 GO/FO in 20.1 innings while Clarke is a left hander with a 3.75 ERA, 3 BB/11 K, and 3.80 GO/FO in 12 innings. Both of them turn 19 later this month.
    I miss Adam Dunn.

  9. #38
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Good thing they took him over Stassi and Bailey.

    (That move didn't scream cheap at all)
    You think money just grows on Bob's vegetable vines don't you? Stassi signed for $1.5M. Thats top 15 money and he certainly wasn't a top 15 talent. Bailey would have made more sense, but he is also a catcher coming off of TJ surgery, so there are some questions as to how the arm will be. He 'only' got $750,000 and the only reason he got signed is because the Rays went cheap and didn't sign their first rounder or second rounder.

  10. #39
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Maybe, but I'd rather take a chance on one that dominated competition in CA or GA in the fourth round then one that emerged late playing against groundhogs in Punxsatawney in the first round.

    Much better risk/reward.
    My pick would be none of the above. Stassi actually got a higher bonus than Mesoraco did. Perhaps, for the reason you noted, he deserved it, but he's still a HS catcher and the wayside is strewn is Kyle Skipworths.

    I've actually become a big fan of converting players to catcher. For instance, Juan Francisco might just be the greatest thing since sliced bread if he played behind the plate.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

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  11. #40
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    My pick would be none of the above. Stassi actually got a higher bonus than Mesoraco did. Perhaps, for the reason you noted, he deserved it, but he's still a HS catcher and the wayside is strewn is Kyle Skipworths.

    I've actually become a big fan of converting players to catcher. For instance, Juan Francisco might just be the greatest thing since sliced bread if he played behind the plate.
    Don't count on the Reds to be this brilliant or come up with this idea or follow suit with other teams that have tried and succeeded (See Chicago Cubs: Soto).

  12. #41
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    You think money just grows on Bob's vegetable vines don't you? Stassi signed for $1.5M. Thats top 15 money and he certainly wasn't a top 15 talent. Bailey would have made more sense, but he is also a catcher coming off of TJ surgery, so there are some questions as to how the arm will be. He 'only' got $750,000 and the only reason he got signed is because the Rays went cheap and didn't sign their first rounder or second rounder.
    Do the A's have money that grows on vegetable vines?

    Because they sure seem to spend more than the Reds. They signed Green for more than Leake and they still had enough to sign Stassi. And they signed Inoa last year, so don't go crying Yorman on me.

    As far as Bailey goes, TJ surgery sure seems to scare you away from him, but it didn't scare you enough to draft Mesoraco in the first round and give him millions?!?!?!
    Go BLUE!!!

  13. #42
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    My pick would be none of the above. Stassi actually got a higher bonus than Mesoraco did. Perhaps, for the reason you noted, he deserved it, but he's still a HS catcher and the wayside is strewn is Kyle Skipworths.

    I've actually become a big fan of converting players to catcher. For instance, Juan Francisco might just be the greatest thing since sliced bread if he played behind the plate.
    You know I've been clamoring for Francisco to be moved to catcher since 2007 (and was the first on this board to do so.) But an organization that is too stubborn to move Dunn to 1B or Phillips to SS surely isn't going to try something that creative.
    Last edited by Benihana; 08-19-2009 at 03:35 PM.
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    You know I've been clamoring for Francisco to be moved to catcher since 2006.
    last week, it was 2007

    I think it was 2008 but maybe it was 2004, before we even drafted him?
    2015, baby!

  15. #44
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    Quote Originally Posted by princeton View Post
    last week, it was 2007

    I think it was 2008 but maybe it was 2004, before we even drafted him?
    Well we didn't even draft him...

    My mistake on the year, it was a bit of hyperbole. I think you get the point.
    Last edited by Benihana; 08-19-2009 at 03:38 PM.
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  16. #45
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    Re: How would you rate the Reds' 2009 draft signings?

    HS catchers are the epitome of a poor draft choice. Right up there with college 2B and HS flamethrowers with questionable mechanics and poor control. Sure, you could name a Johnny Bench, Chase Utley, or Nolan Ryan. But that's the extreme exception.

    Stassi has bust written all over him. Questionable bat, HS catcher, but good intangibles? No thank you at any price. I'd rather have Barnhart and the cash for other choices.

    This idea that Cincinnati somehow went Lindner-style cheap is laughable.
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