Turn Off Ads?
Page 7 of 7 FirstFirst ... 34567
Results 91 to 103 of 103

Thread: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

  1. #91
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Cincinnati/Athens
    Posts
    655

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    I will mention it, as a big Heisey supporter.

    It's disappointing.

    And, frankly, I don't really understand the general Francisco bashing on this board. He's a fun prospect, with a boatload of power, and still very, very young for his level.
    How is pointing out a glaring weakness bashing the kid? We want him to succeed and for him to do so he must correct such weaknesses.
    "When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail"

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #92
    Member membengal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Baltimore
    Posts
    9,092

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Because it is. The way it is has unfolded in this case, over the last year or so, it's bashing.

    The same as when it was Stubbs being bashed by certain folks.

    What is missing, sometimes, from this very wonderful part of the forum, is a longer view. We tend, sometimes, as a board, to focus on the micro and miss the macro. And miss that sometimes, guys improve.

  4. #93
    Member NJReds's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    New Jersey, USA
    Posts
    5,432

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    Because it is. The way it is has unfolded in this case, over the last year or so, it's bashing.

    The same as when it was Stubbs being bashed by certain folks.
    I think many were bashing the Reds for taking Stubbs over Lincecum. (and many thought that before the pick was made, so it wasn't second guessing).

    Maybe in time that evolved to 'bashing' Stubbs, but it was born out of the frustration of watching Lincecum evolve into one of the top pitchers in baseball.

    I don't think anyone here actively roots against players. And the comment about Francisco having trouble with inside breaking balls was a fair one, because he'll have to make that adjustment to have success on the next level.
    "The players make the manager, it's never the other way." - Sparky Anderson

  5. #94
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Posts
    1,377

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Francisco strikes out swinging on a breaking ball right under his hands. Again.
    This is the one that came across as bashing. And doug can wriggle around it all he wants, but the way he wrote that makes his point pretty obvious. Considering it came in the same game when he had two hits, including a HR, it just stinks of an agenda.

  6. #95
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Cincinnati/Athens
    Posts
    655

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Quote Originally Posted by osuceltic View Post
    This is the one that came across as bashing. And doug can wriggle around it all he wants, but the way he wrote that makes his point pretty obvious. Considering it came in the same game when he had two hits, including a HR, it just stinks of an agenda.
    That whole statement is fact, not opinion.
    "When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail"

  7. #96
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Posts
    14,281

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Quote Originally Posted by osuceltic View Post
    This is the one that came across as bashing. And doug can wriggle around it all he wants, but the way he wrote that makes his point pretty obvious. Considering it came in the same game when he had two hits, including a HR, it just stinks of an agenda.

    Ultimately, at some point, the player will show the way. Francisco is one guy I've liked for several years and it's been annoying to see the ridiculous placements he gets on RedsZone polls, etc. But there's no reason to debate it, the player will show the way.

    On the other hand, I've not been particularly high on Stubbs -- yet I've been excited to see him do well his first two days in the big leagues and, at least initially, he looks like he belongs.

    People can bash these kids if they want, but at the end we will be suprised how well some do and grossly disappointed in others.

    Bashing of players is par for the course on these forums. Ignore it. The only opinion that matters is the collective opinion of the decision makers on the team.
    Last edited by Kc61; 08-20-2009 at 05:42 PM.

  8. #97
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    1,437

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Seems like frustration as opposed to bashing...maybe frustration is bashing in your dictionary, but not mine. Francisco would be the Reds #1 prospect if he showed the ability to recognize pitches out of the strike zone with consistency. That's a fact. He has tremendous power and has put up pretty good numbers despite that 'flaw' if you will. He still has the potential to be a really good MLB player and I for one hope he develops into one.

    Bum

  9. #98
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Posts
    14,281

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Quote Originally Posted by Bumstead View Post
    Seems like frustration as opposed to bashing...maybe frustration is bashing in your dictionary, but not mine. Francisco would be the Reds #1 prospect if he showed the ability to recognize pitches out of the strike zone with consistency. That's a fact. He has tremendous power and has put up pretty good numbers despite that 'flaw' if you will. He still has the potential to be a really good MLB player and I for one hope he develops into one.

    Bum
    Francisco has a 1.429 OPS at AAA at age 22. I can sure understand the "frustration."

  10. #99
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    35,925

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Quote Originally Posted by osuceltic View Post
    This is the one that came across as bashing. And doug can wriggle around it all he wants, but the way he wrote that makes his point pretty obvious. Considering it came in the same game when he had two hits, including a HR, it just stinks of an agenda.
    I don't see that as bashing. I was voicing a weakness that he hadn't make any improvements on.

    In that same thread I had this to say about Francisco
    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Juan Francisco just hit an opposite field LD HR. Please baseball Gods let this kid understand he doesn't have to swing at everything.
    This was from the day before
    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Francisco with an opposite field shot. That one looked gone off the bat. The kid has some power.
    This is from the thread where Francisco was called up to the Bats
    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Holding his own? Sure. Looking good going forward? Questionable. I do really like what he has done over his last 250 PA or so with his under 4 to 1 K/BB rate over that time. I would really like it if he kept improving it though because its just much easier to produce at a high level when you are sporting a good ratio.

    Certainly guys can be successful in different ways. Like I have said before, Francisco has something you can't teach. The issue has always been what you can teach, the plate discipline, has always been twice as bad as terrible for him. Lately it has gotten into the acceptable range. Thats a good start, but its a pretty small sample size and he has never shown it before. Lets hope he not only continues to perform at his current rate, but continues to improve his K/BB.
    I think I have been pretty fair with Francisco. I don't believe that I have once 'bashed him'. I believe I have been honest in my assessment of him.

  11. #100
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    1,437

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Francisco has a 1.429 OPS at AAA at age 22. I can sure understand the "frustration."
    thanks...I stand corrected...21 AB's....I was more referring to the entire season or his entire minor league career...the sarcasm helps in these discussions though. I guess the intellectual/civil part of the discussion is over now. I will stand down and just watch what happens. As I have said multiple times, he has tons of potential and a little plate discipline is all he needs.

    Have fun.

    Bum

  12. #101
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Posts
    14,281

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Quote Originally Posted by Bumstead View Post
    thanks...I stand corrected...21 AB's....I was more referring to the entire season or his entire minor league career...the sarcasm helps in these discussions though. I guess the intellectual/civil part of the discussion is over now. I will stand down and just watch what happens. As I have said multiple times, he has tons of potential and a little plate discipline is all he needs.

    Have fun.

    Bum
    It was sarcastic, but I thought it was civil.

    Funny part of the whole discussion is that Francisco made over 30 errors at 3B at AA. Now that's an area worth watching closely.

    McCoy suggested today that Rolen is blocking Francisco at third base. I don't quite see that. Hard to see Cisco at third in the major leagues real soon with all those errors.

  13. #102
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    35,925

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Funny part of the whole discussion is that Francisco made over 30 errors at 3B at AA. Now that's an area worth watching closely.

    McCoy suggested today that Rolen is blocking Francisco at third base. I don't quite see that. Hard to see Cisco at third in the major leagues real soon with all those errors.
    I think the errors are a bit of a result of the field in Carolina. Both he and Cozart have just about doubled their error total from the year before. Weird that it would work out like that. I have heard some bad things about the field conditions there as well. Francisco is not great shakes over at 3B, but I don't think he is 35 error bad either.

  14. #103
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Posts
    14,281

    Re: Minor League Game Updates - Wednesday 8/19

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    I think the errors are a bit of a result of the field in Carolina. Both he and Cozart have just about doubled their error total from the year before. Weird that it would work out like that. I have heard some bad things about the field conditions there as well. Francisco is not great shakes over at 3B, but I don't think he is 35 error bad either.
    After EE, I don't have the stomach for a high error third baseman.

    If he continues to hit this well, they either have to trade Cisco to the AL or move him to LF. ( I think we have enough lefty first basemen floating around.)


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25