Very solid. I love Garp!Originally Posted by RichRed
Very solid. I love Garp!
"....the two players I liked watching the most were Barry Larkin and Eric Davis. I was suitably entertained by their effortless skill that I didn't need them crashing into walls like a squirrel on a coke binge." - dsmith421
My take on his behavior is that when he wasn't golfing, he was thinking about getting over and how to lie about it to keep up a fake image that young kids, advertisers and sponsors would like. Of course I don't know what his relationship with his kids was like but the problem with his behavior is that his kids will wonder "why didn't he spend more time with me?" He has to tell them the truth. And not just the surface - I cheated on your mother. He has to explain his behavior in the context of the father - child relationship: "I preferred spending time with women I barely knew to spending time with you when you were a baby" He needs to tell them - "I left the parenting to mommy, and while she was busy taking care of you, I indulged in as much sex as I could, because taking care of a child is difficult and I feel entitled to sleep with a lot of women and then lie about it so people would not know that I say one thing and do annother". I'll never know if he says that but based on his gutless behavior in the last week or two I highly doubt he has the ability to humble himself that way. He (and many fathers who share his very common weakness) probably doesn't think that level of candor with children is necessary. Which is a shame.
Last edited by Betterread; 12-08-2009 at 09:34 PM.
I'm just trying to stay real here...
Frankly you have shown a lot of compassion for Tiger's situation. While you tend to go easy on him for his behavior...what do you think about his decision to get married. Just about everyone I've discussed in the real world has had the opinion, if Tiger wants to womanize, thats his business....but don't get married.
And about this being an addiction...there are people with addictions being shown on the "Dateline to Catch a Predator" show on a constant basis. Are you are sympathetic towards their addiction as you are with Tiger? Of course not. This comparison will probably trigger a scathing rebuttal...but my point is, I don't accept the fact that teen predators have an addiction nor do I accept the fact that Tiger may have an addiction. I look at their actions.
What if Tiger was an alcoholic and drove drunk one day. You mentioned in another post how you so much would disapprove of that. Would you point to his alcohol addiction in the same way you are pointing to his alleged sexual addiction? I don't know.
And I don't think you solely define anyone by their shortcomings, but don't they need to be considered?
Tiger's wife has reportedly moved out. Tiger has been in agony ever since. (Agony...worst stripper name ever)
"I know a lot about the law and various other lawyerings."
Hitters who avoid outs are the funnest.
Nah, you misunderstand my POV if you think I have compassion. That's not it. Tiger has no one to blame but himself for what's happening. I don't feel bad for the guy as he knew the potential consequences when he made his decisions. My entire point is not all that complicated. I'm just not going take this flaw in Tiger's character, which happens to be a common one among the rich and powerful, and draw sweeping conclusions about his entire character and all aspects of his life.
The other piece of my POV is driven mostly by one of the few principles I *try* to live my life by, and that's not judging someone when I don't know all the details of their situation or when I've never been in their situation. And I've said it already, but I'll repeat it again. No one, and I mean no one, can possibly know without doubt how they'd behave in his life situation. Like Roy said, his life is so extreme and unique that the average Joe can't possibly comprehend what it's like to live his life.
Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David
Here is a pretty good summary of how things now stand for Tiger Woods. Amazing how fast events can reshape the way a celebrity is perceived.
http://abcnews.go.com/print?id=9284989
Trouble in the Tiger Den: What Can Woods Do to Save Reputation?
Tiger Woods Remains Silent as Women Allege Affairs, Wife Mulls Options
By RUSSELL GOLDMAN
Dec. 9, 2009—
With a 9,000-square-foot Florida home, Tiger Woods and his wife have ample room to avoid talking to each other, but Woods' failure quickly to address the public continues to hurt his reputation as tabloids continue to write about alleged extramarital affairs, public relations experts say.
"He is beyond PR redemption. He is in public relations hell right now. There is not a PR man on Earth who can restore his image," said public relations maven Howard Rubenstein.
Holed up for nearly two weeks, Woods has not once emerged from his home into public view. He has addressed the public only through his Web site, issuing a vague apology days after the bizarre Nov. 27 car accident that raised questions about a fight with his wife and spurred nearly a dozen allegations of marital infidelity.
"Last week he had a big PR problem. I think it's really changed this week," Howard Bragman, CEO of Fifteen Minutes Public Relations, told "Good Morning America" today. "Now my gut is that he's got a life problem. There are some major issues he has to confront."
As the tabloids continue to add names to Woods' scorecard of alleged sex partners, each further tarnishing the golfer's once-squeaky-clean image, there is little the world's leading golfer can do to staunch the bleeding, Rubenstein said.
"He's hemorrhaging; even a transfusion won't help. He can never re-establish that perfect image of a happily married family man. Never," said Rubenstein. The best he can hope for is to re-establish his image as a golfing champion. If he wins consistently and doesn't sink to 4 or 5, he'll be applauded again but just for golf. There will still be plenty of snickering behind his back."
But even a return to the golf course could turn into a public nightmare for the man many competitors once feared.
"The aura of invincibility that Tiger had -- how does he ever get that back?" ABC News sports consultant Christine Brennan told "Good Morning America" this morning. "Now he's a laughingstock."
Before the scandal, Brennan said, Woods' only had to contend with screaming fans and questions from sports reporters. Now, she said, he's going to be tailed as he enters and leaves the courses and as he simply lives his life.
"I think this fall from grace is so remarkable," she said. "It's not just about sports."
But heading back to work could be a good thing for both Woods and his fans.
"I think just seeing him on the golf course again will be soothing for many people and it will be for him as well," Brennan said.
Few confirmable details have leaked from the couple's multimillion-dollar home in an exclusive community in Widermere, Fla. In recent days, his wife, Elin Nordegren, has reportedly moved out of the home, bought a $2 million mansion on a secluded Swedish island, and -- according to the Chicago Sun Times -- is negotiating a "hefty seven-figure amount" to remain married.
It is believed Nordegren was still living at the home with Woods when, early Tuesday morning, a woman called 911 from the couple's home to report her mother had collapsed, and request an ambulance.
Public relations expert Bragman, who once suggested that Woods get out in front of the tabloids and speak publicly, said the golfer's troubles have become so numerous that it might be prudent for him to hide out for a few months and possibly seek rehab if tabloid reports of sex or prescription drug addiction are true.
"You don't clear the road until the avalanche is done and this avalanche is not over yet," he said.
Money, Public Image Could Be Keeping Woods' Marriage Afloat
The Orange County Sheriff's office would not identify the caller from Tuesday's 911 call, citing privacy laws. There is no mention of Woods on the call.
A child can be heard screaming in the background on the recording of the 911 tape. Woods and Nordegren have two children together; their daughter, Sam, is 2 and their son, Charlie, is 10 months old.
Nordegren's mother, Barbro Holmberg, 57, was released from Health Central Hospital in Ocoee at around 4 p.m. Tuesday, 11 hours after paramedics took her to the hospital with a stomach ailment.
Nordegren's twin sister, Josefin Nordegren, is also rumored to be visiting the U.S. and staying at the home, which according to public records, has nine bathrooms and eight bedrooms.
As the list of women with whom Woods is accused of having affairs continues to grow, some observers have speculated why Nordegren continues to remain with her husband and what Woods can do to restore his reputation.
To high-powered divorce attorney Raoul Felder, Nordegren's reasons for staying with Woods are simple: "Money," he said.
"That's what it's all about, $75 to $80 million is what Elin stands to get now. Before all this, according to the prenup [speculation], it was a $20 million deal at the end of 10 years," he said.
Rubenstein, on the other hand, recommended the couple split up.
"He ought to legally separate from his wife," he said. "He ought to come to an understanding with her, offer a very significant financial payment to take care of her and the kids, and then split."
"From a PR perspective, and for their own psychology, the best thing to do is separate sooner rather than later. Who knows how many more women are going to emerge? This could continue for a long time," said Rubenstein.
"I have let my family down and I regret those transgressions with all of my heart," said Woods in a statement published on his Web site last week. "I have not been true to my values and the behavior my family deserves.
"I am not without faults and I am far short of perfect," said Woods. "I am dealing with my behavior and personal failings behind closed doors with my family. Those feelings should be shared by us alone."
Copyright © 2009 ABC News Internet Ventures
Somewhere, Buick fans weep.
She used to wake me up with coffee ever morning
I am the child of a parent who had an affair, and to be truthful, this is a bit much for even me.
While I'd like to do this with everyone who has ever wronged ("And the reason you didn't put on your turn signal is that you thought it was more important to text your BFF, now isn't it?"), this type of apology is demeaning for everyone involved.
This sounds like one of those speeches you get at a trial where the defendant has just been sentenced to death and the judge piles on with one of those "so obvious it's painful" lectures.
Last edited by Dom Heffner; 12-09-2009 at 09:55 AM.
They dropped him earlier this year for financial reasons.
My prediction on the next "lover" to be reveled.
I believe she is already in a relationship with KillaMy prediction on the next "lover" to be reveled.
the carefully crafted image has crashed and burned. It will be interesting to see what arises from the ashes.
I don't really have an interest in sordid details other than the fact that they have ruined the image he had been building over 10+ years. He now has a chance to grow up and create an image based on the truth.
Couldn't have given a better description of man made idols that are worshipped, and their inevitable end result as well.
Yeah, I don't think Tiger will ever fully recover from this, but if Kobe Bryant can recover from his ordeal then anything is possible.
Like that article said, he has a life problem he needs to figure out first before he worries about PR. I think one way he could potentially handle this in a way that the public would find genuine and would fully "forgive" him would be if he took some time away from golf because he was focusing fist on the more important things in life and golf was secondary to that. Maybe even skip this entire next season or at least a couple of majors. If he did that and then came back afterwards and started to win again, that could change the image he's now most likely to carry with him for a long time. But if he just goes about his business and makes the occasinal plea that he's changed and learned from mistakes, people (especially the "golf" crowd) will not buy it.
I think the biggest problem he's going to have is there's no way around stopping with the filandering, single or married. He's going to have to stop cold turkey with the sexual encounters because there's no way he'll be able to keep it private. And THAT will be incredibly difficult I believe.
Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David
I usually don't care much for Reilly but thought this one presented some food for thought.
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/colum...ick&id=4727383
IMO, he will need to hire a full time assistant whose job description is job will be to keep Tiger from getting in situations that could compromise him. Let's be honest if you want to avoid trouble the best way to do that is see it coming in the distance and change course to avoid it. This guy will be the person in the adjoining room. He has to have accountability to someone.
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