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Thread: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

  1. #61
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    Quote Originally Posted by RedLegSuperStar View Post
    I'm sorry mth but I like #'s 4, 6, & 9. So hears hoping those of your ten don't get canned.
    I used to like Viola, but he's gone from prospect to suspect in my book. He's 27 this year and still can't get it over. He's Daniel Cabrera without the ability to go 175 innings. He's a hard throwing lefty though, so he's still an asset that the team should try to hang on to.

    I like Wlad and Valiquette as well.

    In Wlad's case a pretty smart team has already DFA'd him once so there is reason to be a skeptic. I do think he is one of the few true corner OF prospects on the team so I'd keep him, but he's out of options and not a sure thing to make the 25 man roster and may be lost anyway, so maybe cutting him loose now saves another player instead of risking a loss of some one else now and Wlad later.

    Valiquette is at no risk. At number 9 on the list, that makes him number 31 on the 40 man roster and no way they lose that. That said, I like other relievers better and as far as lefty relief goes, Rhodes and Herrera are the guys for now with Bray also a possibility and Donnie Jospeh and Mace Thurman are the best guys for 2011 or 2012. In the mean time, a slew of guys who may not make the rotation among Maloney, Wood and eventually Horst, Fairel and maybe Infante could end up in the pen soon. They also have lefty arms with a major league shot in Alex Smit, Joe Krebs, Lee Tabor and big arm guys like Aguido Gonzalez and Mark Pawelek.

    Lefty relief (relief in general) and a glut of role player types in the IF and OF are areas where the Reds are pretty deep. I like the Cabrera signing as opposed to the status quo, but the team seems to have had the depth to have gone out and done better both at SS and behind the plate. Cabrera is a fine stop gap IMO and though I'm not a fan, Hernandez will probably do as well. I just think the team had the depth to go out and get better with more upside and more of a long term focus. These guys are consolation prizes and "asleep at the wheel" still stands IMO.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

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  3. #62
    Member hebroncougar's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    I like the move, quite a bit. Nothing past one year other than a buyout, and if he has a good year, we can bring him back for nothing more than what he would be worth. No downside to this IMO. For the first time in quite some time, I'm very optimistic about the season if our pitching can stay healthy.

  4. #63
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    Cabrera is most likely going to be a below average major leaguer next year. The Reds probably feel like they can project his floor better than their in house options though. One just hopes that they're right but they missed pretty badly on the floors of proven guys like Taveras and Gonzo.

    I think an optimistic scenario is that Cabrera can be league average over a full season. Worst case scenario really could be a Willy T or Gonzo.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  5. #64
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    Very good signing, IMO. I like the way OCab plays -- peppery, as they used to say. I know up here in New England diehard Red Sox fans were not happy that the team let Cabrera go after they won the Series in 04. Many felt he provided the needed spark to get that team over the hump.

    The young Reds need a push. The addition of Rolen and OCab tells them that the organization is "trying." I like the impetus.

    No tears for Janish. He's done well in his career so far, especially for a guy who has not shown much promise with the bat. I don't know if he's the best choice for utility guy (Cairo and even Frazier may be better choices) since OCab is going to be out there almost every day, but it seems he's shown enough defensively to keep himself on a major league roster for a few years anyway.

    I like the option on Cabrera too. If he shows he's not slowing down significantly, and Cozart stalls in AAA, the position is not in question next year. It won't be long until the team has its in-house solution, it appears, but it's nice for the organization not to have to go SS searching every year.

    Excellent offseason!
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

  6. #65
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    He's basically getting 4 million for one year. That's way too much, but it's not my money. I think the Reds should have pinched their pennies and got Damon and/or FeLo.
    "My mission is to be the ray of hope, the guy who stands out there on that beautiful field and owns up to his mistakes and lets people know it's never completely hopeless, no matter how bad it seems at the time. I have a platform and a message, and now I go to bed at night, sober and happy, praying I can be a good messenger." -Josh Hamilton

  7. #66
    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    Great signing IMO should provide adequate offense being placed in the #2 hole, which is a huge upgrade from Paul. And I think he'll prove to be sound defensively as well, he won't have to play with any youngsters unless there are injuries so all he has to concern himself with is the SS position and getting acclimated to BP. He sure didn't have these type of defenders around him last year in Minny or Oakland.
    "You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one."

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  8. #67
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    He sure didn't have these type of defenders around him last year in Minny or Oakland.
    Apologists for his poor defensive stats last year are saying Oakland has terrible IF conditions and Minnesota's artificial turf may have been a bit quick for him. It's only 1 year against a backdrop of good numbers, so I'm not real worried about his D.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

  9. #68
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    Quote Originally Posted by Jpup View Post
    He's basically getting 4 million for one year. That's way too much, but it's not my money. I think the Reds should have pinched their pennies and got Damon and/or FeLo.
    Or 6 mill for 2 years.

    As you say, it isn't our money. It's not enough money or years to stunt the growth of this team, so I like it. He may not be the Cabrera from 5 years ago, but he isn't a black hole. The fact that Janish had a sub .700 OPS vs RHPs in his minor league career wasn't a good sign.

    Let them platoon and this might be a strong combo.

  10. #69
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    I think Jojo's got it; this is downside protection, not unlike the reasoning that probably went into acquiring Taveras last year--i.e. the downside on Dickerson is unknown, we'd better get somebody who can at least catch the ball in CF. That approach wasn't entirely wrong, even as bad as Taveras was--i.e. Dickerson spent a lot of DL time and it gave Stubbs/Heisey the year to develop.
    As others have said, it's all going to turn on whether Cabrera can return to defense of 2008. One reservation I have is that I don't see it solving the 2-hole lineup problem. Cabrera's OBP lifetime is only down in the .310's; he ought to hit 7th or 8th, which still leaves us without a real 2nd hitter, unless the Dusty will slot Rolen there, which seems unlikely to me.

  11. #70
    Quiet Reverence Vada Pinson Fan's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Depends on which Cabrera shows up. If experts on UZR can be believed, Cabrera is probably right around average as a SS, perhaps a bit better. His bat is around 700, according to projections.

    He's a meh signing, IMO, and offers little upside. But he's the devil you know.
    This isn't directed at you, Scrap, but what would the feeling(s) have been around here had the Reds NOT signed Cabrera? I think Jocketty did what he had to do for 2010. Cabrera had the leverage and both sides knew it IMO. Too bad it will cost the team between $4-$6 million for O.Cab's services. Was hoping for 1 year at $2 - $2.5 mil.

    Give Bob Castellini credit. With last year's relatively poor attendance totals, BC is "putting his money where his mouth is".

  12. #71
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    Cabrera is slipping. I would prefer an open competition for the starting SS spot. If Janish outplays him in the spring, he wins the job.

    I fear much of the praise for this signing will melt come May when Dusty is putting his .310 OBP in the two hole in each lineup. Whoever starts at SS should bat 7th or 8th.
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  13. #72
    The rest is drama. marcshoe's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    This team had too many holes in the lineup to win last year. I remember the frustration hat filled the stadium at the games I went to in June that featured continued easy outs of the op of the lineup. Some of the holes were fixed late in the season, and this signing fills one more. The Reds now look like they're putting a lineup out there that can put runs on the board.

    Who knows what will happen with Cabrera's defense. I'll wait and see. In the end, though, I believe this move takes the team one step closer to being a serious major league team that can contend if things go well, and it does it without hurting the future in any way. It's been a while.

  14. #73
    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    I'd say there's a decent chance of Cabrera being worth the money and equal slightly less chances of him either providing surplus or deficit value.

    Compared to Janish, who I think would certainly provide surplus value.

    How's that for definitive?

    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  15. #74
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    While Cabrera's OBP is below average in the wide context, I don't see the great fear of him in the #2 hole considering the current options. They still have too many 6-8 hitters available that are going to be regulars, so they have to bat somewhere. Cabrera isn't the worst option there.

    Now, if you have WT and Cabrera batting 1-2, hair pulling will begin...what I have left that is.

    Another potential positive of this move is that a two-headed shortstop might limit the exposure of the weaknesses of each. Split their time and Janish's weak stick won't be as big a drag as it would be as the everyday option. Likewise, Cabrera's average, at best D might not hurt as much in a part-time role. Good ole job sharing can work. Hopefully that is Dusty's plan.
    Last edited by traderumor; 01-31-2010 at 10:27 AM.
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  16. #75
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    Re: Reds sign Orlando Cabrera to one-year, $3M deal; option for second year

    Even with Cabrera slipping...he still hit better than Janish. I mean do you think he is Rich Aguilera as a SS all of a sudden? His defense is that bad?

    Is it the money that annoys you that he got? Damon was probably not going to sign for less than probably $8 million to play here. You have better options in the OF than you do at SS.

    I guess the Taveras debacle makes everyone a little pessimistic....and if he actually has fallen into the abyss by the time the season starts than I will eat my words...but I would rather have this guy than hoping/wishing that Janish can play that post this year as a starter.


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