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Thread: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

  1. #121
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Quote Originally Posted by Homer Bailey View Post
    Not to turn it into the Beckham/Alonso debate again, but it really does make you wonder what they were thinking....
    To be fair, Votto hadn't turned into "Vottomatic" at the time of that draft. I don't think anybody thought he'd be as good as he is as QUICKLY as he has.
    Chapman to the rotation!!!! Do it already!!!!

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  3. #122
    Member membengal's Avatar
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Quote Originally Posted by Strikes Out Looking View Post
    Having Alonso, Heisey, Fransisco, Frazier and the others nipping at the heels of the guys now in the majors is a good problem to have. In fact, I can't remember a time when the Reds have had as many young players and prospects (both pitching and hitting) that were at AAA or in the majors.

    Wherever Alonso (and the others play), I'm very excited to see these guys play this year and next.
    1986 - 1989 saw Larkin, Stillwell, Daniels, O'Neill, Jones, Browning, Dibble, Sabo I think. And they had picked up Charlton to boot, and he was coming although not from entirely within the system. Fun times to be a Reds fan with all that young talent kicking around the minors and forcing the issue in Cincy. And just before that time period ED broke in, establishing himself in CF as the other young players kicked the door down to join him.
    Last edited by membengal; 03-01-2010 at 07:40 PM.

  4. #123
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    If Alonso puts up the kind of numbers in AAA that I expect he will, then Votto should be told to move to LF and like it for the good of the team. Given the fact the team will control Alonso's contract for twice as long as Votto's, it will be quite obvious which one to trade if it comes to that.

  5. #124
    Mr.Redlegs is my homeboy Eric_the_Red's Avatar
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Perhaps we should pause this thread for 300 days or so, until it will actually matter. I don't see Alonso as a regular member of this team until next year at the earliest. Too much can happen between now and then (injuries, trade, performance issues, etc.).

  6. #125
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    If Alonso puts up the kind of numbers in AAA that I expect he will, then Votto should be told to move to LF and like it for the good of the team. Given the fact the team will control Alonso's contract for twice as long as Votto's, it will be quite obvious which one to trade if it comes to that.
    Disagree. Bird in the hand.

    Delmon Young was the #1 overall pick in the draft, consensus top prospect, had a career .880 OPS in the minor leagues, and what has he done in the big leagues?

    I love prospects, and have probably spent more time worrying about the minor league system in the last decade than I have about the big club. But if you have a 26 year old All-Star with the character of a Votto, you don't trade him to make room for a prospect, period.
    Go BLUE!!!

  7. #126
    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Disagree. Bird in the hand.

    Delmon Young was the #1 overall pick in the draft, consensus top prospect, had a career .880 OPS in the minor leagues, and what has he done in the big leagues?

    I love prospects, and have probably spent more time worrying about the minor league system in the last decade than I have about the big club. But if you have a 26 year old All-Star with the character of a Votto, you don't trade him to make room for a prospect, period.
    Absolutely
    "You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one."

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  8. #127
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    The trick of course is making the choice.

    Adcock or Klu?

    McCovey or Cepeda?

    Lee or Tony?

    Mark or Rafael?

    It's not a bad spot to be in.

  9. #128
    Brett William Moore Will M's Avatar
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    1986 - 1989 saw Larkin, Stillwell, Daniels, O'Neill, Jones, Browning, Dibble, Sabo I think. And they had picked up Charlton to boot, and he was coming although not from entirely within the system. Fun times to be a Reds fan with all that young talent kicking around the minors and forcing the issue in Cincy. And just before that time period ED broke in, establishing himself in CF as the other young players kicked the door down to join him.
    the fun times are a comin back!

    i lost interest in the Reds after Marge fired Davey Johnson. The whole time Lindner owned the team i rarely watched. i started being a fan again when Bob C bought the team. the current talent on the big league team combined with the prospects at AA/AAA makes me think we will see another period of the Reds putting a winning team on the field for a while. when the team had its last good run from the mid 80s to the mid 90s they only made the playoffs twice. most of that was before the NL was split into three divisions. i believe if we had the same setup then as now the team would have won the NL central ~5 times.

    just dreaming of what the starting pitching of Bailey-Cueto-Volquez-Chapman-Leake-Wood can do has me excited. add Votto, Bruce & the offensive prospects and we are gonna see a lot of winning real soon.
    .

  10. #129
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Quote Originally Posted by Homer Bailey View Post
    Not to turn it into the Beckham/Alonso debate again, but it really does make you wonder what they were thinking....
    or maybe they weren't
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    I think you keep the better player. Period. Who that is remains to be seen. Right now obviously it's Votto. But in a year that may look different. Frank Robinson was once a prospect, so was Willy Mays and Roberto Clemente. I'm sure the Reds, Giants, and Pirates all had incumbents too, but then those guys made it clear you had to organize the team around them. So preferring incumbents over prospects as some kind of unalterable rule looks pretty dubious.

  12. #131
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    I think you keep the better player. Period. Who that is remains to be seen. Right now obviously it's Votto. But in a year that may look different. Frank Robinson was once a prospect, so was Willy Mays and Roberto Clemente. I'm sure the Reds, Giants, and Pirates all had incumbents too, but then those guys made it clear you had to organize the team around them. So preferring incumbents over prospects as some kind of unalterable rule looks pretty dubious.
    Huh?

    I don't think anyone is arguing for "preferring incumbents over prospects as some kind of unalterable rule." However, when you have an incumbent who just turned 26 and has OPSd .924 in over 1000 MAJOR LEAGUE at-bats, I will take that incumbent over any prospect in the game, let alone a guy like Yonder Alonso. I don't care if Alonso goes all Jay Bruce in AAA, I'm not trading Joey Votto for him. If I can play them both at the same time, I will. Otherwise, unless Votto can fetch an unbelievable king's ransom back, Alonso is trade bait.

    The Reds time to contend is the next three years. Joey Votto is a critical piece that fits into that timeline. You don't trade him to make room for a prospect, period.
    Last edited by Benihana; 03-01-2010 at 09:34 PM.
    Go BLUE!!!

  13. #132
    SERP deep cover ops WebScorpion's Avatar
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Wow! It seemed like such an innocuous quote...
    All he said was they're not 'asking' Joey to move and they're trying Alonso in different places to see how he looks there. Standard stuff IMO. Alonso hasn't really proven anything...he's not even knocking ON the door, much less knocking it down. If/When Alonso is raking at AAA, then you can address this issue...for first basemen the answer is usually to trade one of them, they don't normally transfer to other positions well.

    Now, the real kicker is Votto...he's also the kind of guy who might come to camp next year with an outfielders glove and say "Hey Skip! How's about I try left field for a while?" They may never ask him, but he's the kind of leader that will know what's best for the team.

    I really dig that Alonso doesn't want to leave the organization...that says a lot to me. I think he's a smart kid, who knows what it takes to be a Major Leaguer and I think he can see that this team is put together well enough to contend for a ring or two in the future.

    "Okay you guys, pair up in threes!" --Yogi Berra

  14. #133
    All dyslexics must untie!
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    The trick of course is making the choice.

    Adcock or Klu?

    McCovey or Cepeda?

    Lee or Tony?

    Mark or Rafael?

    It's not a bad spot to be in.
    Casey or Konerko? I love Sean but...really?

    The day "way over" Yonder was drafted I said he was a BPA to be traded when his value was ripe

    No reason to change that take. Alonzo is a DH, Cincy is a NL team
    Never overlook the obvious

  15. #134
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Players who get their feelings hurt over being asked to do something for the good of the team need to get over themselves. They get paid to play, not fill out the lineup cards. What is going to happen is going to happen and we aren't going to change that. But if Joey Votto is going to fall apart because someone asks him to play left field then I really hope we just trade him because if something slightly out of the norm happens to him he is going to just crumble.
    Easier said than done.
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    Re: Alonso trying 3B, OF. Jocketty: "I don't see us moving Joey"

    Prediction: Alonso will be a better player than Votto, for whatever team he plays for.


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