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Thread: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

  1. #16
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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Quote Originally Posted by GIDP View Post
    The dudes career is a Carson Palmer season. Lets not get ahead of ourselves with the praise of a career back up.
    A "former" Carson Palmer season....certainly not as bad as one of the last 3 seasons of Palmer.

    I have a strong feeling that neither of you have watched Seneca Wallace's starts....certainly not as many as 6 of them from start to finish (and probably not even one of them from start to finish) so you'd have a decent idea of what type of Quarterback he currently is.

    He's a huge upgrade over Quinn, and he's much better than Delhomme is right now. I'd rather have Carson than Wallace, hoping that Carson, somehow, returns to resemble the old Carson just a little bit.

    Seneca Wallace will help Cleveland win some games the next couple of years while they continue their search for a franchise Quarterback.
    Last edited by Kingspoint; 03-16-2010 at 12:37 AM.

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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    A "former" Carson Palmer season....certainly not as bad as one of the last 3 seasons of Palmer.

    I have a strong feeling that neither of you have watched Seneca Wallace's starts....certainly not as many as 6 of them from start to finish (and probably not even one of them from start to finish) so you'd have a decent idea of what type of Quarterback he currently is.

    He's a huge upgrade over Quinn, and he's much better than Delhomme is right now. I'd rather have Carson than Wallace, hoping that Carson, somehow, returns to resemble the old Carson just a little bit.

    Seneca Wallace will help Cleveland win some games the next couple of years while they continue their search for a franchise Quarterback.
    I think you are a little over the top. Palmer had 3000 yards this year and Wallace has 3,500 in his career. Palmer had 21 TD and 13 INT last year and Wallace has 25 and 14 for his career. I dont want to say the guy sucks but seriously his career is basically a bad Palmer season, and thats just looking at the simplest of numbers. Hard to suggest some of the things you are suggesting.

  4. #18
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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    Delhomme is strictly a backup to Seneca Wallace. In no way, shape or form will Delhomme ever outplay Wallace in training camp and earn the starting Quarterback job. Seneca Wallace is very effective, and has averaged more yards per game in his career than Carson Palmer has the last 3 years of his career, along with a better Touchdown to Interception ratio.
    Hey, you may be right. I'll be the first to admit that I don't know squat about Wallace because my observations of his play have been limited, and that the reason Holmgren went after him is because Mike does, and Seneca is very familiar with his offense.

    And your observations on their receivers was spot on. The Browns lost two of their "key" (and I use the word lightly) receivers going into last season in Stallworth and Winslow. And I was never a fan of Edwards. But look at what they went into the season with as far as the receiving corp was concerned? I knew they were in for a rough ride. I liked the TE Watson acquisition. But they need some receivers up in Cleveland.

    Former GM Savage deserved to get fired. And the owner can share in some of the blame to. But I like the Holmgren hiring. He seems to have a plan, is shaking things up, and I like what he is doing so far.

    Will be interesting to see who they draft with their 11 picks. And again, I like that Holmgren has the control/say in those picks. Brown fans have reason for optimism.
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

  5. #19
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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Wallace is 29, 1 year younger than Palmer. He has completed 333 passes for 3547 yards (59.5 %) in his career. His career QB rating is 83.1.

    In 2009, Palmer's worst EVER full season statistically, he completed 282 passes (at a 60.5% clip) for 3094 yards and 21 TDs. His QB rating was 83.6.


    So Wallace is one year younger than Palmer and his entire career combined adds up to what is without question Carson Palmer's worst ever statistical full season. If this is the guy Cleveland is excited about, then that excites me as a Bengals fan.

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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Quote Originally Posted by The Operator View Post
    Wallace is 29, 1 year younger than Palmer. He has completed 333 passes for 3547 yards (59.5 %) in his career. His career QB rating is 83.1.

    In 2009, Palmer's worst EVER full season statistically, he completed 282 passes (at a 60.5% clip) for 3094 yards and 21 TDs. His QB rating was 83.6.


    So Wallace is one year younger than Palmer and his entire career combined adds up to what is without question Carson Palmer's worst ever statistical full season. If this is the guy Cleveland is excited about, then that excites me as a Bengals fan.
    Wallace was brought in to be a good stopgap or backup while they search for a franchise Quarterback. Delhomme offers quality depth as a backup to Wallace or starter if Wallace gets injured. Neither will be the starter in 2012. That Quarterback will be drafted this year.

    Cleveland has an excellent Offensive Line, an excellent run stuffer in Shaun Rogers, matched with quality depth at Linebacker so the team could run a 3-4 Defense. I agree with most people that the Browns will draft S Eric Berry with their first pick if the Seahawks pass on him. I see the Seahawks grabbing QB Jimmy Claussen if he's there. If Claussen is gone, then the Seahawks probably grab OT Brian Bulaga. LT Brian Bulaga is rising up the rankings very fast and could make it all the way to Seattle at #6 if they rank him that highly, or at least in their Top-10. The Browns already have a Franchise Left Tackle without a Franchise Quarterback. They can tell you which is more important. And, because of that, they'll take QB Jimmy Clausen over OT Brian Bulaga, but if Claussen is gone, it's looking like OT Brian Bulaga will be the guy the Seahawks take to solidify their Offensive Line leaving S Eric Berry for the Browns. If Claussen and Bulaga are both gone (meaning DT Gerald McCoy falls down to Seattle, I think the Seahawks pass on McCoy as they don't have a need for a DT, where their Safeties are absolutely atrocious) the Seahawks still take S Eric Berry. So, Cleveland would then have to choose between DT Gerald McCoy and the rest....and there's a big drop off from McCoy and "the rest". The Browns won't be able to pass on McCoy. They've already had feelers out with the rest of the league during Free Agency for Shaun Rogers, so they've got a good idea on who they can trade with and what they'll get. They'll take McCoy if he's there and then trade Rogers for something else.

    Their backfield is set with Jerome Harrison, James Davis, Chris Jennings, Lawrence Vickers and Peyton Hillis. Massaquoi was a solid draft last season. Ben Watson was a solid pickup, especially for Seneca Wallace. They also have another Tight End (Evan Moore) who was picked up off of waivers last season and came on strong at the end of the season as a Receiver. There's a lot of good pieces in place. Robert Royal is a good blocking Tight End.

    With the Browns' early 2nd round pick, I'd think they'd take either a Defensive End or a Quarterback, and then they've got 4 picks from the early 3rd round to the early part of the 4th Round to go after a Wide Receiver, Cornerback, Right Guard, and Quarterback/Defensive End (whichever they didn't get in the 2nd Round).

    Massaquoi and Josh Cribbs should be a decent 1-2 WR group while they add to it another with a 2nd Day (Friday) pick. Chansi Stuckey has looked good in pre-season games, but it hasn't translated to regular season games. Most Redzoners are pretty familiar with 2nd year player Brian Robiskie, and it will be curious to see the 2nd year growth from both Robiskie and Massaquoi.

    The 2nd Round pick this year is going to be a huge pick for the Browns.

    The most likely players to be taken with the #2 pick will be from this group:

    Florida's DE Carlos Dunlap
    TCU's DE/OLB Jerry Hughes
    Clemson's DE/OLB Ricky Sapp
    Utah's DE/OLB Koa Misi
    Texas QB Colt McCoy

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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    The Seahawks just traded away DE/OLB Daryl Tapp for a 4th Round pick. It's looking more and more that the Seahawks could be using their 2nd Round pick on a Defensive End.

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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Why are the Browns paying Delhomme $7M if they expect him to be nothing more than a serviceable backup? That's a good amount of scratch for a guy who, if Wallace starts, should be riding the pine.

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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Delhomme will start the season as the Browns' QB. (Holmgren and Mangini as much as said that when they signed him, Kingsport's insistence aside.) The question is whether Delhomme has enough left in the tank to keep the qb spot away from a good back-up (but barely serviceable starter) Wallace.

    And, as for draft picks, I expect Holmgren to go WR/TE heavy, as this draft has some solid talent in those areas. It wouldn't suprise me to see Holmgren ignore the signal caller completely in the draft this year, grab his go-to, #2, and possession receivers (the Browns need all three, really), then, knowing he's going to draft fairly high again next season, pick a qb then.

    Or he could grab a top WR, find another in FA, and go DL and LB heavy, with a late-round qb as emergency starter.

    (Of course, I have to admit, I HATE drafting late-round quarterbacks. So few make it out of the first round, less out of the second and so on. Why not fill holes-- and there are many in Cleveland-- rather than playing the lottery on a possible qb fit years down the road?)
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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Quote Originally Posted by The Operator View Post
    Why are the Browns paying Delhomme $7M if they expect him to be nothing more than a serviceable backup? That's a good amount of scratch for a guy who, if Wallace starts, should be riding the pine.
    Mike Holmgren's record as a G.M. sucked in Seattle. Nothing surprises me when it comes to something he might do.

    It's definitely a head-scratcher that he gave $7M to a guy who's very likely to lose the job in August to someone else. It would indicate that it's Delhomme's job to lose. Lose it though, he will.

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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    And, don't forget two other good signings, LB Scott Fujita and RT Tony Pashos. Fujita, if he can stay healthy, is a beast of a player and will instantly be the leader of the Defense in Cleveland. Pashos takes the place of Ryan Tucker and others they used there last season. Pashos is coming off an injury himself but appears healthy now and should provide a great anchor on the Right Side of the line.

  12. #26
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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Quote Originally Posted by The Operator View Post
    If this is the guy Cleveland is excited about, then that excites me as a Bengals fan.
    Nowhere has it been said, by Brown fans or their management, that they were excited about Seneca, as if he, or even Delhomme, are the QBs of the future. C'mon, lets be realistic here. Something had to be done with Anderson and Quinn. They weren't making it and it was no surprise they terminated Anderson's contract just days before he was due a roster bonus of $2 million and a $7.45 million dollar salary in 2010.

    Holmgren stated.... "The quarterback position has been probably the one area we've spent the most time on as a group since I've been here," Holmgren said. "We all came to the conclusion that we couldn't go into the season the same way we went into last season."

    There are some good "pieces", including depth, in Cleveland, but that's not denying the fact that there are also some holes that need to be addressed and filled in numerous areas. And QB is still one of them.

    But again - I'm far more optimistic that a guy like Holmgren is making those decisions now. They'll make their biggest impact with the 12 picks in the draft.
    Last edited by GAC; 03-17-2010 at 04:55 AM.
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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Quote Originally Posted by GAC View Post
    Nowhere has it been said, by Brown fans or their management, that they were excited about Seneca, as if he, or even Delhomme, are the QBs of the future. C'mon, lets be realistic here. Something had to be done with Anderson and Quinn. They weren't making it and it was no surprise they terminated Anderson's contract just days before he was due a roster bonus of $2 million and a $7.45 million dollar salary in 2010.

    Holmgren stated.... "The quarterback position has been probably the one area we've spent the most time on as a group since I've been here," Holmgren said. "We all came to the conclusion that we couldn't go into the season the same way we went into last season."

    There are some good "pieces" in Cleveland, but that's not denying the fact that there are also some holes that need to be addressed and filled in numerous areas. And QB is still one of them.

    But again - I'm far more optimistic that a guy like Holmgren is making those decisions now. They'll make their biggest impact with the 12 picks in the draft.
    Agree completely. Holmgren, with experience as a G.M. behind him, and no duties as a Head Coach, probably has a great chance to be a decent G.M. now in the NFL. He's always said that he's "a teacher". Well, he's going to have to forget about being a teacher as those skills have nothing to do with being a G.M. where it's all about delegating and making decisions. No more hands on grunt work. On the looks of things, so far so good. He's got a rock-solid Offensive Line that was leaking on the right side. Ignoring the pundits and fans who wanted Mangini gone and sticking with a guy who was successful in New York as the Jets' Coach his first season while providing some stability in Cleveland. Not making the Head Coach change was a great decision. Obtaining a ton of draft picks is also another, though I was surprised to see Kamerion Wimbley go. They've got great depth at Linebacker, though, and they could afford to do that. Linebacker is also the easiest position to replace in the draft.

    If you're looking to improve a Secondary, there's no better way than to get a handful of 3rd and 4th Round picks as there are always very capable secondary players in those rounds as well as Wide Receivers and Linebackers and Guards. And, this year, there are Quarterbacks in the 3rd Round who have a great ability to be starters in the NFL.

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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    And, this year, there are Quarterbacks in the 3rd Round who have a great ability to be starters in the NFL.
    I disagree completely. This is a poor year for qb's in general. To further water it down by dropping into the third round for a possible starter?

    Your chances of hitting big money on the lottery are better, IMO.
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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Quote Originally Posted by GAC View Post

    Holmgren stated.... "The quarterback position has been probably the one area we've spent the most time on as a group since I've been here," Holmgren said. "We all came to the conclusion that we couldn't go into the season the same way we went into last season."

    There are some good "pieces", including depth, in Cleveland, but that's not denying the fact that there are also some holes that need to be addressed and filled in numerous areas. And QB is still one of them.

    But again - I'm far more optimistic that a guy like Holmgren is making those decisions now. They'll make their biggest impact with the 12 picks in the draft.
    The bolded part is typical Mangini. The QB battle made the Browns relevant late into camp and into the season. I remember seeing daily SC updates on the status of the Browns QB situation. IMO Mangini handled that about as poorly as possible and it didn't make it even better than Winslow was traded away prior to the season and Edwards was traded to the Jets for some of Mangini's guys who were poor.

    I am interested to see how Holmgren is as a GM. He was bad in that capacity with the Seahawks. When he removed himself from GM duties he became a successful coach. I think his worst move was keeping Mangini on board. I think he is a toxic coach, especially in the locker room.

    I heard on the radio the other day how the Browns brought in the only QB worse than the Quinn/Anderson fiasco last season. Wallace really shouldn't do anything to excite Browns fans. I thought Quinn got shafted a little bit. Guy got less than a full season of starts. Granted his Browns career was filled with injuries and QB turmoil, I would at least have given him a shot this season.

    It is still to be seen what the Browns do in the draft. They need a QB but I don't see them making a run at Bradford and don't know if they will pick another highly touted ND QB with some issues.

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    Re: Brady Quinn Traded To Denver

    Jake Delhomme says he "was not guaranteed anything" by the Browns upon signing a two-year deal with the club over the weekend.

    Well, except $7 million in the first year. "I want to make that perfectly clear," he said. "I was guaranteed the chance to compete. Very simple. There were no guarantees whatsoever." President Mike Holmgren, however, has made it even more clear (with the $7M) that he doesn't want an in-camp QB competition. Because of his contract, Delhomme looks to have the upper hand on Seneca Wallace.

    And, that "bold" part you were talking about bucksfan2, "We all came to the conclusion that we couldn't go into the season the same way we went into last season." is also a statement saying that Seneca Wallace isn't going to be given a chance to compete for the starting job and that, in fact, the Quarterback job is being "handed" to Delhomme.

    And, Derek Anderson ended up signing with Arizona, the best place for him. Browns fans will see that Anderson's low completion percentages and YPA the last two seasons were the result of lousy Receivers and Coaching and not because of Derek Anderson. Instead of a 2-3 TD-to-Int ratio and completion percentages of 47.9 of his passes, and 5.38 yards per attempt, Anderson in Arizona will reverse those numbers and have at least a 3-2 TD-to-Int ration, complete at least 55% of his passes with at least 7.0 yards per attempt his first 3 seasons in Arizona.
    Last edited by Kingspoint; 03-17-2010 at 02:37 PM.


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