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Thread: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

  1. #1
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    What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    Perhaps we should wait until we have actual results, like a winning season, but maybe it's good to track this as we go. Walt Jocketty has had about the same amount of time or less than Wayne Krivsky and Dan O'Brien had, yet seems to have the organization in much better shape. What did he do differently? If you wanted to replicate a GM who's successful in a short amount of time for a struggling small-market team, what could you take from Jocketty's strategy so far?

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    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    What he's done the best is gather and collect the jewels from his predecessors and hide under his desk when Cast was looking to stop the losing.

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    Matt's Dad RANDY IN INDY's Avatar
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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    There is a lot to be said for having a good collection of work, confidence in your abilities, and putting yourself at the right place at the right time. Jocketty just may have put himself in a nice position with the Reds and I think, with that said, he has the knowledge, experience and ability to turn this franchise into a winner.
    Talent is God Given: be humble.
    Fame is man given: be thankful.
    Conceit is self given: be careful.

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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    What he's done the best is gather and collect the jewels from his predecessors and hide under his desk when Cast was looking to stop the losing.
    That's pretty much it. Most of the heavy lifting was done. Jocketty avoided panic trades. I'd also add he avoided the temptation to dump guys with big salaries just because they have big salaries. While I think he might have traded Harang, Arroyo or Cordero if the package had been right, he did the right thing and held them when he didn't get a good offer. He also understood the value of strong veterans and the need for that kind of presence on this team, hence the Rolen acquisition.

    If the team is in the mix this summer, I expect guys like Alonso, Francisco, Frazier, Heisey and Wood will be on the table to add the right piece. Jocketty knows how to make those kinds of deals.

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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    So are we saying that Dan O'Brien didn't have good enough pieces from his predecessor? Or had them and didn't use them well? And the same with Krivsky? Were they each able to find a few good pieces (plus a lot of holes) that eventually added up to something Jocketty could work with? If O'Brien or Krivsky had stayed, would the organization be where Jocketty has them?

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    Designated Threadkiller LincolnparkRed's Avatar
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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    I think DanO inherited a sinkhole that he tried to fill from the bottom up, Krivsky inherited less of a problem but i think the first two months of 2006 did him in. He had success with Arroyo, Phillips but knew he needed more pitching so he made some crazy trades for guys that never should have pitched in the majors. Since none of those other trades turned into an Arroyo or Phillips he was stuck with what he had for the most part and turned that team over to Walt. So Walt is standing on the shoulders of Dan and Wayne
    Climbing down from the bridge, but keeping the torch lit until Dusty's fate is settled

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    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    I think, as Randy alluded to, that Walt has a track record that DanO and Wayne didn't. he apparently has Bob's ear since Bob was the one who brought him over from StL. Say what you want about last year but the record did improve. Perhaps Walt has convinced Bob that a little more patience is needed and with the young players he and his predecessors brought in a winner may be right around the corner.
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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    Quote Originally Posted by BCubb2003 View Post
    If O'Brien or Krivsky had stayed, would the organization be where Jocketty has them?
    O'Brien, I doubt. We drafted some nice players while he was here but the experience was otherwise totally forgettable.

    Krivsky did better and raised the talent level in the organization. But he still seemed to do better as a bargain hunter than anything else. Of course, we really don't know what the club would look like today if he was still in charge of it.

    Jocketty did a fine job for many years in St. Louis of assembling teams, and while I can pick at some of the individual moves and he doesn't deserve credit for everyone who's here, the Reds are starting to resemble a cohesive team instead of a random collection of ballplayers.

    In short, I think Krivsky was probably a better choice than Jocketty for the task of raising the organizational talent level from the depths to a point where contention wasn't a pipe dream, and Jocketty is probably the better choice to take that talent and turn it into a winner. Different courses, different horses.
    Not all who wander are lost

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    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    Walt is a competent GM who knows how to GM. Don't get me wrong the previous two GM's had their strengths, but they didn't see the big overall picture that Jocketty does. Obie was a very good drafter but failed at the major league level. Wayne was a very good talent adviser, but he misappropriate funds and was unable to build a competitive team.

    In the last year or so Walt has shown why he has been a successful GM. He lets his draft people draft and lets his LA people concentrate on the LA market. But he knows how to close, how to get things done. The creativity in the Chapman contract is something that I don't think the previous GM's could have done. The much maligned Rolen trade looks better now that he is extended and much of his money is deferred. The why he handled Gomes was impressive and his signing of Cabrera was a nice move as well.

    Jocketty will really prove what kind of GM he is over the course of this season. Does he build? Does he rid himself of some bad contracts? Does he move some prospects for good big leaugers? Jocketty has pretty much quietly build/maintained a nice baseball team and now he has the resources, as well as funds coming off the books to build a competitive team.

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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    I think the biggest difference I see is that Walt is seeing the big picture. He has played the market well and hasn't overextended himself b/c he was chasing a dream. His experience has shown through and knows how to GM, something his predecessors lacked.

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    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    Quote Originally Posted by BCubb2003 View Post
    Perhaps we should wait until we have actual results, like a winning season, but maybe it's good to track this as we go. Walt Jocketty has had about the same amount of time or less than Wayne Krivsky and Dan O'Brien had, yet seems to have the organization in much better shape. What did he do differently? If you wanted to replicate a GM who's successful in a short amount of time for a struggling small-market team, what could you take from Jocketty's strategy so far?
    Here's the differences, IMO. The amount of impact is debatable.

    Jocketty stresses defense. Wayne and DanO pretty much ignored it.

    Walt fills in holes with better quality veterans. Ramon Hernandez is better than Paul Bako. Sure, WilyT was a whiff, but other than that, his veteran acquisions have been much more solid.

    Wayne would've never traded for Rolen. Whether you agree or disagree with that trade, that is a key difference. I love that move, but we will have to wait and see the impact on the season.

    IMO, Walt has a better eye for bullpen arms, although Wayne finally got it right in his last year after spending lots of resources and wasting a lot of time on experiments.

    Walt seems more concerned overall with the quality of position players and balance of the team. Wayne really bought into "90% of the game is pitching".
    Again, that doesn't necessarily mean Walt is right or better, but its' a key difference.

    Walt has had one horrible FA signing (WilyT, but he was able to do damage control by unloading him on the A's).. In contrast, Wayne had several disaster moves, and was not able to perform damage control. Rumor was that Dusty really pushed for Stanton to get released.

    Walt is spending more money and resources on the farm than either Wayne or DanO. Maybe that's not fair that Cast trusts Walt with more money, but the reality is that he's getting premier Latin prospects that we have never had a chance with before. He's getting it done. The future looks much brighter.

    So while Walt has not pulled off the specacular "WOW" trade yet, he's really only made one mistake (Wily).. A lot of solid moves which incrementally improved the team. These moves resulted in a 5 game improvement in the W-L record last year (despite more injuries). The run differential backs up the fact that it was a legit improvement on the team.

    I think it's reasonable (with good health) to expect another 5 game improvement this year.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

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    No half measures, Walter RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    I think the biggest difference I see is that Walt is seeing the big picture. He has played the market well and hasn't overextended himself b/c he was chasing a dream. His experience has shown through and knows how to GM, something his predecessors lacked.
    Except for Willy Taveras. That's the one glaring exception to the rule for me. The team signed him WAY above market, WAY too early. I've come around a bit to the Rolen deal, but I still can't come to terms with Taveras.

    Anyway, I think we're getting a bit ahead of ourselves here. If the Reds post a winning record this year, then we can resurrect this conversation in earnest IMO.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    Thanks all. I'm just trying to figure out if there's a practical way to say "I want a Walt Jocketty approach" in a given organization or if the only answer is "Be Walt Jocketty at the right time," which sounds like that old-school
    mysticism rather than sabremetrics.

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    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    The short answer: no big, stupid mistakes. Acquire assets at every opportunity and don't lock yourself in to mediocrity. The end.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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    Member Spring~Fields's Avatar
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    Re: What did Walt Jocketty do differently?

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    What he's done the best is gather and collect the jewels from his predecessors and hide under his desk when Cast was looking to stop the losing.
    Yes

    Arms: Head and shoulders better (article from Fay)

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Arms: Head and shoulders better
    Reds insider: How crucial is good stuff? Just look at the 2005 staff

    February 27, 2010

    GOODYEAR, Ariz. - The Reds ended the 2005 season with the worst pitching in the National League.

    The club was last in the NL in ERA, runs allowed, complete games, shutouts and saves.

    Of the 19 pitchers who ended the season on the roster, 15 are out of baseball.

    The starting rotation was Aaron Harang, Brandon Claussen, Eric Milton, Ramon Ortiz and Randy Keisler. Allan Simpson, Chris Booker and Jason Standridge were in the bullpen.

    Five years later, pitching, and pitching depth in particular, are no longer a weakness. It's quite the contrary in fact.

    "That's what going to be key for us," general manager Walt Jocketty said. "That's a strength we have that some other teams don't have."


    The Reds saw signs of the improvement last year. The team ERA was 4.18 - the lowest since it was 3.98 in 1999.

    And compared to 2005? The Reds finished last year seventh in the NL in ERA, eighth in runs allowed, fourth in complete games, second in shutouts and eighth in saves.

    The Reds did that with a staff dotted with young arms.

    Reds manager Dusty Baker has noticed the increase in live, young arms since he took over three years ago.

    "Big time," Baker said. "They've had a good draft and good development of those drafts. That's where you learn you're trade and serve your apprenticeship in the minor leagues."

    But the transformation goes back further than Baker's three years. And four general managers share in the credit of turning it around after years of patching things together under GM Jim Bowden.
    Dan O'Brien had very good drafts in his two years at the helm and re-opened Latin America to the organization. Homer Bailey was drafted on his watch. Johnny Cueto was signed under O'Brien. O'Brien also drafted Travis Wood and Jordan Smith, two young pitchers who probably will make it to the big leagues.

    Wayne Krivsky, who followed O'Brien, traded for Bronson Arroyo and Edinson Volquez and signed Francisco Cordero. Arroyo stabilized the rotation. Cordero stabilized the bullpen, and Volquez was the club's best pitcher before being derailed by elbow surgery. Krivsky also brought in Daniel Ray Herrera through a trade and got Jared Burton in the Rule 5 draft.

    Brad Kullman, who served briefly as interim GM between Jim Bowden and O'Brien, made the trade for Aaron Harang.


    Jocketty, the current GM, has continued to build. He added Nick Masset through trade and signed Arthur Rhodes.

    His biggest move was to sign Aroldis Chapman, a 21-year-old Cuban left-hander.

    Chapman has wowed people during camp.

    The Reds have made a conscious effort to stock arms.

    Pitchers like Mike Leake, the Reds' top draft choice last year, and Wood, last year's minor league pitcher of the year, will probably start the year in the minors but they're close to being big-league ready.

    "We've got several guys," Jocketty said. "Leake, (Matt) Maloney, (Justin) Lehr, Wood on the verge of being able to pitch up here.

    "We've got a lot of quality arms in the system."

    You couldn't really say that in 2005.


    http://news.cincinnati.com/article/2...oulders+better
    http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=80573

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    His experience has shown through and knows how to GM, something his predecessors lacked.
    I don't think that is what Walt Jocketty and Dusty Baker have said about their predecessors in the article above.
    Last edited by Spring~Fields; 03-18-2010 at 01:01 PM.


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