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Thread: Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?

  1. #31
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    I have to say, Dickerson misplayed both of those balls (especially the first one) last night. He ended up catching them but they were not as difficult as they looked.

    And we can continue to drone on about the defense, but I haven't heard much about Dickerson's .257/.278/.343 line (with a .409 Babip!!!) with zero HR, zero RBI and 13/1 K/BB ratio. If his name was Taveras I am sure that his defense wouldn't matter in the slightest and we would have had 50 threads requesting his ouster. Hell, if his name were Stubbs maybe he would be getting petitioned to go down to the minors.

    Let's just try and look at things in perspective. The team had a good win last night and all some people want to point out are Cabrera's defensive issues and how Dickerson made plays that Gomes never would have. Which may or may not be true. I totally get if it is a critical play and Gomes lets one clang off his glove or if Cabrera lets one go through his legs. But I also don't remember threads popping up when Dickerson fanned with the bases juiced or when Gomes took Motte out of the yard to win the game.

    By the way, the Reds won last night.
    Nicely put. I'm as critical of defense as anybody, but the last thing you want to hear after a nice win is fans complaining about that win. But that's just me.

    For all the cynical & depressing posts made here over the past 2 weeks...this club is still only 2 games below .500, the pitching still hasn't come close to it's projected ability, and the bats are just now waking up (25 runs in that 3 game series...overlooked by many due to the pitching of the Reds). For as many things that have gone wrong...we're still right in the mix of things. Lighten up guys.
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  3. #32
    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    I agree with pretty much everything you have said. There were a lot of big outs, big hits, and big moments in last nights game. In the game of baseball all 9 players on the diamond have a say in the game. But when you break it down even further there are several important moments that decide a game.
    I think there are several "exciting" moments that decide a game and a lot of little noticed "foundation" that make them possible.

    Defense isn't a new issue, it has been around ever since Abner Doubleday. But the focus on defense has reached an apex this off season.
    This is incorrect. I think defense had been rediscovered as a market inefficiency several years ago. That this is just dawning on the Reds isn't surprising. However, it his heartening to see signings like Aroldis Chapman; it indicates they're not entirely asleep at the wheel when it comes to finding new ways to be competitive.

    Many experts extolled the Red Sox signing of a 38 year old Mike Cameron.
    What point are you trying to make? Cameron had a history as a great defender and the Red Sox were looking to improve their defense. Based on historical data, it was a good signing.

    The Mariners were the trendy team this season because they had a great defense.
    What does "trendy" have to do with it? Was I part of the "trend?" That would be a first!

    While defense is nice, it takes balance to win baseball games. It takes defense, pitching, and offense to win baseball games. We can harp all we want about Cabrera's defense (which I agree has been less than stellar so far) but there is a reason the Reds went out and got Cabrera. They didn't feel that Janish could hit enough to warrant playing every day. This is coming from a front office who had made a commitment to pitching and defense.
    I don't see where the argument against me pointing out that Cabrera has looked poor on defense so far is. He has. He got an exciting hit in last night's game...great! His slash line is only below average now. I hope he hits like he has in his career and his defense gets better because so far on the season, he's a liability rather than an asset.

    We can applaud Dickerson's defensive prowess out in LF last night. Many people wanted Dickerson to start almost every game and lead off. Well as a poster above has posted he is putting up Taveras-esque numbers with a grand total of 1 walk.
    I didn't read that post but I disagree on several levels.

    Let's analyze each!

    1. Dickerson isn't making $6mm

    2. Dickerson isn't the starter

    3. Dickseron has 32 PAs on the year. I would wager that I could find players with hundreds, if not thousands of 32 PA stretches where only a single walk was earned. It hardly seems like a unique situation if one understands sample sizes and randomness.

    4. Dickerson is fast and can actually play good defense as opposed to just being fast.

    5. Dickerson over his career has a good walk rate. That it hasn't manifested in a tiny 32 PA makes me no nevermind.

    Side note, if there is a desire to stop talking about Willy Taveras, it would seem reasonable to...I dunno...stop talking about Willy Taveras. I certainly didn't bring him up and had garnered nary a passing thought about him other than some odd mention on another site I frequent.

    For some reason he has gotten a pass from many Reds fans, especially when he has struggled mightily at the beginning of the past two seasons.
    I have no idea what point you're trying to convince me of here. "Many Reds fans" don't say anything about a non-starter having one walk in 32 PAs, who "struggled mightily" in larger but still small sample sizes even though the rest of the time, his numbers are quite good and said player has somehow gotten a "pass."

    I hope I can convince a couple of those fans to complain so I can get a few of the "passes" they otherwise would've given to Dickerson/Bruce/et al.

    If you're saying "Nate, I haven't heard you say anything about Dickerson's 'slow start,'" I say, see the numbered points above. I think Dickerson's more valuable to the team than Gomes. I think he's probably more valuable than Stubbs too. Finally, I think the Reds can and should do better than ANY of Gomes, Stubbs or Dickerson.

    I guess the main point of all my rambling is if you want to win games in baseball, get balance.
    High five!

    Defense and Pitching alone won't win you games.
    But no one is making that argument. A single thread on defense isn't evidence that _I_ think that and I don't really care to argue over the perception of what the nebulous "Redszone" thinks.

    If it would then then Seattle and San Francisco would be the two dominant teams in baseball.
    Not that I agree with the point you're trying to make in any way but it is amusing that the best team in baseball right now (Rays) leads league in defense.

    Now can someone complain about Dickerson and give me a pass? I'm a little light on passes.

    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  4. #33
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    Re: Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    It's a bit off thread, but I'll follow up. We now have OPSes of .566 and .621 competing for the CF job. What's particularly amazing about last night's win is that we somehow won with both in the lineup at the same time.
    OBP in the starting lineups. Last night 6 of the Dodger 8 were over 400, 7 over 350. For the Reds 0 of 8 over 400 and 2 over 350.
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  5. #34
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    Re: Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?

    Quote Originally Posted by flyer85 View Post
    OBP in the starting lineups. Last night 6 of the Dodger 8 were over 400, 7 over 350. For the Reds 0 of 8 over 400 and 2 over 350.
    Dodgers have an amazing offense. The problem is as we saw the Dodgers pitching staff is awful.

  6. #35
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    Re: Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    I have to say, Dickerson misplayed both of those balls (especially the first one) last night. He ended up catching them but they were not as difficult as they looked.

    And we can continue to drone on about the defense, but I haven't heard much about Dickerson's .257/.278/.343 line (with a .409 Babip!!!) with zero HR, zero RBI and 13/1 K/BB ratio. If his name was Taveras I am sure that his defense wouldn't matter in the slightest and we would have had 50 threads requesting his ouster. Hell, if his name were Stubbs maybe he would be getting petitioned to go down to the minors.

    Let's just try and look at things in perspective. The team had a good win last night and all some people want to point out are Cabrera's defensive issues and how Dickerson made plays that Gomes never would have. Which may or may not be true. I totally get if it is a critical play and Gomes lets one clang off his glove or if Cabrera lets one go through his legs. But I also don't remember threads popping up when Dickerson fanned with the bases juiced or when Gomes took Motte out of the yard to win the game.

    By the way, the Reds won last night.
    The differences between Dickerson and Willy T. are that Dickerson is being paid close to the minimum, is basically on a 1 year deal and Dusty's not running him out there every day. Also, Dickerson has a history of being able to get on base at a decent clip while Willy T never did. Dickerson isn't exactly making me giddy every time he comes up to the plate but he's not Tavaras horrible. But let's not let the facts get in the way of a good rant.
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  7. #36
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    Re: Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    Dodgers have an amazing offense. The problem is as we saw the Dodgers pitching staff is awful.
    And their defense, to date, has been worse than their pitching.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  8. #37
    Socratic Gadfly TheNext44's Avatar
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    Re: Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    I have to say, Dickerson misplayed both of those balls (especially the first one) last night. He ended up catching them but they were not as difficult as they looked.

    And we can continue to drone on about the defense, but I haven't heard much about Dickerson's .257/.278/.343 line (with a .409 Babip!!!) with zero HR, zero RBI and 13/1 K/BB ratio. If his name was Taveras I am sure that his defense wouldn't matter in the slightest and we would have had 50 threads requesting his ouster. Hell, if his name were Stubbs maybe he would be getting petitioned to go down to the minors.

    Let's just try and look at things in perspective. The team had a good win last night and all some people want to point out are Cabrera's defensive issues and how Dickerson made plays that Gomes never would have. Which may or may not be true. I totally get if it is a critical play and Gomes lets one clang off his glove or if Cabrera lets one go through his legs. But I also don't remember threads popping up when Dickerson fanned with the bases juiced or when Gomes took Motte out of the yard to win the game.

    By the way, the Reds won last night.
    All good points. But just because Dickerson may not be the answer in LF, doesn't mean that Gomes is.
    "Imagination is more important than knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

  9. #38
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    Re: Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    I couldn't have said it better. Defense has become in vogue this season and it is getting a little annoying to hear all the complaints about Cabrera.
    When the team is allegedly built around pitching and defense doesn't it make some sense that those topics would get a lot of airtime?

    If they've pinned their hopes to those two skillsets it'd be a bit daft to not discuss them.
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate

  10. #39
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    Re: Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?

    I don't like Chris Dickerson as a hitter. I don't think he's ever going to amount to much. But right now I think he's definitely the better option between Drew Stubbs and himself. Unless Stubbs develops into something in this season or next week need to keep looking because right now he looks like a AAAA player and despite a nice speed tool and nice build he doesn't look like a lead off hitter. He's 25 so he's not really that young either.
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  11. #40
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    The differences between Dickerson and Willy T. are that Dickerson is being paid close to the minimum, is basically on a 1 year deal and Dusty's not running him out there every day. Also, Dickerson has a history of being able to get on base at a decent clip while Willy T never did. Dickerson isn't exactly making me giddy every time he comes up to the plate but he's not Tavaras horrible. But let's not let the facts get in the way of a good rant.
    Nicely put
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