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Thread: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

  1. #31
    Member Captain Hook's Avatar
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    Sure they didn't but considering how often the number of games the Reds have won with late inning comebacks is pointed out it's at least worth noting that Pitt. won 2 of the 3 in their last at bat in walk off fashion.That series could've easily been 2 out of 3 for the Reds.

    Your right though they didn't win those games and KD is also right.If the Reds sweep the Pirates just as the Brewers and Stros have this week we'd have a winning record.1 series this year is really the whole reason for this thread(witch is appropriate by the way).Just one more reason to not rush judgement on the 2010 Cincinnati Reds.

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  3. #32
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    Realistic assessment of the baseball team depends on screening out everything except what matters, and that is who won the games. The Pirates beat us 3 out of 3. If we're going to get better, it has to start by acknowledging that.

  4. #33
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    Given that there are only 4 games separating the best record and the worse record in the NL there should certainly be more things taken into account then wins and losses at this point when assessing any team.

  5. #34
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    19 games played. And to be honest, I can't believe we're 8-11 and only 3.5 games back as bad as we've looked. This team is not as bad as they've started.

    Be thankful they are in a mediocre division that is very winnable.
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

  6. #35
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    Quote Originally Posted by GAC View Post
    19 games played. And to be honest, I can't believe we're 8-11 and only 3.5 games back as bad as we've looked. This team is not as bad as they've started.

    Be thankful they are in a mediocre division that is very winnable.
    Or be disappointed that they are in a mediocre division that is very winnable and they haven't done better.

    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  7. #36
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    This division is winnable by only one team, and that team ain't the Reds.

  8. #37
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    This division is winnable by only one team, and that team ain't the Reds.
    Right. And that team has four anchor players, two top hitters and two top starting pitchers. That's the difference.

    The young kids, the role players, the slightly-past-their-peak vets, they are all comparable. All teams have them, the Reds are as good as other teams in these departments.

    What the Reds lack are the major anchor players. The guys who are feared by the opposition. The guys who allow the others to play comfortable, complimentary roles.

    The Cards have four anchor players, two hitters, two starting pitchers. The Reds, maybe, have one in Votto. Some might argue even Votto doesn't qualify as yet.

    That's the difference IMO.

  9. #38
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Right. And that team has four anchor players, two top hitters and two top starting pitchers. That's the difference.

    The young kids, the role players, the slightly-past-their-peak vets, they are all comparable. All teams have them, the Reds are as good as other teams in these departments.

    What the Reds lack are the major anchor players. The guys who are feared by the opposition. The guys who allow the others to play comfortable, complimentary roles.

    The Cards have four anchor players, two hitters, two starting pitchers. The Reds, maybe, have one in Votto. Some might argue even Votto doesn't qualify as yet.

    That's the difference IMO.

    Precisely. Don't worry about the bottom 10% or even the middle 75%; worry about the total absence of top 15% talent.

    I'd say the Reds have two anchor hitters. Zero anchor pitchers.

  10. #39
    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    Reds at the plate, last 7 days...
    Code:
    Batting Statistics
    NAME	       GP	AB	R	H	2B	3B	HR	TB	RBI	BB	SO	SB	CS	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS
    Johnny Cueto	1	1	0	1	0	0	0	1	0	0	0	0	0	1.000	1.000	1.000	2.000
    Ryan Hanigan	4	8	1	6	2	0	0	8	2	1	1	0	0	.750	.800	1.000	1.800
    Scott Rolen	6	21	8	8	2	0	2	16	4	1	2	0	0	.381	.409	.762	1.171
    Laynce Nix	3	2	0	1	0	0	0	1	0	1	0	0	0	.500	.667	.500	1.167
    Homer Bailey	2	2	1	1	0	0	0	1	0	1	1	0	0	.500	.667	.500	1.167
    Joey Votto	6	20	3	6	1	0	2	13	6	7	6	0	1	.300	.464	.650	1.114
    Jay Bruce	6	20	7	6	2	1	1	13	4	3	5	0	0	.300	.391	.650	1.041
    Aaron Harang	1	2	0	1	0	0	0	1	1	0	1	0	0	.500	.500	.500	1.000
    Paul Janish	4	7	0	3	1	0	0	4	2	0	0	0	0	.429	.429	.571	1.000
    R. Hernandez	4	13	2	5	0	0	0	5	2	2	2	0	0	.385	.467	.385	.851
    B. Phillips	6	24	2	5	1	0	1	9	2	1	4	0	1	.208	.240	.375	.615
    O. Cabrera	5	17	2	4	0	0	0	4	5	3	1	0	0	.235	.318	.235	.553
    Drew Stubbs	6	21	3	3	0	0	0	3	1	2	6	1	1	.143	.250	.143	.393
    Jonny Gomes	5	14	2	2	0	0	0	2	2	1	1	0	1	.143	.188	.143	.330
    C. Dickerson	6	14	2	2	0	0	0	2	0	0	7	1	0	.143	.143	.143	.286
    Hanigan, Rolen, Votto, Bruce, Hernandez. All hitting very well. Janish in limited PT hitting the ball. All the rest? stink on ice. But at least it is more than just Votto and Rolen. That's a good sign.

    Here is the problem... SP the last 7 days...
    Code:
    Pitching Statistics
    NAME      	GP	GS	W	L	Sv	Hld	IP	H	ER	HR	BB	SO	K/9		WHIP	ERA
    Homer Bailey	2	2	0	0	0	0	11.1	15	9	1	4	13	10.32		1.68	7.15
    B. Arroyo	1	1	0	1	0	0	3.0	8	8	1	2	0	0.00		3.33	24.00
    Aaron Harang	1	1	0	1	0	0	5.2	10	6	1	2	2	3.18		2.12	9.53
    Johnny Cueto	1	1	0	1	0	0	6.0	7	5	2	1	5	7.50		1.33	7.50
    Mike Leake	1	1	1	0	0	0	7.0	8	5	2	1	5	6.43		1.29	6.43
    Only Bailey and Cueto have acceptable to excellent K/9 numbers, only Cueto and Leake have even close to acceptable WHIP's. Everything else blows. Like doug said, this probably won't continue, but it is absolutely why the Reds are sub .500 right now.
    Last edited by TRF; 04-26-2010 at 12:03 PM.
    Suck it up cupcake.

  11. #40
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    Some basic stats that I think summary things nicely. Ranks are NL. I'll try to provide these from time to time. Keep in mind, of course, that these are not park adjusted and so are not necessarily reflective of our skills (not that a 3 week sample would be anyways...), just the on-field results.

    Code:
    		OFFENSE				DEFENSE
    	R/G  AVG  OBP  SLG  OPS	   RA/G  BB/9  K/9  HR/9  H/9   DER 
    Value  4.58 .242 .312 .393 .705	   6.11   4.0  7.5   1.3  9.8  .672
    Rank	  9   12   15   12   12	     15    12    6    13  T13    13
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  12. #41
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    this team will likely improve but it is not anywhere near being a playoff contender. The sooner the FO figures that out the better.

    BTW, the DER should be extremely troubling to anyone associated with the team.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

  13. #42
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    Note, on the Cardinals comparison, that one place we thought to be a comparative strength for us--the latter part of the rotation--is quickly turning into a decided place of comparative strength for the Cardinals. Check out what Brad Penny's doing. He'd easily be our "ace."

  14. #43
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    Check out what Brad Penny's doing. He'd easily be our "ace."
    Yeah. I'd say the Reds, if anything, have placed entirely too much faith in young arms with serious warts on their record. Acquiring Brad Penny-types should be nearly automatic for a struggling squad like the Reds; instead, we let the frontrunners grab him. I get "schooled" all the time about being "silly" and "unrealistic" about grabbing the brass ring with guys like Halladay, but what's the excuse for not getting an inexpensive fireballer with some injury warts like Penny?

  15. #44
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    what's the excuse for not getting an inexpensive fireballer with some injury warts like Penny?
    Cards gave him 7.5 million.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

  16. #45
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    Re: Step back from the ledge Reds fans

    Quote Originally Posted by lollipopcurve View Post
    Cards gave him 7.5 million.
    Hernandez 3.5 million

    +

    Gomes 800,000

    +

    Cabrera 3 million

    =

    There's your answer.


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