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Thread: Attendance issues

  1. #31
    We Need Our Myths reds1869's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    And staunchly German in their approach to spending on entertainment too. I've never heard a fan base focus on cost more than the Reds fans, a team that has some of the cheapest tickets around, in any sport.
    Maybe that's why I don't get it...I'm just too darn English. The complaining about cost has always baffled me, especially after living in several cities where entertainment was more expensive.

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  3. #32
    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    As far as eating at the ballpark, any more, we take our own stuff in.

    Stop at Biggs and buy a big bag of peanuts and a bag of Twizzlers, stop at Subway and get $5 subs and split them, stop at AmeriStop and everyone gets 2 bottles of some kind of pop, and we take it all into the park in a soft-sided cooler. Spend maybe a total of $20 for 4 people. I'm a cheap sob.

    We still buy beer at the ballpark, but I don't swill down the suds like I used to and I usually drive, some may 1 time out of 3 I'll have 1-2 beers. That cost has gotten silly too so I just don't pay it.

    Time is the killer for me as well. I just don't have that many free evenings. I'd like to go to more games but there are a lot of things I'd like to do more of but just don't have the time for.

    Pay attention to the open sky

  4. #33
    Member Sea Ray's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Roy Tucker View Post
    Cincinnati fans have always been fickle.
    I don't agree with that. Since 2000, this team has drawn over 2 million fans 6 times. Given the product they've been served, I think Cincinnati fans have been remarkably generous. What you're seeing today is a combination of the economy and of fans saying enough is enough and I can't blame 'em. They've really been very patient IMO.

  5. #34
    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Ray View Post
    I don't agree with that. Since 2000, this team has drawn over 2 million fans 6 times. Given the product they've been served, I think Cincinnati fans have been remarkably generous. What you're seeing today is a combination of the economy and of fans saying enough is enough and I can't blame 'em. They've really been very patient IMO.
    Compared to other clubs, its been pretty shabby since 2000. Cincy fans turn out only after the club does well.

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/te...N/attend.shtml

    Pay attention to the open sky

  6. #35
    The Future is Now Ghosts of 1990's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    My problem is being in Columbus, I get off work in CBUS at 5 at the earliest... Two hour drive; how can we swing it? But when I can sneak off work early, I can usually slip there around 5 to 10 times a year.

    This year my goal is to get to 20 games if this team deserves it or is MILDLY interesting. When I lived in Cincinnati for two summers I made it to about 30 games on a college kid's wages. So I'm going to up my support for the team this year and see if I can get out to 20 starting with the next homestand. We'll see.
    2009 Attendance Record: 3-5
    2010 Attendance Record: 2-9
    2011 Attendance Record: 3-4
    2012 Attendance Record: 3-4
    2013 Attendance Record: 5-2

  7. #36
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Roy Tucker View Post
    Compared to other clubs, its been pretty shabby since 2000. Cincy fans turn out only after the club does well.

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/te...N/attend.shtml
    This is the truth and has been discussed numerous times, anyone still trying to paint the city as a great baseball town must not include the attendance for the pro team.

  8. #37
    Member Sea Ray's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Roy Tucker View Post
    Compared to other clubs, its been pretty shabby since 2000. Cincy fans turn out only after the club does well.

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/te...N/attend.shtml
    Well the team has been pretty shabby too.

    I agree that Reds fans turn out when the team does well but that doesn't differentiate them from any other team. What's wrong with not spending money on an inferior product? I think Reds fans would be foolish to turn out in excess of 2 mill a year for this product. Ditto for the Bengals. Idiotic fans continued to buy tickets year after year and it was only after a mass exodus that Mike Brown brought in Marvin Lewis.

    Kansas City had 11K fans last night. Other than George Bush Sr, I didn't see many fans in Houston last night either. I think it's unfair to single out Cincinnati as only coming out when it gets a winner.

    Attendance problems in Cincinnati are on ownership

  9. #38
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    This is the truth and has been discussed numerous times, anyone still trying to paint the city as a great baseball town must not include the attendance for the pro team.
    Honestly I don't know if it's a great baseball town anymore. In fact I fear that all this losing has cost the Reds a generation of fans. Unless they start winning we'll never know

  10. #39
    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Detroit has a worse economy than Cincinnati, and still draw well. Yes they have some recent success, a WS appearance in 2006, but considering just how bad things have been in Detroit, to get 3 million people to show up for a 5th place team amazes me. (2008)
    Suck it up cupcake.

  11. #40
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Roy Tucker View Post
    Compared to other clubs, its been pretty shabby since 2000. Cincy fans turn out only after the club does well.

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/te...N/attend.shtml

    Yeah. The gold standard is no longer 2 million. It's 3 million which every team in our division except PIT has drawn at least once. Then there's a good news bad news scenario. The good news is that the Reds ticket prices are relatively inexpensive compared to other teams. The bad news is that when the Reds struggling to draw 2 million and their closest competitors are drawing 3 million, even if the ticket prices are the same, they aren't making the revenue that their competitors are and it's even less since ticket prices are so low.
    The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.

    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Rally-...24872650873160

  12. #41
    Raaaaaaaandy guttle11's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by TRF View Post
    Detroit has a worse economy than Cincinnati, and still draw well. Yes they have some recent success, a WS appearance in 2006, but considering just how bad things have been in Detroit, to get 3 million people to show up for a 5th place team amazes me. (2008)
    The economy is not to blame for anything. It's bad, but there are still many sports fans that can afford to go to games. Detroit was one game from the playoffs just last year. That team wins, and people pay for winners. The Tigers draw, but the Lions can't pay people to get them in the door, and the NFL is king in 'Merica.

    In Cincy the Bengals can sell out every game for 6 years with only a few exceptions where they needed corporate help. Why? The Bengals either win (2 division titles in the Marvin era) or they give the illusion of hope (three 8-8 seasons). The Reds (losers for a decade) can only draw on Opening Day or bobblehead night.

    Good economy, bad economy...people find ways to pay to see a winner, and ways not to pay for a loser.
    Last edited by guttle11; 04-28-2010 at 11:31 AM.
    "I saw Wedding Crashers accidentally. I bought a ticket for Grizzly Man and went into the wrong theater. After an hour, I figured I was in the wrong theater, but I kept waiting. Thatís the thing about bear attacks. They come when you least expect it."-Dwight K. Schrute

  13. #42
    Member Sea Ray's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by TRF View Post
    Detroit has a worse economy than Cincinnati, and still draw well. Yes they have some recent success, a WS appearance in 2006, but considering just how bad things have been in Detroit, to get 3 million people to show up for a 5th place team amazes me. (2008)
    I am very familiar with Detroit and I find myself there often, in fact I went to a Tigers game last year and got tickets for a Saturday game 24 hrs prior and got great seats behind home plate.

    The hype for 2008 built up the team as a contender for the World Series. Obviously it didn't work out that way but the tickets were already sold.

    There's still plenty of money around Detroit. Don't go by what you see in the city. Go take a drive around the suburbs like Grosse Pointe, Birmingham and Farmington Hills. The Red Wings have very expensive tickets and they're hard to get.

    The Tigers have a payroll of $122mill. It'd be interesting to see what our attendance would be here in Cincinnati if Cast added $50mill to the payroll

  14. #43
    Member Sea Ray's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    Yeah. The gold standard is no longer 2 million. It's 3 million which every team in our division except PIT has drawn at least once. Then there's a good news bad news scenario. The good news is that the Reds ticket prices are relatively inexpensive compared to other teams. The bad news is that when the Reds struggling to draw 2 million and their closest competitors are drawing 3 million, even if the ticket prices are the same, they aren't making the revenue that their competitors are and it's even less since ticket prices are so low.
    You're right, in recent history 3 mill is the goal and in recent history every team in the division has gone to the playoffs except Pitt and Cin. See a pattern there?

  15. #44
    Score Early, Score Often gonelong's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    And staunchly German in their approach to spending on entertainment too. I've never heard a fan base focus on cost more than the Reds fans, a team that has some of the cheapest tickets around, in any sport.
    I'll split hairs with you.

    While they might be saying costs, IMO, they are thinking value. It's not that they simply can't afford a ticket, it's that the perceived return isn't worth the investment.

    A lot of people aren't at the ballpark to simply watch the game. They have a rooting interest, and to many it seems, an extension of their self-worth associated with the outcome. They'll pay more for a perceived winner (value) than they will for a perceived loser.

    You can see this with UC Football, the Bengals, tOSU football. When you are doing well, people will shell out the dough and the costs is either not a concern anymore, or at the very least, not an obstacle for the masses.

    When the Bengals were losing 12 games a season, people literally put extra tickets (couldn't get any buddys to tag along) on their windshield for others to take free of charge, and they'd be there after the game, untouched. Free is not too expensive.

    When there is a reason to get to the park, people go. They Reds have been lousy at giving many a reason to get to the park.

    In the last two weeks I have attended a TBALL game, a coach pitch game, a kid pitch game, a JR game, a minor league game (Dragons), and caught a bit of a college practice. I have played catch in the back yard with my son and two different neighbors.

    I like baseball, I seek it out. I read about it, I play catch, I coach, I watch. I follow their team, I listen to or watch their games, etc. I ought to about as easy a sell for the Reds organization as there is and they can't get me to go more than twice a year.

    I think this is where the Reds organization completely misses the boat. They seem to always be focused on the cost of the game instead of the value.

    GL

  16. #45
    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
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    Re: Attendance issues

    Quote Originally Posted by gonelong View Post
    I think this is where the Reds organization completely misses the boat. They seem to always be focused on the cost of the game instead of the value.
    That's because cutting costs is easy. Building value is hard.

    Any pudding-brained middle manager can get out the chain saw and whack staff, budget, product, costs, etc etc. Lord knows we've seen enough of that lately. But building a business (i.e. value) takes real skill and acumen.

    Pay attention to the open sky


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