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Thread: -36

  1. #1
    Brett William Moore Will M's Avatar
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    -36

    We've all seen it with our own eyes night after night. This is Cabrera's actual UZR/150 number.

    For comparison in 2008 Keppinger was at -15. He was bad. Cabrera is unbelievably bad. I'd say inconceivably bad but its the Reds.

    How long will this go on?
    .

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  3. #2
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    Re: -36

    It will go on. He hasn't been brought in to sit.

    I agree that he's really struggling out there. Doesn't look major league any more. I'm hoping that Baker will at least give Janish a start every 5 days -- preferably when groundballer Leake pitches.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

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    Re: -36

    But he has a better bat than Janish and is a savvy veteran so he will play on a team that needs offense as badly as this one.

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    Re: -36

    Can he play LF?

  6. #5
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: -36

    Good to see the whipping boy trophy land in OC's locker.

    Good times...

  7. #6
    Member membengal's Avatar
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    Re: -36

    Yeah, stupid stats being unfair to Orlando Cabrera.

  8. #7
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: -36

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    Yeah, stupid stats being unfair to Orlando Cabrera.
    He's a moving target (albeit he moves so slow compared to the past)

  9. #8
    Member membengal's Avatar
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    Re: -36

    Stupid reds fans for wondering if there is a better way, particularly on a team that has sold itself as being built on defense to its fanbase.

  10. #9
    Member OnBaseMachine's Avatar
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    Re: -36

    The 2009 Reds finished with a team DER of .705, 4th best in all of baseball. The 2010 Reds have a team DER of .673, 26th in baseball. That's a huge difference. Left field and shortstop have really killed the defense, and even Stubbs has made a couple bad plays in CF, but he'll be fine, IMO. His range in CF is incredible.
    I miss Adam Dunn.

  11. #10
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: -36

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    Stupid reds fans for wondering if there is a better way, particularly on a team that has sold itself as being built on defense to its fanbase.
    Yes silly monkeys aren't they?

    We can't seem to find a SS since Barry left, and IMO the ones we have now ain't the replacement.

    Hardest position on the field to fill and the Reds keep failing. My take is any metric can tell you what we all see, Janish is a better fielder than OC. I also know that it likely is going to stay the way it is, -36 or not.

  12. #11
    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: -36

    Maybe it's just me but it seems like Cabrera rarely gets a good first step. Hard to tell on TV but he looks painfully slow to the ball when moving laterally. He's seems OK going in though.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  13. #12
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: -36

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    Maybe it's just me but it seems like Cabrera rarely gets a good first step. Hard to tell on TV but he looks painfully slow to the ball when moving laterally. He's seems OK going in though.
    TV for scouting baseball defense is what Guitar Hero is to making music

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    Re: -36

    He's a moving target (albeit he moves so slow compared to the past)
    The criticism of his defense is not undeserved. I had no preconceptions re: his glove coming into the season -- I thought maybe he'd been a victim of poor field conditions in Oakland or the fast turf in Minnesota. But I have to say he has looked very limited out there. Poor range, old-guy athleticism. He's made 1 challenging play that I've seen. The rest have been simply routine. And so many grounders have gone by just out of his reach. The arm looks below average too, though accurate. He's really going to have to hit to be an asset over the course of the season. I like his intangibles, for sure, but that only goes so far, especially if the player is not playing well.

    Still early, and he may be able to get his sea legs under him yet. Or, if Dusty runs him out there every day like a 25 year old, it could get worse.

    Defense at SS is not an insignificant thing. And so far this team has been lacking in that department.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

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    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: -36

    Quote Originally Posted by lollipopcurve View Post
    The criticism of his defense is not undeserved. I had no preconceptions re: his glove coming into the season -- I thought maybe he'd been a victim of poor field conditions in Oakland or the fast turf in Minnesota. But I have to say he has looked very limited out there. Poor range, old-guy athleticism. He's made 1 challenging play that I've seen. The rest have been simply routine. And so many grounders have gone by just out of his reach. The arm looks below average too, though accurate. He's really going to have to hit to be an asset over the course of the season. I like his intangibles, for sure, but that only goes so far, especially if the player is not playing well.

    Still early, and he may be able to get his sea legs under him yet. Or, if Dusty runs him out there every day like a 25 year old, it could get worse.

    Defense at SS is not an insignificant thing. And so far this team has been lacking in that department.
    Or he could get hurt, which is probably more likely than he being benched for his limited range. I see some egos involved in this decision, OC's, Walts and Dusty, any resolution will be slow as molasses.

  16. #15
    Member Sea Ray's Avatar
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    Re: -36

    Quote Originally Posted by Will M View Post
    We've all seen it with our own eyes night after night. This is Cabrera's actual UZR/150 number.

    For comparison in 2008 Keppinger was at -15. He was bad. Cabrera is unbelievably bad. I'd say inconceivably bad but its the Reds.

    How long will this go on?
    I take two points from that.

    1) I'd like to see Janish get more starts, especially while he's "hitting"

    2) Keppinger wasn't as bad as RZ made him out to be. He didn't deserve the mountains of criticism he got around here because actually, we could have done a lot worse, as we now see
    Last edited by Sea Ray; 05-04-2010 at 10:55 AM.


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