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Thread: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

  1. #31
    Member membengal's Avatar
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    OBM, first ONE HIT shutout since Smiley in '96.

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  3. #32
    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Eh. I fully expect Bailey to perform CPR on the Pirates' offense tomorrow.
    As much as I hate to admit it I'd agree. I'm split on these 2 and have said before Cueto has a shot to be good, Bailey has a much less chance IMO. He looked great for a stretch last season but he is often too hittable. I think he can remain a starter but I doubt he is ever anything more than a #3 or 4 starter at best.
    "You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one."

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  4. #33
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    OBM, first ONE HIT shutout since Smiley in '96.
    That's what I meant. My bad. Thanks.
    I miss Adam Dunn.

  5. #34
    Socratic Gadfly TheNext44's Avatar
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    This is going to sound absurd after a 1 hitter, but not only do I still stand by my original premise that the Reds can't win with both Cueto and Bailey in the rotation, but I am even more convinced after tonight.

    Cueto looked great... in the pitcher friendly stadium on a cold and rainy night against a terrible team. I counted at least a half a dozen deep fly balls that most likely would have gotten out in GABP on a normal day.

    Now Cueto helped himself by not walking anyone and only giving up one hit. But that's because he knew he could pump his fastball in for strikes and not get hurt. My issue is that he can't have that approach when he pitches in GABP, and history tells us that he doesn't. He will give up homers if he does, and he has when he does. I hope I am wrong, but I see do not Cueto succeeding in the games that he pitches at home, at least not as much as he does on the road.

    And just one more time for clarity, I am not saying that Cueto is the same pitcher as Bailey, just that they both are not built for GABP, and it is hurting their development. I think it is time for the Reds to trade one of them and start building a rotation with guys like Arroyo and Leake instead of Bailey and Cueto.
    "Imagination is more important than knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

  6. #35
    Socratic Gadfly TheNext44's Avatar
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    Both guys are talented. Some talented guys make it, others don't. But I know I'd rather be given innings and opportunities to talented, young pitchers than mediocre vets with no upside. It's frustrating, but this is just how it goes by-and-large.
    So that's the only option? Homer Bailey or Kip Wells?

    My argument is that it is time for the Reds to build a starting staff that can survive GABP. There are lots of good above average starting pitchers who throw more ground balls than flyballs. The Reds rotation should have as many of those guys as possible.

    The Reds are contending this year, the time to be concerned with just "giving innings" to guys is over. It's time to get players that help the team win now.
    "Imagination is more important than knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

  7. #36
    Member Tom Servo's Avatar
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNext44 View Post
    This is going to sound absurd after a 1 hitter, but not only do I still stand by my original premise that the Reds can't win with both Cueto and Bailey in the rotation, but I am even more convinced after tonight.

    Cueto looked great... in the pitcher friendly stadium on a cold and rainy night against a terrible team. I counted at least a half a dozen deep fly balls that most likely would have gotten out in GABP on a normal day.

    Now Cueto helped himself by not walking anyone and only giving up one hit. But that's because he knew he could pump his fastball in for strikes and not get hurt. My issue is that he can't have that approach when he pitches in GABP, and history tells us that he doesn't. He will give up homers if he does, and he has when he does. I hope I am wrong, but I see do not Cueto succeeding in the games that he pitches at home, at least not as much as he does on the road.

    And just one more time for clarity, I am not saying that Cueto is the same pitcher as Bailey, just that they both are not built for GABP, and it is hurting their development. I think it is time for the Reds to trade one of them and start building a rotation with guys like Arroyo and Leake instead of Bailey and Cueto.
    C'mon, don't be that guy.
    "Since I've been with the Reds in 1989, we've never had a farm system this loaded," Bowden said. "If we were the New York Yankees and had unlimited dollars, we could have traded for Colon, (Jeff) Weaver, Rolen, (Cliff) Floyd, (Kenny) Rogers and Finley and gotten them all -- and still held onto our top five prospects. That's an amazing statement."

  8. #37
    Member Cedric's Avatar
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    C'mon, don't be that guy.
    Why live in the present and be happy for Cueto? That's not as fun as being "right" IF Cueto fails later.
    This is the time. The real Reds organization is back.

  9. #38
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNext44 View Post
    This is going to sound absurd after a 1 hitter, but not only do I still stand by my original premise that the Reds can't win with both Cueto and Bailey in the rotation, but I am even more convinced after tonight.

    Cueto looked great... in the pitcher friendly stadium on a cold and rainy night against a terrible team. I counted at least a half a dozen deep fly balls that most likely would have gotten out in GABP on a normal day.
    Alrighty then, Captain Buzzkill.

  10. #39
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Cueto was great tonight. A little bleeder the only hit. I say this team can win with these two pitchers, but in tandem with Arroyo, Harang, and a man name Leake.
    And This One Belongs to the REDS!!!

  11. #40
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Whole starting staff has been coming around very nicely for the last 15 games (even, to some degree, Bailey). I'm starting to think we've got something in Bryan Price.

  12. #41
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    Whole starting staff has been coming around very nicely for the last 15 games (even, to some degree, Bailey). I'm starting to think we've got something in Bryan Price.
    Agreed. If the staff keeps adjusting like they have been, we might have something here.... finally.
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  13. #42
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    Whole starting staff has been coming around very nicely for the last 15 games (even, to some degree, Bailey). I'm starting to think we've got something in Bryan Price.
    I'm still pondering the Arizona Spring Training conspiracy
    Baseball is like church. Many attend, few understand

  14. #43
    The Future is Now Ghosts of 1990's Avatar
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    Whole starting staff has been coming around very nicely for the last 15 games (even, to some degree, Bailey). I'm starting to think we've got something in Bryan Price.
    Show me 15 or 30 more of about the same stretch and I'd fully agree.

    I saw this staff put together plenty of runs like this under a man named Richard M. Pole
    2009 Attendance Record: 3-5 2010 Attendance Record: 2-9
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  15. #44
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Quote Originally Posted by reds44 View Post
    Yeah, Bailey and Cueto don't belong in the same sentence.
    I just don't get this. Look at their last 3 outings from the thread Brutus posted. Johnny had one great outing in there while Homer had one bad outing in there. Otherwise, they were nearly identical. A handful of poor outing in the beginning of the season from a young kid is NOT enough to earn the kind of lambasting he's gotten in this thread. Everyone is so quick to dismiss Homer's second half last year due to a couple poor outings. Fickle crowd.

    (this wasn't at you specifically reds44...just in general about the quick triggers around here)
    Chapman to the rotation!!!! Do it already!!!!

  16. #45
    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: Can The Reds Win With Bailey and Cueto?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNext44 View Post
    y argument is that it is time for the Reds to build a starting staff that can survive GABP. There are lots of good above average starting pitchers who throw more ground balls than flyballs. The Reds rotation should have as many of those guys as possible.

    The Reds are contending this year, the time to be concerned with just "giving innings" to guys is over. It's time to get players that help the team win now.
    High five!
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"


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