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Thread: Bill Bray

  1. #31
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    If Bray means I don't have to see DRH pitch again this season then bring him up ASAP.

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  3. #32
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    So much Danny Ray hate around here recently. He's not been great, but he's not been horrible either.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  4. #33
    Member forfreelin04's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    So much Danny Ray hate around here recently. He's not been great, but he's not been horrible either.
    I think its more hate directed at the middle relief in general. Danny Ray just happened to join the posse.

    Everyone knows its the biggest weakness on the team and everybody is afraid by the time its fixed; it will be too late.

    10 years of losing does that to a fanbase.

  5. #34
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    So much Danny Ray hate around here recently. He's not been great, but he's not been horrible either.
    Not hate so much as fatigue. And yes, he's been horrible.

  6. #35
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    So much Danny Ray hate around here recently. He's not been great, but he's not been horrible either.
    He isn't getting the job done. He may be put in high leverage situations, but he isn't being successful. In a results driven business DRH is failing.

  7. #36
    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Danny Ray is arguably the 2nd or 3rd best reliever on the team.

    I'm not sure if that's something to feel good or bad about.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  8. #37
    Red's fan mbgrayson's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynRedz View Post
    Not hate so much as fatigue. And yes, he's been horrible.
    Agreed.

    DRH has a 1.62 WHIP rate this year, up from 1.41 last year. It's true that he has a .382 BABIP rate, up from .309 last year, but lots of balls are falling for hits partly because the line drive rate is so much higher. Last year, his line drive rate was 20.4%, this year it is 28.8%. Opposing batters are squaring up Herrera's pitches much better than last year.

    Meanwhile DRH's K rate is down from 6.42 batters/ 9 innings to only 5.19 batters per 9. His ground ball rate has fallen from 50% to 40% this year. (DRH detailed stats are HERE.)

    Final result = DRH has been very hittable this year.

    I too would love to see Bray given a shot. I wonder what kind of velocity he has had in the minors this year? Tommy John pitchers often can gain a mph or two after surgery...how hard is Bray throwing? I don't see that the minor league version of GameDay shows pitch velocity.
    Last edited by mbgrayson; 06-14-2010 at 04:31 PM.
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  9. #38
    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Quote Originally Posted by mbgrayson View Post
    Agreed.

    DRH has a 1.62 WHIP rate this year, up from 1.41 last year. It's true that he has a .382 BABIP rate, up from .309 last year, but lots of balls are falling for hits partly because the line drive rate is so much higher. Last year, his line drive rate was 20.4%, this year it is 28.8%. Opposing batters are squaring up Herrera's pitches much better than last year.

    Meanwhile DRH's K rate is down from 6.42 batters/ 9 innings to only 5.19 batters per 9. His ground ball rate has fallen from 50% to 40% this year. (DRH detailed stats are HERE.)

    Final result = DRH has been very hittable this year.

    I too would love to see Bray given a shot. I wonder what kind of velocity he has had in the minors this year? Tommy John pitchers often can gain a mph or two after surgery...how hard is Bray throwing? I don't see that the minor league version of GameDay shows pitch velocity.
    Even with all that, he's still the 2nd or 3rd best reliever on the team.

    Not good.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  10. #39
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    Even with all that, he's still the 2nd or 3rd best reliever on the team.

    Not good.
    I put him in a tie for 5th with Masset.

    1. Rhodes
    2. Cordero
    3. Owings
    4. Ondrusek
    5 & 6. Herrera and Masset
    7. Del Rosario

    5, 6, & 7 need replaced ASAP. 3 and 4 need to be on a short leash. 1 and 2 need some rest.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  11. #40
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I put him in a tie for 5th with Masset.

    1. Rhodes
    2. Cordero
    3. Owings
    4. Ondrusek
    5 & 6. Herrera and Masset
    7. Del Rosario

    5, 6, & 7 need replaced ASAP. 3 and 4 need to be on a short leash. 1 and 2 need some rest.
    Herrera is better than Ondrusek and has proven a lot more than Ondrusek by a landslide. It's not really even close.

  12. #41
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Yeah, his LD% is up and so his BABIP is inflated too. But even with that, he has exceptional walk and homer rates. His ERA is just over 4.00. His FIP is closer to 3.00. And yet people want to ship him out?

    I'm not pitching the guy in high leverage situations, but there's no way he belongs in AAA.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  13. #42
    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I put him in a tie for 5th with Masset.

    1. Rhodes
    2. Cordero
    3. Owings
    4. Ondrusek
    5 & 6. Herrera and Masset
    7. Del Rosario

    5, 6, & 7 need replaced ASAP. 3 and 4 need to be on a short leash. 1 and 2 need some rest.
    The problem I have with Owings is that he's walking over 6 cats per 9. He could be the 4th best guy but his FIP and xFIP are still over a run higher than Dr. H's.

    Ondrusek I could buy but I need to see the brother more. He's certainly not blowing hitters away. Unless the wind from their long balls deflects into their faces.

    Masset might need hypnosis...no idea there.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  14. #43
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Quote Originally Posted by fearofpopvol1 View Post
    Herrera is better than Ondrusek and has proven a lot more than Ondrusek by a landslide. It's not really even close.
    If I were managing a game tomorrow and had to get a guy out to preserve the lead and Herrera and Ondrusek were my only choices, Herrera doesn't come close to getting in the game. At this point, he isn't throwing well and just doesn't get guys out. I don't really care what they did last year or even last month.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  15. #44
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    If I were managing a game tomorrow and had to get a guy out to preserve the lead and Herrera and Ondrusek were my only choices, Herrera doesn't come close to getting in the game. At this point, he isn't throwing well and just doesn't get guys out. I don't really care what they did last year or even last month.
    So Ondrusek has a good 2-3 appearances and all of a sudden he is reliable and we should ignore his past?

    I guess we should ignore Ondrusek's minor league career WHIP of 1.372 and his career 4.09 ERA? In Cincy, he has a ERA+ of 55 and a WHIP of 1.816 in 15 appearances.

    Ondrusek could contribute at The Show, but to put him ahead of Herrera and Masset based on 2-3 decent appearances is shortsighted at best.

    Herrera has a career ERA+ of 119 and a WHIP of 1.483 at The Show by the way.

  16. #45
    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
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    Re: Bill Bray

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    So much Danny Ray hate around here recently. He's not been great, but he's not been horrible either.
    Ugh yeah he has been horrible the guy is a batting tee when he gets it in the zone. 25 hits in 17 IP amongst other poor stats. The only good thing is he has been reluctant to walk people yet his WHIP still remains high at 1.615 with an ERA over 4. I fully get the LD% is high but it's high because he isn't fooling anyone anymore IMO. Just because he has a lot of company and he is far from the worst doesn't mean he isn't bad.
    "You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one."

    --Woody Hayes


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